Anonymous wrote:I'm starting to think most of the fault lies with FAA approving the helicopter flight path. Only 100 feet of vertical clearance with a landing plane is insane (and this is with everyone following directions exactly). And I didn't realize until I watched an expert video just how many blind spots there are on the BH and the fact that helicopters fly slightly tilted down, so that inhibits pilots ability to see upwards. This was really a disaster waiting to happen.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the second ATC who left early (because of staff shortages) would have been more specific re where the plane was. Some pilots say absolutely should be been more specific in that air space. Anyone know what is actually required?

How much more specific could they have been? I’m sure the helicopter team would’ve been offended by being talked down to as if they didn’t know what they were doing. That happens all the time across all career paths. Additional instruction is taken as an insult to your abilities.

That is ridiculous. There were multiple planes in the area and withing sight. It was completely foreseeable that the BH's pilots could get confused.

I have now heard it all -- that the BH pilots would ahve been "offended" if the ATC had said "do you see the CRJ at 11 oclock" versus the ones elsewhere.

ATC did provide specific location coordinates, and BH confirmed they had CRJ in sight.

Can you explain where you found this info?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the second ATC who left early (because of staff shortages) would have been more specific re where the plane was. Some pilots say absolutely should be been more specific in that air space. Anyone know what is actually required?

How much more specific could they have been? I’m sure the helicopter team would’ve been offended by being talked down to as if they didn’t know what they were doing. That happens all the time across all career paths. Additional instruction is taken as an insult to your abilities.

That is ridiculous. There were multiple planes in the area and withing sight. It was completely foreseeable that the BH's pilots could get confused.

I have now heard it all -- that the BH pilots would ahve been "offended" if the ATC had said "do you see the CRJ at 11 oclock" versus the ones elsewhere.

ATC did provide specific location coordinates, and BH confirmed they had CRJ in sight.

Can you explain where you found this info?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the second ATC who left early (because of staff shortages) would have been more specific re where the plane was. Some pilots say absolutely should be been more specific in that air space. Anyone know what is actually required?

How much more specific could they have been? I’m sure the helicopter team would’ve been offended by being talked down to as if they didn’t know what they were doing. That happens all the time across all career paths. Additional instruction is taken as an insult to your abilities.

That is ridiculous. There were multiple planes in the area and withing sight. It was completely foreseeable that the BH's pilots could get confused.

I have now heard it all -- that the BH pilots would ahve been "offended" if the ATC had said "do you see the CRJ at 11 oclock" versus the ones elsewhere.

ATC did provide specific location coordinates, and BH confirmed they had CRJ in sight.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the second ATC who left early (because of staff shortages) would have been more specific re where the plane was. Some pilots say absolutely should be been more specific in that air space. Anyone know what is actually required?

+1. Anyone arguing a second ATC wasn't a factor is a liar and their motives need to be questioned.

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the second ATC who left early (because of staff shortages) would have been more specific re where the plane was. Some pilots say absolutely should be been more specific in that air space. Anyone know what is actually required?

Anonymous wrote:It really boils down to -

1. Do you believe the BH soldiers could have somehow missed the CRJ in it’s path?

OR

2. Do you believe the BH soldiers DID see the CRJ and for whatever reason did not avoid hitting it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the second ATC who left early (because of staff shortages) would have been more specific re where the plane was. Some pilots say absolutely should be been more specific in that air space. Anyone know what is actually required?

How much more specific could they have been? I’m sure the helicopter team would’ve been offended by being talked down to as if they didn’t know what they were doing. That happens all the time across all career paths. Additional instruction is taken as an insult to your abilities.

That is ridiculous. There were multiple planes in the area and withing sight. It was completely foreseeable that the BH's pilots could get confused.

I have now heard it all -- that the BH pilots would ahve been "offended" if the ATC had said "do you see the CRJ at 11 oclock" versus the ones elsewhere.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the second ATC who left early (because of staff shortages) would have been more specific re where the plane was. Some pilots say absolutely should be been more specific in that air space. Anyone know what is actually required?

How much more specific could they have been? I’m sure the helicopter team would’ve been offended by being talked down to as if they didn’t know what they were doing. That happens all the time across all career paths. Additional instruction is taken as an insult to your abilities.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There needs to be deep look into qualifications of pilots. How is it that a pilot with only 450 hours flying and a couple yrs out of flight school gets tasked with flying around high profile government officials and is flying around DC air? This isn’t even enough experience to be hired as a commercial pilot.
Major airlines require 1500 hrs

No. There doesn’t. It’s the best training in the world for pilots. Pilots are still, however, human.

500 hours is not a rookie. Training and check flights are an ongoing process throughout careers. Every time you come back to flying after having a non flying job or from a professional school or change planes, you go through requal. And what she was doing is gaining hours which is also part of the regular training. The military is ALWAYS training. That’s literally their everyday job.

450 hrs is about 2 yrs out of flight school. That isn’t exactly highly experienced

Pilots get sent to war right out of flight school

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There needs to be deep look into qualifications of pilots. How is it that a pilot with only 450 hours flying and a couple yrs out of flight school gets tasked with flying around high profile government officials and is flying around DC air? This isn’t even enough experience to be hired as a commercial pilot.
Major airlines require 1500 hrs

No. There doesn’t. It’s the best training in the world for pilots. Pilots are still, however, human.

500 hours is not a rookie. Training and check flights are an ongoing process throughout careers. Every time you come back to flying after having a non flying job or from a professional school or change planes, you go through requal. And what she was doing is gaining hours which is also part of the regular training. The military is ALWAYS training. That’s literally their everyday job.

450 hrs is about 2 yrs out of flight school. That isn’t exactly highly experienced

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the second ATC who left early (because of staff shortages) would have been more specific re where the plane was. Some pilots say absolutely should be been more specific in that air space. Anyone know what is actually required?

How much more specific could they have been? I’m sure the helicopter team would’ve been offended by being talked down to as if they didn’t know what they were doing. That happens all the time across all career paths. Additional instruction is taken as an insult to your abilities.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There needs to be deep look into qualifications of pilots. How is it that a pilot with only 450 hours flying and a couple yrs out of flight school gets tasked with flying around high profile government officials and is flying around DC air? This isn’t even enough experience to be hired as a commercial pilot.
Major airlines require 1500 hrs

No. There doesn’t. It’s the best training in the world for pilots. Pilots are still, however, human.

500 hours is not a rookie. Training and check flights are an ongoing process throughout careers. Every time you come back to flying after having a non flying job or from a professional school or change planes, you go through requal. And what she was doing is gaining hours which is also part of the regular training. The military is ALWAYS training. That’s literally their everyday job.