Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ugh, I hate this story so much. I'm so sure he killed her.

It’s a super sad story. Take a look at the actual evidence and you won’t be sure he killed her.

1. How did Sam break down the door (as he claimed), without breaking the lock per the crime scene photos?
2. He claims he returned from the gym at 6pm but only texted Ellen for 20 minutes trying to get her to open the door. He didn't break the door down until 6:40 (according to him) - where was he the rest of the time?
3. There is zero evidence he actually went to the gym as he claimed - no video footage and no witnesses
4. Some of her wounds barely bled at all, indicating they were inflicted post mortem and the blood spatter is consistent with suicide as well.

Summary of evidence and ME report:

1. Ellen suffered “severe” anxiety over her first-grade teaching job at the time of her death. She was being treated by a psychiatrist for approximately two months. Bottles for alprazolam, clonazepam, and zolpidem prescribed to Ellen were recovered from a bedside table on the evening of her death.
2. While calling the “distribution of the 23 stab wounds admittedly unusual,” Ellen would be capable of self-inflicting all these injuries -- even those to the back of her head and neck, the report concluded.
3. least 8 shallow stab wounds “would best be categorized as hesitation wounds” – an indication of suicide by stabbing. The review identified at least three more of this type of wound, upping the total number of stab wounds Ellen sustained from 20 to 23.
4. Ellen sustained no defensive injuries, which are a tell-tale sign of being attacked by an assailant. The 31 contusions or bruises found on Ellen’s body aren’t consistent with “intentional infliction by another.” Most of the bruises were in the process of healing. Their distribution is consistent with “incidental contact sustained during activities of daily living, including her work as a first-grade teacher,” the report concluded.
5.There was no evidence to indicate Ellen was incapacitated or incapable of defending herself, something that would explain the noted lack of defensive wounds.
6.The DNA of Ellen’s live-in fiancé, Sam Goldberg, wasn’t detected on the knife used to inflict her injuries.
7. Goldberg’s self-reported timeline of events on the afternoon and evening of Ellen’s death is corroborated by phone logs, text messages, surveillance footage, keycard swipes and police interviews.
8.There’s no evidence Ellen was in an abusive relationship with Goldberg. A review of their text messages showed the two were often separated due to his work travel. There were no texts where Ellen mentioned hostility or mistreatment, and she never expressed fearing him, the report states.
9. There was no evidence of a third party being in the apartment on the day of Ellen’s death, nor was anyone else’s DNA detected on the knife used to stab Ellen to death.
10. No findings of a struggle were present at the scene.

Anonymous wrote:^blood spatter is INconsistent with suicide (as in the the "cast off" from the knife is not correct for a suicide and corroborates the theory of some of the wounds being inflicted after her death.

What blood splatter? The scene was not preserved as we all know

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ugh, I hate this story so much. I'm so sure he killed her.

It’s a super sad story. Take a look at the actual evidence and you won’t be sure he killed her.

1. How did Sam break down the door (as he claimed), without breaking the lock per the crime scene photos?
2. He claims he returned from the gym at 6pm but only texted Ellen for 20 minutes trying to get her to open the door. He didn't break the door down until 6:40 (according to him) - where was he the rest of the time?
3. There is zero evidence he actually went to the gym as he claimed - no video footage and no witnesses
4. Some of her wounds barely bled at all, indicating they were inflicted post mortem and the blood spatter is consistent with suicide as well.

1. The door was broken as seen in photos of the scene
2. Knocking on the door, texting her repeatedly, going to the doorman for assistance as seen on video.
3. There is video evidence of him leaving and returning to the apartment at the times he claimed. The gym didn’t have video, so that means he’s a murderer?!
4. They were hesitation wounds not deep cuts

^blood spatter is INconsistent with suicide (as in the the "cast off" from the knife is not correct for a suicide and corroborates the theory of some of the wounds being inflicted after her death.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ugh, I hate this story so much. I'm so sure he killed her.

It’s a super sad story. Take a look at the actual evidence and you won’t be sure he killed her.

1. How did Sam break down the door (as he claimed), without breaking the lock per the crime scene photos?
2. He claims he returned from the gym at 6pm but only texted Ellen for 20 minutes trying to get her to open the door. He didn't break the door down until 6:40 (according to him) - where was he the rest of the time?
3. There is zero evidence he actually went to the gym as he claimed - no video footage and no witnesses
4. Some of her wounds barely bled at all, indicating they were inflicted post mortem and the blood spatter is consistent with suicide as well.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ER doc here. Taken care of many DV victims, more than one self-inflicted stab wound patient. Wounds in this case are too many, too deep, for a person to complete them all autonomously. You can either get a ton in that are superficial or one or two big ones. Not both. He killed her.

Nope. And don’t believe you are an ER doc. And if you are, you haven’t read the ME report and have no real expertise. Most were not deep, they were hesitation wounds which is common. and also, there were no defensive wounds.

The wish washy, flip floppy ME?

Again, you obviously haven’t delved into the actual facts

You are clearly a Sam Stan. He new wife perhaps? MIL? Here are just a few issues with the new report:

"It includes false claims like the assertion that a stab wound in Ellen’s spinal column was made during the autopsy, a theory rejected by every credible expert, including the City’s own neuropathologist," Podraza said in a statement.

"By ignoring key evidence that contradicts suicide, the extensive 3D photogrammetry, a recreation which proves Ellen could not self-inflict all the wounds, unexplained bruises, missing surveillance footage, an intact lock, accounts of a toxic relationship," he said.

Omg this guy is an ADVOCATE. not an unbiased person. Most of what he says is misleading.

I feel bad for her parents. Clearly their own guilt on how they treated their daughter is driving this. Shame on this lawyer for continuing to take their money

What specifically is misleading about what he said? I'm still waiting for anyone to refute anything he said with a fact.

I do not have the time to explain the obvious to you. You cannot use a sound bite from a lawyer as fact. I’m a lawyer, I should know!

Give us the sound bite then. He couldn't have killed her because....

We'll wait.

Please see the pages of explanations above. If you are the poster who keeps making erroneous claims, it is very obvious that you are not familiar with the facts and evidence, you are only familiar with the packaged spin that you have consumed. You are not interested in changing your mind so I will not waste my time any further explaining this death to you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ER doc here. Taken care of many DV victims, more than one self-inflicted stab wound patient. Wounds in this case are too many, too deep, for a person to complete them all autonomously. You can either get a ton in that are superficial or one or two big ones. Not both. He killed her.

Nope. And don’t believe you are an ER doc. And if you are, you haven’t read the ME report and have no real expertise. Most were not deep, they were hesitation wounds which is common. and also, there were no defensive wounds.

The wish washy, flip floppy ME?

Again, you obviously haven’t delved into the actual facts

You are clearly a Sam Stan. He new wife perhaps? MIL? Here are just a few issues with the new report:

"It includes false claims like the assertion that a stab wound in Ellen’s spinal column was made during the autopsy, a theory rejected by every credible expert, including the City’s own neuropathologist," Podraza said in a statement.

"By ignoring key evidence that contradicts suicide, the extensive 3D photogrammetry, a recreation which proves Ellen could not self-inflict all the wounds, unexplained bruises, missing surveillance footage, an intact lock, accounts of a toxic relationship," he said.

Omg this guy is an ADVOCATE. not an unbiased person. Most of what he says is misleading.

I feel bad for her parents. Clearly their own guilt on how they treated their daughter is driving this. Shame on this lawyer for continuing to take their money

What specifically is misleading about what he said? I'm still waiting for anyone to refute anything he said with a fact.

I do not have the time to explain the obvious to you. You cannot use a sound bite from a lawyer as fact. I’m a lawyer, I should know!

Give us the sound bite then. He couldn't have killed her because....

We'll wait.

Anonymous wrote:Ugh, I hate this story so much. I'm so sure he killed her.

It’s a super sad story. Take a look at the actual evidence and you won’t be sure he killed her.

Ugh, I hate this story so much. I'm so sure he killed her.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ER doc here. Taken care of many DV victims, more than one self-inflicted stab wound patient. Wounds in this case are too many, too deep, for a person to complete them all autonomously. You can either get a ton in that are superficial or one or two big ones. Not both. He killed her.

Nope. And don’t believe you are an ER doc. And if you are, you haven’t read the ME report and have no real expertise. Most were not deep, they were hesitation wounds which is common. and also, there were no defensive wounds.

The wish washy, flip floppy ME?

Again, you obviously haven’t delved into the actual facts

You are clearly a Sam Stan. He new wife perhaps? MIL? Here are just a few issues with the new report:

"It includes false claims like the assertion that a stab wound in Ellen’s spinal column was made during the autopsy, a theory rejected by every credible expert, including the City’s own neuropathologist," Podraza said in a statement.

"By ignoring key evidence that contradicts suicide, the extensive 3D photogrammetry, a recreation which proves Ellen could not self-inflict all the wounds, unexplained bruises, missing surveillance footage, an intact lock, accounts of a toxic relationship," he said.

Omg this guy is an ADVOCATE. not an unbiased person. Most of what he says is misleading.

I feel bad for her parents. Clearly their own guilt on how they treated their daughter is driving this. Shame on this lawyer for continuing to take their money

What specifically is misleading about what he said? I'm still waiting for anyone to refute anything he said with a fact.

I do not have the time to explain the obvious to you. You cannot use a sound bite from a lawyer as fact. I’m a lawyer, I should know!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I cannot believe people doubt guy murdered her v suicide. Motives: DA, she wanted to leave, family if guilty party politically well connected to cover up.

Maybe 1, 2, 3, 4 things that are inconclusive points to possibility of suicide but when you have a pile of "circumstantial" evidence + motive for coverup = crime committed.

It's just pretty straight forward in that the girl had all sorts of stabs in back. Nobody is stabbing themselves repeatedly in the back committing suicide. Nobody who talks about moving home is committing suicide either. You commit suicide out of the blue. When you are anxious, you have fear about you in some capacity. She was agitated and on alert. Suicides either happen without any warning or out of a long history and cycle of depression which she did not have. It's 2 very different things. The over the edge sign for me is that her body showed evidence of DA. Someone was doing that.

There’s no evidence of DA or her wanting to Leave. His family wasn’t powerful

She stopped wearing her engagement ring too. The teacher coworkers thought that was suspicious. Maybe she was having doubts about him and did want to leave.

She was working with children in a public school in Philly. Can you think of another reason she wouldn’t wear a gigantic diamond to work?

I disagree.

The fact that her coworkers were concerned tells me it was the culture in that school for teachers to wear their engagement rings.

I worked at an inner city hospital and many of the nurses loved to wear their “rocks” to work. I don’t see how this is any different.

Such a shame there was never an investigation and the first ME was bullied into changing his report.

Those nurses sound like a-holes.

Your personal observations are meaningless. Tell us you don’t know anything about the Philly school Ellen was working at without telling us…

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ER doc here. Taken care of many DV victims, more than one self-inflicted stab wound patient. Wounds in this case are too many, too deep, for a person to complete them all autonomously. You can either get a ton in that are superficial or one or two big ones. Not both. He killed her.

Nope. And don’t believe you are an ER doc. And if you are, you haven’t read the ME report and have no real expertise. Most were not deep, they were hesitation wounds which is common. and also, there were no defensive wounds.

The wish washy, flip floppy ME?

Again, you obviously haven’t delved into the actual facts

You are clearly a Sam Stan. He new wife perhaps? MIL? Here are just a few issues with the new report:

"It includes false claims like the assertion that a stab wound in Ellen’s spinal column was made during the autopsy, a theory rejected by every credible expert, including the City’s own neuropathologist," Podraza said in a statement.

"By ignoring key evidence that contradicts suicide, the extensive 3D photogrammetry, a recreation which proves Ellen could not self-inflict all the wounds, unexplained bruises, missing surveillance footage, an intact lock, accounts of a toxic relationship," he said.

Omg this guy is an ADVOCATE. not an unbiased person. Most of what he says is misleading.

I feel bad for her parents. Clearly their own guilt on how they treated their daughter is driving this. Shame on this lawyer for continuing to take their money

What specifically is misleading about what he said? I'm still waiting for anyone to refute anything he said with a fact.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ER doc here. Taken care of many DV victims, more than one self-inflicted stab wound patient. Wounds in this case are too many, too deep, for a person to complete them all autonomously. You can either get a ton in that are superficial or one or two big ones. Not both. He killed her.

Nope. And don’t believe you are an ER doc. And if you are, you haven’t read the ME report and have no real expertise. Most were not deep, they were hesitation wounds which is common. and also, there were no defensive wounds.

The wish washy, flip floppy ME?

Again, you obviously haven’t delved into the actual facts

You are clearly a Sam Stan. He new wife perhaps? MIL? Here are just a few issues with the new report:

"It includes false claims like the assertion that a stab wound in Ellen’s spinal column was made during the autopsy, a theory rejected by every credible expert, including the City’s own neuropathologist," Podraza said in a statement.

"By ignoring key evidence that contradicts suicide, the extensive 3D photogrammetry, a recreation which proves Ellen could not self-inflict all the wounds, unexplained bruises, missing surveillance footage, an intact lock, accounts of a toxic relationship," he said.

Omg this guy is an ADVOCATE. not an unbiased person. Most of what he says is misleading.

I feel bad for her parents. Clearly their own guilt on how they treated their daughter is driving this. Shame on this lawyer for continuing to take their money

The parents have accepted responsibility for not following up on the signs of domestic violence ( (Ellen asked to move out of her boyfriend’s apartment and in with her parents). I find posters who continue to berate them over this callous and nasty.

DP. I have a lot of sympathy for the parents and do not think they should feel any guilt about what happened. But they did not miss signs of domestic violence. They missed sign of a mental health crisis.

Hmm, I don’t think so. They were supportive of her seeing a counselor.

If we follow your logic, the live in fiancé is the one who really missed the boat ( if we presume he is innocent of harm to Ellen)

Yes both the fiancé and parents did miss the boat. The fiancé and the father both pressured Ellen to keep her job, which was causing her sky high anxiety. We know this because we have seen text messages between the fiancé and Ellen in which this is clear. And the father has confirmed in interviews that he regrets this as well. I do not think it the parents’ fault not the finances fault. It is all very sad.

The original ME was sued by the Greenbergs and ultimately settled the lawsuit and as part of the settlement he changed his opinion to homicide. He was under immense pressure both legally and from the media/public. The city agreed to a fresh review and a different new ME has now again determined this was a suicide.

Was the original police investigation great? No. Sloppy? Probably. Unfortunate because now some evidence is gone forever and we are less likely to know with absolute certainly exactly what happened? Yes. But this was not police corruption. And it sure as hell wasn’t corruption from the state attorney general’s office, headed at the time by Josh Shapiro. The Greenbergs have launched an extremely successful media blitz which has succeeded in garnering support from the court of public opinion. Most of whom do have not have accurate facts and are listening to sound bites from the parents’ lawyers.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ER doc here. Taken care of many DV victims, more than one self-inflicted stab wound patient. Wounds in this case are too many, too deep, for a person to complete them all autonomously. You can either get a ton in that are superficial or one or two big ones. Not both. He killed her.

Nope. And don’t believe you are an ER doc. And if you are, you haven’t read the ME report and have no real expertise. Most were not deep, they were hesitation wounds which is common. and also, there were no defensive wounds.

The wish washy, flip floppy ME?

Again, you obviously haven’t delved into the actual facts

You are clearly a Sam Stan. He new wife perhaps? MIL? Here are just a few issues with the new report:

"It includes false claims like the assertion that a stab wound in Ellen’s spinal column was made during the autopsy, a theory rejected by every credible expert, including the City’s own neuropathologist," Podraza said in a statement.

"By ignoring key evidence that contradicts suicide, the extensive 3D photogrammetry, a recreation which proves Ellen could not self-inflict all the wounds, unexplained bruises, missing surveillance footage, an intact lock, accounts of a toxic relationship," he said.

Omg this guy is an ADVOCATE. not an unbiased person. Most of what he says is misleading.

I feel bad for her parents. Clearly their own guilt on how they treated their daughter is driving this. Shame on this lawyer for continuing to take their money

The parents have accepted responsibility for not following up on the signs of domestic violence ( (Ellen asked to move out of her boyfriend’s apartment and in with her parents). I find posters who continue to berate them over this callous and nasty.

DP. I have a lot of sympathy for the parents and do not think they should feel any guilt about what happened. But they did not miss signs of domestic violence. They missed sign of a mental health crisis.

Hmm, I don’t think so. They were supportive of her seeing a counselor.

If we follow your logic, the live in fiancé is the one who really missed the boat ( if we presume he is innocent of harm to Ellen)