Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation I'm very interested in as my kid is an August '14 birthday playing on grade on a top Pre-ECNL team. It's difficult to know where we'll end up next year as the ECNL team will double the player pool since the club merges more locations at that age, and some 2013s will join the pool. My guess is my kid will be somewhere between ECNL and ECRL playing with kids 12-13 months older. If he repeats u12 on age, he should be one of the oldest and top players.

Playing up will give him the physical and speed challenge. Playing on age will give him more role freedom, touches on the ball, and as a result may be more enjoyable and confidence building. I think both scenarios have developmental advantages.

I believe club policy is players in the top team aren't allowed to play school soccer, so playing on age doesn't seem to have an impact in terms of being trapped for MS and HS school soccer. However, I've been stressing over the college recruiting misalignment and have talked to his coach, a couple of directors, and the college advisor at the club. They all seem to believe that playing on age won't have a negative impact on recruiting in the long term. With that said, I believe the policy will allow players to tryout at the older age if their grade is misaligned, but if you don't end up on the team you like, you won't be able to then ask to be placed on age. Will continue finding people to talk to to make the best possible decision in the coming months for tryouts.

While there's a lot of back and forth in this thread, I do appreciate the conversation as this feels like a unique scenario to be in and this thread is one of the only where the topic is being dissected in this much detail.

I highly believe on 1) building confidence (especially at younger ages) and 2) getting more experience at 9v9. There is a lot of documented benefit for more time on smaller teams/ fields. Most of the world holds off on moving to 11v11 so this is a great opportunity for your child. Also, most clubs wont let you "play up" unless they are top three at top level with proven ability to dominate. I highly doubt clubs will want to play RL for a year vs contributing to top team of grade level. I would lean into this opportunity vs worrying about it.

Agreed on the confidence and 9v9 points. His current coach brough up this exact 9v9 point and having more touches on a smaller field.

Regarding 'most clubs wont let you play up unless top 3 and dominating', I don't believe that will be the case in our situation. Players who are misaligned on grade will be able to play up and placed on A, B, C, etc. teams.

Also, what do you mean 'doubt clubs will want to play RL for a year', do you mean players instead of clubs?

While I'm leaning toward repeating u12, one option I'm considering is playing up U13 on RL and then repeating u13 where he would then have a 1 year advantage playing on a bigger field. The RL team next year will have a lot of talent.

I would be surprised if your club allows a kid to play up in RL (second team) vs with age on top team. Also, since you have a boy, RL is 3rd or 4th tier, so the quality will fall off a lot. Regarding misaligned players with their grade, I cannot imagine there are many kids who fall into this category. Essentially it would be an August kid who is very young for their grade. If this is your kid, then they will probably want them to stay with their grade and thus, you dont really have much of an option unless you want to be a squeaky wheel. I continue to fail to see the advantage of getting ahead a year for 11v11. This is missing the entire point around the rest of the world. The reason not to rush is you are losing the technical development and adding a component of strategy that many kids arent mentally ready for. Again, there is a reason why most countries are not rushing to this configuration. It sounds like your club is either VSA or PWSI, I would listen to the coaches and follow their advice if you trust them.

Yep, it was the entire point of my post, my kid is an August birthday who is the youngest in his grade and would have to play up to stay on grade.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation I'm very interested in as my kid is an August '14 birthday playing on grade on a top Pre-ECNL team. It's difficult to know where we'll end up next year as the ECNL team will double the player pool since the club merges more locations at that age, and some 2013s will join the pool. My guess is my kid will be somewhere between ECNL and ECRL playing with kids 12-13 months older. If he repeats u12 on age, he should be one of the oldest and top players.

Playing up will give him the physical and speed challenge. Playing on age will give him more role freedom, touches on the ball, and as a result may be more enjoyable and confidence building. I think both scenarios have developmental advantages.

I believe club policy is players in the top team aren't allowed to play school soccer, so playing on age doesn't seem to have an impact in terms of being trapped for MS and HS school soccer. However, I've been stressing over the college recruiting misalignment and have talked to his coach, a couple of directors, and the college advisor at the club. They all seem to believe that playing on age won't have a negative impact on recruiting in the long term. With that said, I believe the policy will allow players to tryout at the older age if their grade is misaligned, but if you don't end up on the team you like, you won't be able to then ask to be placed on age. Will continue finding people to talk to to make the best possible decision in the coming months for tryouts.

While there's a lot of back and forth in this thread, I do appreciate the conversation as this feels like a unique scenario to be in and this thread is one of the only where the topic is being dissected in this much detail.

I highly believe on 1) building confidence (especially at younger ages) and 2) getting more experience at 9v9. There is a lot of documented benefit for more time on smaller teams/ fields. Most of the world holds off on moving to 11v11 so this is a great opportunity for your child. Also, most clubs wont let you "play up" unless they are top three at top level with proven ability to dominate. I highly doubt clubs will want to play RL for a year vs contributing to top team of grade level. I would lean into this opportunity vs worrying about it.

Agreed on the confidence and 9v9 points. His current coach brough up this exact 9v9 point and having more touches on a smaller field.

Regarding 'most clubs wont let you play up unless top 3 and dominating', I don't believe that will be the case in our situation. Players who are misaligned on grade will be able to play up and placed on A, B, C, etc. teams.

Also, what do you mean 'doubt clubs will want to play RL for a year', do you mean players instead of clubs?

While I'm leaning toward repeating u12, one option I'm considering is playing up U13 on RL and then repeating u13 where he would then have a 1 year advantage playing on a bigger field. The RL team next year will have a lot of talent.

I would be surprised if your club allows a kid to play up in RL (second team) vs with age on top team. Also, since you have a boy, RL is 3rd or 4th tier, so the quality will fall off a lot. Regarding misaligned players with their grade, I cannot imagine there are many kids who fall into this category. Essentially it would be an August kid who is very young for their grade. If this is your kid, then they will probably want them to stay with their grade and thus, you dont really have much of an option unless you want to be a squeaky wheel. I continue to fail to see the advantage of getting ahead a year for 11v11. This is missing the entire point around the rest of the world. The reason not to rush is you are losing the technical development and adding a component of strategy that many kids arent mentally ready for. Again, there is a reason why most countries are not rushing to this configuration. It sounds like your club is either VSA or PWSI, I would listen to the coaches and follow their advice if you trust them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation I'm very interested in as my kid is an August '14 birthday playing on grade on a top Pre-ECNL team. It's difficult to know where we'll end up next year as the ECNL team will double the player pool since the club merges more locations at that age, and some 2013s will join the pool. My guess is my kid will be somewhere between ECNL and ECRL playing with kids 12-13 months older. If he repeats u12 on age, he should be one of the oldest and top players.

Playing up will give him the physical and speed challenge. Playing on age will give him more role freedom, touches on the ball, and as a result may be more enjoyable and confidence building. I think both scenarios have developmental advantages.

I believe club policy is players in the top team aren't allowed to play school soccer, so playing on age doesn't seem to have an impact in terms of being trapped for MS and HS school soccer. However, I've been stressing over the college recruiting misalignment and have talked to his coach, a couple of directors, and the college advisor at the club. They all seem to believe that playing on age won't have a negative impact on recruiting in the long term. With that said, I believe the policy will allow players to tryout at the older age if their grade is misaligned, but if you don't end up on the team you like, you won't be able to then ask to be placed on age. Will continue finding people to talk to to make the best possible decision in the coming months for tryouts.

While there's a lot of back and forth in this thread, I do appreciate the conversation as this feels like a unique scenario to be in and this thread is one of the only where the topic is being dissected in this much detail.

I highly believe on 1) building confidence (especially at younger ages) and 2) getting more experience at 9v9. There is a lot of documented benefit for more time on smaller teams/ fields. Most of the world holds off on moving to 11v11 so this is a great opportunity for your child. Also, most clubs wont let you "play up" unless they are top three at top level with proven ability to dominate. I highly doubt clubs will want to play RL for a year vs contributing to top team of grade level. I would lean into this opportunity vs worrying about it.

Agreed on the confidence and 9v9 points. His current coach brough up this exact 9v9 point and having more touches on a smaller field.

Regarding 'most clubs wont let you play up unless top 3 and dominating', I don't believe that will be the case in our situation. Players who are misaligned on grade will be able to play up and placed on A, B, C, etc. teams.

Also, what do you mean 'doubt clubs will want to play RL for a year', do you mean players instead of clubs?

While I'm leaning toward repeating u12, one option I'm considering is playing up U13 on RL and then repeating u13 where he would then have a 1 year advantage playing on a bigger field. The RL team next year will have a lot of talent.

Anonymous wrote:Also you mixed terms. With an Aug 15 birthday player depending on when their school starts there are 3 potential outcomes.

1. Play up a grade
2. Play on the correct grade team
3. Play on s grade down team

Number 1 and 2 work with college recruiting. Number 3 makes college recruiting much more difficult.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation I'm very interested in as my kid is an August '14 birthday playing on grade on a top Pre-ECNL team. It's difficult to know where we'll end up next year as the ECNL team will double the player pool since the club merges more locations at that age, and some 2013s will join the pool. My guess is my kid will be somewhere between ECNL and ECRL playing with kids 12-13 months older. If he repeats u12 on age, he should be one of the oldest and top players.

Playing up will give him the physical and speed challenge. Playing on age will give him more role freedom, touches on the ball, and as a result may be more enjoyable and confidence building. I think both scenarios have developmental advantages.

I believe club policy is players in the top team aren't allowed to play school soccer, so playing on age doesn't seem to have an impact in terms of being trapped for MS and HS school soccer. However, I've been stressing over the college recruiting misalignment and have talked to his coach, a couple of directors, and the college advisor at the club. They all seem to believe that playing on age won't have a negative impact on recruiting in the long term. With that said, I believe the policy will allow players to tryout at the older age if their grade is misaligned, but if you don't end up on the team you like, you won't be able to then ask to be placed on age. Will continue finding people to talk to to make the best possible decision in the coming months for tryouts.

While there's a lot of back and forth in this thread, I do appreciate the conversation as this feels like a unique scenario to be in and this thread is one of the only where the topic is being dissected in this much detail.

I highly believe on 1) building confidence (especially at younger ages) and 2) getting more experience at 9v9. There is a lot of documented benefit for more time on smaller teams/ fields. Most of the world holds off on moving to 11v11 so this is a great opportunity for your child. Also, most clubs wont let you "play up" unless they are top three at top level with proven ability to dominate. I highly doubt clubs will want to play RL for a year vs contributing to top team of grade level. I would lean into this opportunity vs worrying about it.

Agreed on the confidence and 9v9 points. His current coach brough up this exact 9v9 point and having more touches on a smaller field.

Regarding 'most clubs wont let you play up unless top 3 and dominating', I don't believe that will be the case in our situation. Players who are misaligned on grade will be able to play up and placed on A, B, C, etc. teams.

Also, what do you mean 'doubt clubs will want to play RL for a year', do you mean players instead of clubs?

While I'm leaning toward repeating u12, one option I'm considering is playing up U13 on RL and then repeating u13 where he would then have a 1 year advantage playing on a bigger field. The RL team next year will have a lot of talent.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation I'm very interested in as my kid is an August '14 birthday playing on grade on a top Pre-ECNL team. It's difficult to know where we'll end up next year as the ECNL team will double the player pool since the club merges more locations at that age, and some 2013s will join the pool. My guess is my kid will be somewhere between ECNL and ECRL playing with kids 12-13 months older. If he repeats u12 on age, he should be one of the oldest and top players.

Playing up will give him the physical and speed challenge. Playing on age will give him more role freedom, touches on the ball, and as a result may be more enjoyable and confidence building. I think both scenarios have developmental advantages.

I believe club policy is players in the top team aren't allowed to play school soccer, so playing on age doesn't seem to have an impact in terms of being trapped for MS and HS school soccer. However, I've been stressing over the college recruiting misalignment and have talked to his coach, a couple of directors, and the college advisor at the club. They all seem to believe that playing on age won't have a negative impact on recruiting in the long term. With that said, I believe the policy will allow players to tryout at the older age if their grade is misaligned, but if you don't end up on the team you like, you won't be able to then ask to be placed on age. Will continue finding people to talk to to make the best possible decision in the coming months for tryouts.

While there's a lot of back and forth in this thread, I do appreciate the conversation as this feels like a unique scenario to be in and this thread is one of the only where the topic is being dissected in this much detail.

I highly believe on 1) building confidence (especially at younger ages) and 2) getting more experience at 9v9. There is a lot of documented benefit for more time on smaller teams/ fields. Most of the world holds off on moving to 11v11 so this is a great opportunity for your child. Also, most clubs wont let you "play up" unless they are top three at top level with proven ability to dominate. I highly doubt clubs will want to play RL for a year vs contributing to top team of grade level. I would lean into this opportunity vs worrying about it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a conversation I'm very interested in as my kid is an August '14 birthday playing on grade on a top Pre-ECNL team. It's difficult to know where we'll end up next year as the ECNL team will double the player pool since the club merges more locations at that age, and some 2013s will join the pool. My guess is my kid will be somewhere between ECNL and ECRL playing with kids 12-13 months older. If he repeats u12 on age, he should be one of the oldest and top players.

Playing up will give him the physical and speed challenge. Playing on age will give him more role freedom, touches on the ball, and as a result may be more enjoyable and confidence building. I think both scenarios have developmental advantages.

I believe club policy is players in the top team aren't allowed to play school soccer, so playing on age doesn't seem to have an impact in terms of being trapped for MS and HS school soccer. However, I've been stressing over the college recruiting misalignment and have talked to his coach, a couple of directors, and the college advisor at the club. They all seem to believe that playing on age won't have a negative impact on recruiting in the long term. With that said, I believe the policy will allow players to tryout at the older age if their grade is misaligned, but if you don't end up on the team you like, you won't be able to then ask to be placed on age. Will continue finding people to talk to to make the best possible decision in the coming months for tryouts.

While there's a lot of back and forth in this thread, I do appreciate the conversation as this feels like a unique scenario to be in and this thread is one of the only where the topic is being dissected in this much detail.

Maybe you should look at the past to help define your future.

https://www.soccerparenting.com/blog/4-real-i...h-year-registration/

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not sure the credibility BUT Aug guy's favorite Talking NJ forum has someone over there saying the NJ clubs are backtracking:

"All the “go by grade” clubs are slowly transitioning to “case by case basis” which will soon become “age appropriate” or “we don’t think your kid needs to play up”.

Told ya."

Watch what happens. They might say case by case but top teams will have all players the same grade in school.

You mean, like last time? Just recently, I ran across a Soccer Parenting article from back then arguing against switching to BY which said it was common for these older kids often would play up by grade BUT it was not universal and says nothing about mandating. In fact, they estimated 5% all ALL kids were misaligned OR about 1 kid per team. So, all the remembering like it was back in the day where you went on an on about how it never happened was wrong.

https://www.soccerparenting.com/blog/4-real-issues-to-consider-before-switching-to-birth-year-registration/

Hahahaha I didnt actually read the article before. I knew what it was going to say. But, I went back and looked at it to try and see what would make the age guy chamge his mind. I oddly remember the image with cupcakes with little soccer balls on them. So either this image gets used a lot or I read this article back in 2015.

Directly from the article and what Ive been saying for over a year.

"Currently, under the School Year Cut Off we have with the August 1 registration date, we can assume that on average – across our vast country – the majority of SCHOOL CUT-OFF DATES happens between July 1 and September 1. Given that many players currently opt to “play up” to their grade level, I am going to say that the current August 1 cut off date affects 5% of the soccer playing population (approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year)."

Back in the day you just never heard of parents and players looking for situations to play down. It was just assumed that if you wanted to play in college you needed to play on the team thats your grade in school.

I'll add a little more. The comment "approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year" might be true for lower level teams and clubs but I never saw it at the highest levels. Top team / Top Club players were all the same graduating year. This is because they all wanted to get recruited and play in college. Playing on a grade down team was a huge negative and would make recruiting 10x harder.

Again, you choose to believe your own narrative. It doesn't matter regardless. This isn't what they're doing now, because they've realized they stunted the development too many players by forcing them up (yeah, a few made it). It's why they're saying this:

Will this impact college recruiting?
The new two-year age group structure will not negatively impact college recruiting. College coaches evaluate players based on their performance, development, and potential—not the exact age grouping of their club team.

Keep smelling your own farts.

When Clubs change back to SY they will do things exactly like they did before switching to BY.

5% is a lot of kids.

It'll be more this time around, especially if clubs are more serious about development vs. winning. They'd rather have more players who can start rather than trying to hide them on their bench.

You dont get it.

Wins are important but fleeting.

College committments can be used to lure in new players for an entire year. The better the college the more new players they bring in. Theres a reason clubs advertise which colleges players are going to play at on Instagram + others.

This is why top teams at clubs will always have players the same graduating year in SY. It provides rhe best possible opportunity for players to get recruited and play in college.

I get it. What all your detractors keep saying is what you don't -- there's more than one-size fits all, especially when dealing with elite athletes. Sure, most will play on grade. That's what shifting to SY (and going to Aug. 1) was ALL about. BUT they can generate more D1 recruits AND $$$ if they address RAE, which means when they find that promising player, sometimes the best move will be to play on age, not grade, especially at first. It's just a whole another level that you don't want to see. BUT it's needed if our country is to ever get off the mat to produce enough elite soccer players to better compete on the world stage (for men) and to help the women stay ahead.

You cant help yourself from playing the rae card.

At the highest levels especially as players get older rae doesnt matter. Unicorns playing up 1-2 years will all find each other and form a team that kills everyone they play. You dont know this because your kid doesn't play ar the highest levels and you've never seen it.

To answer what you're harping on more directly. Players that choose to play down dont matter. They're not going to get ahead doing it and if they plan to play in college its just going to be much more difficult than all the other players in their grade.

This is your blindness. That Ole Miss QB was D2. He took the long road. Players all have different development paths that don't go according to Hoyle and the savvy club learns to work with athletes, not pigeonhole them, especially through this upcoming transition.

For example, I know a summer born kid who has gone to YNT camps but is in a LOWER grade, so the kid would get trapped from their current BY or new SY team. The kid will bioband to play down while the rest of the team goes to HS for 1 season. This is what responsible leagues and clubs do. It's not cheating. It's adjusting to the player's developmental needs in the moment.

In terms of recruiting, that's where you seem to ignore the whole current system where the top players start to get scouted even before HS, and those families start to reach out to various schools which then maybe look at highlight reels and watch at showcases and various ID camps. And some of these kids, especially at the top level leagues, won't even play HS as they've got enough club stuff to keep them developing (and some play multiple club sports). By the time they are ready to sign, they've been seen multiple times online, in games and at camps. Grade only will matter in terms when they can arrive at school. This is because the youth system at the end of the day is more about individuals than teams, and if an Aug misaligned kid can "play up on age" to a better club, an elite club in SY, it's being sold this is a win, in part because you can get seen and because it's definitely a high enough level, and just another part of a kid's larger athletic resume.

While I hate the concept of parents looking for advantage by playing down. In SY unless leagues make a recommendation that August birthdays play with their grade you're going to have parents chasing loopholes. The end result of chasing loopholes is players that are misaligned with their grade in school and level played in club. This DOES NOT work with college recruiting and puts this type of player at a serious disadvantage. To address the issue theres two options hold your kid back a year in school or play them up a level in club.

Redshirting works in other sports because level played and grade in school are the same. It does not work for soccer because level played and graduating year are different.

Heres an example. When your kid is a sophmore playing in showcases. This is the year/grade/level college coaches are looking most closely at for players because committments happen Junior year. Your kid will be playing on a freshman team against freshman competition. Also the freshman showcase games will likely be at a different time and location. Which becomes a pita for coaches to see.

Worse yet how do college coaches evaluate you against other players your grade when you're playing on a grade down team? You instantly become one level worse than everyone else your grade thats looking to play in college.

This post proves that you don't know how college recruiting works, or how to evaluate players. Do you think college coaches come into these showcases blind, with nothing but a notepad and a hope of spotting the next Messi? No. They come to see specific players who reach out to the coaches. Those coaches know exactly what they're looking at and how to evaluate players, regardless of what grade that kid is in.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not sure the credibility BUT Aug guy's favorite Talking NJ forum has someone over there saying the NJ clubs are backtracking:

"All the “go by grade” clubs are slowly transitioning to “case by case basis” which will soon become “age appropriate” or “we don’t think your kid needs to play up”.

Told ya."

Watch what happens. They might say case by case but top teams will have all players the same grade in school.

You mean, like last time? Just recently, I ran across a Soccer Parenting article from back then arguing against switching to BY which said it was common for these older kids often would play up by grade BUT it was not universal and says nothing about mandating. In fact, they estimated 5% all ALL kids were misaligned OR about 1 kid per team. So, all the remembering like it was back in the day where you went on an on about how it never happened was wrong.

https://www.soccerparenting.com/blog/4-real-issues-to-consider-before-switching-to-birth-year-registration/

Hahahaha I didnt actually read the article before. I knew what it was going to say. But, I went back and looked at it to try and see what would make the age guy chamge his mind. I oddly remember the image with cupcakes with little soccer balls on them. So either this image gets used a lot or I read this article back in 2015.

Directly from the article and what Ive been saying for over a year.

"Currently, under the School Year Cut Off we have with the August 1 registration date, we can assume that on average – across our vast country – the majority of SCHOOL CUT-OFF DATES happens between July 1 and September 1. Given that many players currently opt to “play up” to their grade level, I am going to say that the current August 1 cut off date affects 5% of the soccer playing population (approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year)."

Back in the day you just never heard of parents and players looking for situations to play down. It was just assumed that if you wanted to play in college you needed to play on the team thats your grade in school.

I'll add a little more. The comment "approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year" might be true for lower level teams and clubs but I never saw it at the highest levels. Top team / Top Club players were all the same graduating year. This is because they all wanted to get recruited and play in college. Playing on a grade down team was a huge negative and would make recruiting 10x harder.

Again, you choose to believe your own narrative. It doesn't matter regardless. This isn't what they're doing now, because they've realized they stunted the development too many players by forcing them up (yeah, a few made it). It's why they're saying this:

Will this impact college recruiting?
The new two-year age group structure will not negatively impact college recruiting. College coaches evaluate players based on their performance, development, and potential—not the exact age grouping of their club team.

Keep smelling your own farts.

When Clubs change back to SY they will do things exactly like they did before switching to BY.

5% is a lot of kids.

It'll be more this time around, especially if clubs are more serious about development vs. winning. They'd rather have more players who can start rather than trying to hide them on their bench.

You dont get it.

Wins are important but fleeting.

College committments can be used to lure in new players for an entire year. The better the college the more new players they bring in. Theres a reason clubs advertise which colleges players are going to play at on Instagram + others.

This is why top teams at clubs will always have players the same graduating year in SY. It provides rhe best possible opportunity for players to get recruited and play in college.

I get it. What all your detractors keep saying is what you don't -- there's more than one-size fits all, especially when dealing with elite athletes. Sure, most will play on grade. That's what shifting to SY (and going to Aug. 1) was ALL about. BUT they can generate more D1 recruits AND $$$ if they address RAE, which means when they find that promising player, sometimes the best move will be to play on age, not grade, especially at first. It's just a whole another level that you don't want to see. BUT it's needed if our country is to ever get off the mat to produce enough elite soccer players to better compete on the world stage (for men) and to help the women stay ahead.

You cant help yourself from playing the rae card.

At the highest levels especially as players get older rae doesnt matter. Unicorns playing up 1-2 years will all find each other and form a team that kills everyone they play. You dont know this because your kid doesn't play ar the highest levels and you've never seen it.

To answer what you're harping on more directly. Players that choose to play down dont matter. They're not going to get ahead doing it and if they plan to play in college its just going to be much more difficult than all the other players in their grade.

This is your blindness. That Ole Miss QB was D2. He took the long road. Players all have different development paths that don't go according to Hoyle and the savvy club learns to work with athletes, not pigeonhole them, especially through this upcoming transition.

For example, I know a summer born kid who has gone to YNT camps but is in a LOWER grade, so the kid would get trapped from their current BY or new SY team. The kid will bioband to play down while the rest of the team goes to HS for 1 season. This is what responsible leagues and clubs do. It's not cheating. It's adjusting to the player's developmental needs in the moment.

In terms of recruiting, that's where you seem to ignore the whole current system where the top players start to get scouted even before HS, and those families start to reach out to various schools which then maybe look at highlight reels and watch at showcases and various ID camps. And some of these kids, especially at the top level leagues, won't even play HS as they've got enough club stuff to keep them developing (and some play multiple club sports). By the time they are ready to sign, they've been seen multiple times online, in games and at camps. Grade only will matter in terms when they can arrive at school. This is because the youth system at the end of the day is more about individuals than teams, and if an Aug misaligned kid can "play up on age" to a better club, an elite club in SY, it's being sold this is a win, in part because you can get seen and because it's definitely a high enough level, and just another part of a kid's larger athletic resume.

While I hate the concept of parents looking for advantage by playing down. In SY unless leagues make a recommendation that August birthdays play with their grade you're going to have parents chasing loopholes. The end result of chasing loopholes is players that are misaligned with their grade in school and level played in club. This DOES NOT work with college recruiting and puts this type of player at a serious disadvantage. To address the issue theres two options hold your kid back a year in school or play them up a level in club.

Explain the loophole. If the cutoff is Aug. 1 - July 31 and you are playing within that range, where is the loophole? There isn't one. What do you think happened pre-2017? No one who was misaligned by grade got recruited to play college soccer?! Also, you don't make any sense when you say "advantage of playing down." If you're an Aug. kid, playing within your Aug. age range, you're not playing down, and there is no advantage. That's like complaining all the Jan. kids that currently play on age are trying to take advantage. Take advantage of what?!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not sure the credibility BUT Aug guy's favorite Talking NJ forum has someone over there saying the NJ clubs are backtracking:

"All the “go by grade” clubs are slowly transitioning to “case by case basis” which will soon become “age appropriate” or “we don’t think your kid needs to play up”.

Told ya."

Watch what happens. They might say case by case but top teams will have all players the same grade in school.

You mean, like last time? Just recently, I ran across a Soccer Parenting article from back then arguing against switching to BY which said it was common for these older kids often would play up by grade BUT it was not universal and says nothing about mandating. In fact, they estimated 5% all ALL kids were misaligned OR about 1 kid per team. So, all the remembering like it was back in the day where you went on an on about how it never happened was wrong.

https://www.soccerparenting.com/blog/4-real-issues-to-consider-before-switching-to-birth-year-registration/

Hahahaha I didnt actually read the article before. I knew what it was going to say. But, I went back and looked at it to try and see what would make the age guy chamge his mind. I oddly remember the image with cupcakes with little soccer balls on them. So either this image gets used a lot or I read this article back in 2015.

Directly from the article and what Ive been saying for over a year.

"Currently, under the School Year Cut Off we have with the August 1 registration date, we can assume that on average – across our vast country – the majority of SCHOOL CUT-OFF DATES happens between July 1 and September 1. Given that many players currently opt to “play up” to their grade level, I am going to say that the current August 1 cut off date affects 5% of the soccer playing population (approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year)."

Back in the day you just never heard of parents and players looking for situations to play down. It was just assumed that if you wanted to play in college you needed to play on the team thats your grade in school.

I'll add a little more. The comment "approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year" might be true for lower level teams and clubs but I never saw it at the highest levels. Top team / Top Club players were all the same graduating year. This is because they all wanted to get recruited and play in college. Playing on a grade down team was a huge negative and would make recruiting 10x harder.

Again, you choose to believe your own narrative. It doesn't matter regardless. This isn't what they're doing now, because they've realized they stunted the development too many players by forcing them up (yeah, a few made it). It's why they're saying this:

Will this impact college recruiting?
The new two-year age group structure will not negatively impact college recruiting. College coaches evaluate players based on their performance, development, and potential—not the exact age grouping of their club team.

Keep smelling your own farts.

When Clubs change back to SY they will do things exactly like they did before switching to BY.

5% is a lot of kids.

It'll be more this time around, especially if clubs are more serious about development vs. winning. They'd rather have more players who can start rather than trying to hide them on their bench.

You dont get it.

Wins are important but fleeting.

College committments can be used to lure in new players for an entire year. The better the college the more new players they bring in. Theres a reason clubs advertise which colleges players are going to play at on Instagram + others.

This is why top teams at clubs will always have players the same graduating year in SY. It provides rhe best possible opportunity for players to get recruited and play in college.

I get it. What all your detractors keep saying is what you don't -- there's more than one-size fits all, especially when dealing with elite athletes. Sure, most will play on grade. That's what shifting to SY (and going to Aug. 1) was ALL about. BUT they can generate more D1 recruits AND $$$ if they address RAE, which means when they find that promising player, sometimes the best move will be to play on age, not grade, especially at first. It's just a whole another level that you don't want to see. BUT it's needed if our country is to ever get off the mat to produce enough elite soccer players to better compete on the world stage (for men) and to help the women stay ahead.

You cant help yourself from playing the rae card.

At the highest levels especially as players get older rae doesnt matter. Unicorns playing up 1-2 years will all find each other and form a team that kills everyone they play. You dont know this because your kid doesn't play ar the highest levels and you've never seen it.

To answer what you're harping on more directly. Players that choose to play down dont matter. They're not going to get ahead doing it and if they plan to play in college its just going to be much more difficult than all the other players in their grade.

This is your blindness. That Ole Miss QB was D2. He took the long road. Players all have different development paths that don't go according to Hoyle and the savvy club learns to work with athletes, not pigeonhole them, especially through this upcoming transition.

For example, I know a summer born kid who has gone to YNT camps but is in a LOWER grade, so the kid would get trapped from their current BY or new SY team. The kid will bioband to play down while the rest of the team goes to HS for 1 season. This is what responsible leagues and clubs do. It's not cheating. It's adjusting to the player's developmental needs in the moment.

In terms of recruiting, that's where you seem to ignore the whole current system where the top players start to get scouted even before HS, and those families start to reach out to various schools which then maybe look at highlight reels and watch at showcases and various ID camps. And some of these kids, especially at the top level leagues, won't even play HS as they've got enough club stuff to keep them developing (and some play multiple club sports). By the time they are ready to sign, they've been seen multiple times online, in games and at camps. Grade only will matter in terms when they can arrive at school. This is because the youth system at the end of the day is more about individuals than teams, and if an Aug misaligned kid can "play up on age" to a better club, an elite club in SY, it's being sold this is a win, in part because you can get seen and because it's definitely a high enough level, and just another part of a kid's larger athletic resume.

While I hate the concept of parents looking for advantage by playing down. In SY unless leagues make a recommendation that August birthdays play with their grade you're going to have parents chasing loopholes. The end result of chasing loopholes is players that are misaligned with their grade in school and level played in club. This DOES NOT work with college recruiting and puts this type of player at a serious disadvantage. To address the issue theres two options hold your kid back a year in school or play them up a level in club.

Redshirting works in other sports because level played and grade in school are the same. It does not work for soccer because level played and graduating year are different.

Heres an example. When your kid is a sophmore playing in showcases. This is the year/grade/level college coaches are looking most closely at for players because committments happen Junior year. Your kid will be playing on a freshman team against freshman competition. Also the freshman showcase games will likely be at a different time and location. Which becomes a pita for coaches to see.

Worse yet how do college coaches evaluate you against other players your grade when you're playing on a grade down team? You instantly become one level worse than everyone else your grade thats looking to play in college.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not sure the credibility BUT Aug guy's favorite Talking NJ forum has someone over there saying the NJ clubs are backtracking:

"All the “go by grade” clubs are slowly transitioning to “case by case basis” which will soon become “age appropriate” or “we don’t think your kid needs to play up”.

Told ya."

Watch what happens. They might say case by case but top teams will have all players the same grade in school.

You mean, like last time? Just recently, I ran across a Soccer Parenting article from back then arguing against switching to BY which said it was common for these older kids often would play up by grade BUT it was not universal and says nothing about mandating. In fact, they estimated 5% all ALL kids were misaligned OR about 1 kid per team. So, all the remembering like it was back in the day where you went on an on about how it never happened was wrong.

https://www.soccerparenting.com/blog/4-real-issues-to-consider-before-switching-to-birth-year-registration/

Hahahaha I didnt actually read the article before. I knew what it was going to say. But, I went back and looked at it to try and see what would make the age guy chamge his mind. I oddly remember the image with cupcakes with little soccer balls on them. So either this image gets used a lot or I read this article back in 2015.

Directly from the article and what Ive been saying for over a year.

"Currently, under the School Year Cut Off we have with the August 1 registration date, we can assume that on average – across our vast country – the majority of SCHOOL CUT-OFF DATES happens between July 1 and September 1. Given that many players currently opt to “play up” to their grade level, I am going to say that the current August 1 cut off date affects 5% of the soccer playing population (approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year)."

Back in the day you just never heard of parents and players looking for situations to play down. It was just assumed that if you wanted to play in college you needed to play on the team thats your grade in school.

I'll add a little more. The comment "approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year" might be true for lower level teams and clubs but I never saw it at the highest levels. Top team / Top Club players were all the same graduating year. This is because they all wanted to get recruited and play in college. Playing on a grade down team was a huge negative and would make recruiting 10x harder.

Again, you choose to believe your own narrative. It doesn't matter regardless. This isn't what they're doing now, because they've realized they stunted the development too many players by forcing them up (yeah, a few made it). It's why they're saying this:

Will this impact college recruiting?
The new two-year age group structure will not negatively impact college recruiting. College coaches evaluate players based on their performance, development, and potential—not the exact age grouping of their club team.

Keep smelling your own farts.

When Clubs change back to SY they will do things exactly like they did before switching to BY.

5% is a lot of kids.

It'll be more this time around, especially if clubs are more serious about development vs. winning. They'd rather have more players who can start rather than trying to hide them on their bench.

You dont get it.

Wins are important but fleeting.

College committments can be used to lure in new players for an entire year. The better the college the more new players they bring in. Theres a reason clubs advertise which colleges players are going to play at on Instagram + others.

This is why top teams at clubs will always have players the same graduating year in SY. It provides rhe best possible opportunity for players to get recruited and play in college.

I get it. What all your detractors keep saying is what you don't -- there's more than one-size fits all, especially when dealing with elite athletes. Sure, most will play on grade. That's what shifting to SY (and going to Aug. 1) was ALL about. BUT they can generate more D1 recruits AND $$$ if they address RAE, which means when they find that promising player, sometimes the best move will be to play on age, not grade, especially at first. It's just a whole another level that you don't want to see. BUT it's needed if our country is to ever get off the mat to produce enough elite soccer players to better compete on the world stage (for men) and to help the women stay ahead.

You cant help yourself from playing the rae card.

At the highest levels especially as players get older rae doesnt matter. Unicorns playing up 1-2 years will all find each other and form a team that kills everyone they play. You dont know this because your kid doesn't play ar the highest levels and you've never seen it.

To answer what you're harping on more directly. Players that choose to play down dont matter. They're not going to get ahead doing it and if they plan to play in college its just going to be much more difficult than all the other players in their grade.

This is your blindness. That Ole Miss QB was D2. He took the long road. Players all have different development paths that don't go according to Hoyle and the savvy club learns to work with athletes, not pigeonhole them, especially through this upcoming transition.

For example, I know a summer born kid who has gone to YNT camps but is in a LOWER grade, so the kid would get trapped from their current BY or new SY team. The kid will bioband to play down while the rest of the team goes to HS for 1 season. This is what responsible leagues and clubs do. It's not cheating. It's adjusting to the player's developmental needs in the moment.

In terms of recruiting, that's where you seem to ignore the whole current system where the top players start to get scouted even before HS, and those families start to reach out to various schools which then maybe look at highlight reels and watch at showcases and various ID camps. And some of these kids, especially at the top level leagues, won't even play HS as they've got enough club stuff to keep them developing (and some play multiple club sports). By the time they are ready to sign, they've been seen multiple times online, in games and at camps. Grade only will matter in terms when they can arrive at school. This is because the youth system at the end of the day is more about individuals than teams, and if an Aug misaligned kid can "play up on age" to a better club, an elite club in SY, it's being sold this is a win, in part because you can get seen and because it's definitely a high enough level, and just another part of a kid's larger athletic resume.

While I hate the concept of parents looking for advantage by playing down. In SY unless leagues make a recommendation that August birthdays play with their grade you're going to have parents chasing loopholes. The end result of chasing loopholes is players that are misaligned with their grade in school and level played in club. This DOES NOT work with college recruiting and puts this type of player at a serious disadvantage. To address the issue theres two options hold your kid back a year in school or play them up a level in club.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not sure the credibility BUT Aug guy's favorite Talking NJ forum has someone over there saying the NJ clubs are backtracking:

"All the “go by grade” clubs are slowly transitioning to “case by case basis” which will soon become “age appropriate” or “we don’t think your kid needs to play up”.

Told ya."

Watch what happens. They might say case by case but top teams will have all players the same grade in school.

You mean, like last time? Just recently, I ran across a Soccer Parenting article from back then arguing against switching to BY which said it was common for these older kids often would play up by grade BUT it was not universal and says nothing about mandating. In fact, they estimated 5% all ALL kids were misaligned OR about 1 kid per team. So, all the remembering like it was back in the day where you went on an on about how it never happened was wrong.

https://www.soccerparenting.com/blog/4-real-issues-to-consider-before-switching-to-birth-year-registration/

Hahahaha I didnt actually read the article before. I knew what it was going to say. But, I went back and looked at it to try and see what would make the age guy chamge his mind. I oddly remember the image with cupcakes with little soccer balls on them. So either this image gets used a lot or I read this article back in 2015.

Directly from the article and what Ive been saying for over a year.

"Currently, under the School Year Cut Off we have with the August 1 registration date, we can assume that on average – across our vast country – the majority of SCHOOL CUT-OFF DATES happens between July 1 and September 1. Given that many players currently opt to “play up” to their grade level, I am going to say that the current August 1 cut off date affects 5% of the soccer playing population (approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year)."

Back in the day you just never heard of parents and players looking for situations to play down. It was just assumed that if you wanted to play in college you needed to play on the team thats your grade in school.

I'll add a little more. The comment "approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year" might be true for lower level teams and clubs but I never saw it at the highest levels. Top team / Top Club players were all the same graduating year. This is because they all wanted to get recruited and play in college. Playing on a grade down team was a huge negative and would make recruiting 10x harder.

Again, you choose to believe your own narrative. It doesn't matter regardless. This isn't what they're doing now, because they've realized they stunted the development too many players by forcing them up (yeah, a few made it). It's why they're saying this:

Will this impact college recruiting?
The new two-year age group structure will not negatively impact college recruiting. College coaches evaluate players based on their performance, development, and potential—not the exact age grouping of their club team.

Keep smelling your own farts.

When Clubs change back to SY they will do things exactly like they did before switching to BY.

5% is a lot of kids.

It'll be more this time around, especially if clubs are more serious about development vs. winning. They'd rather have more players who can start rather than trying to hide them on their bench.

You dont get it.

Wins are important but fleeting.

College committments can be used to lure in new players for an entire year. The better the college the more new players they bring in. Theres a reason clubs advertise which colleges players are going to play at on Instagram + others.

This is why top teams at clubs will always have players the same graduating year in SY. It provides rhe best possible opportunity for players to get recruited and play in college.

I get it. What all your detractors keep saying is what you don't -- there's more than one-size fits all, especially when dealing with elite athletes. Sure, most will play on grade. That's what shifting to SY (and going to Aug. 1) was ALL about. BUT they can generate more D1 recruits AND $$$ if they address RAE, which means when they find that promising player, sometimes the best move will be to play on age, not grade, especially at first. It's just a whole another level that you don't want to see. BUT it's needed if our country is to ever get off the mat to produce enough elite soccer players to better compete on the world stage (for men) and to help the women stay ahead.

You cant help yourself from playing the rae card.

At the highest levels especially as players get older rae doesnt matter. Unicorns playing up 1-2 years will all find each other and form a team that kills everyone they play. You dont know this because your kid doesn't play ar the highest levels and you've never seen it.

To answer what you're harping on more directly. Players that choose to play down dont matter. They're not going to get ahead doing it and if they plan to play in college its just going to be much more difficult than all the other players in their grade.

This is your blindness. That Ole Miss QB was D2. He took the long road. Players all have different development paths that don't go according to Hoyle and the savvy club learns to work with athletes, not pigeonhole them, especially through this upcoming transition.

For example, I know a summer born kid who has gone to YNT camps but is in a LOWER grade, so the kid would get trapped from their current BY or new SY team. The kid will bioband to play down while the rest of the team goes to HS for 1 season. This is what responsible leagues and clubs do. It's not cheating. It's adjusting to the player's developmental needs in the moment.

In terms of recruiting, that's where you seem to ignore the whole current system where the top players start to get scouted even before HS, and those families start to reach out to various schools which then maybe look at highlight reels and watch at showcases and various ID camps. And some of these kids, especially at the top level leagues, won't even play HS as they've got enough club stuff to keep them developing (and some play multiple club sports). By the time they are ready to sign, they've been seen multiple times online, in games and at camps. Grade only will matter in terms when they can arrive at school. This is because the youth system at the end of the day is more about individuals than teams, and if an Aug misaligned kid can "play up on age" to a better club, an elite club in SY, it's being sold this is a win, in part because you can get seen and because it's definitely a high enough level, and just another part of a kid's larger athletic resume.

While I hate the concept of parents looking for advantage by playing down. In SY unless leagues make a recommendation that August birthdays play with their grade you're going to have parents chasing loopholes. The end result of chasing loopholes is players that are misaligned with their grade in school and level played in club. This DOES NOT work with college recruiting and puts this type of player at a serious disadvantage. To address the issue theres two options hold your kid back a year in school or play them up a level in club.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not sure the credibility BUT Aug guy's favorite Talking NJ forum has someone over there saying the NJ clubs are backtracking:

"All the “go by grade” clubs are slowly transitioning to “case by case basis” which will soon become “age appropriate” or “we don’t think your kid needs to play up”.

Told ya."

Watch what happens. They might say case by case but top teams will have all players the same grade in school.

You mean, like last time? Just recently, I ran across a Soccer Parenting article from back then arguing against switching to BY which said it was common for these older kids often would play up by grade BUT it was not universal and says nothing about mandating. In fact, they estimated 5% all ALL kids were misaligned OR about 1 kid per team. So, all the remembering like it was back in the day where you went on an on about how it never happened was wrong.

https://www.soccerparenting.com/blog/4-real-issues-to-consider-before-switching-to-birth-year-registration/

Hahahaha I didnt actually read the article before. I knew what it was going to say. But, I went back and looked at it to try and see what would make the age guy chamge his mind. I oddly remember the image with cupcakes with little soccer balls on them. So either this image gets used a lot or I read this article back in 2015.

Directly from the article and what Ive been saying for over a year.

"Currently, under the School Year Cut Off we have with the August 1 registration date, we can assume that on average – across our vast country – the majority of SCHOOL CUT-OFF DATES happens between July 1 and September 1. Given that many players currently opt to “play up” to their grade level, I am going to say that the current August 1 cut off date affects 5% of the soccer playing population (approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year)."

Back in the day you just never heard of parents and players looking for situations to play down. It was just assumed that if you wanted to play in college you needed to play on the team thats your grade in school.

I'll add a little more. The comment "approximately 1 person per team does not play up to their school year" might be true for lower level teams and clubs but I never saw it at the highest levels. Top team / Top Club players were all the same graduating year. This is because they all wanted to get recruited and play in college. Playing on a grade down team was a huge negative and would make recruiting 10x harder.

Again, you choose to believe your own narrative. It doesn't matter regardless. This isn't what they're doing now, because they've realized they stunted the development too many players by forcing them up (yeah, a few made it). It's why they're saying this:

Will this impact college recruiting?
The new two-year age group structure will not negatively impact college recruiting. College coaches evaluate players based on their performance, development, and potential—not the exact age grouping of their club team.

Keep smelling your own farts.

When Clubs change back to SY they will do things exactly like they did before switching to BY.

5% is a lot of kids.

It'll be more this time around, especially if clubs are more serious about development vs. winning. They'd rather have more players who can start rather than trying to hide them on their bench.

You dont get it.

Wins are important but fleeting.

College committments can be used to lure in new players for an entire year. The better the college the more new players they bring in. Theres a reason clubs advertise which colleges players are going to play at on Instagram + others.

This is why top teams at clubs will always have players the same graduating year in SY. It provides rhe best possible opportunity for players to get recruited and play in college.

I get it. What all your detractors keep saying is what you don't -- there's more than one-size fits all, especially when dealing with elite athletes. Sure, most will play on grade. That's what shifting to SY (and going to Aug. 1) was ALL about. BUT they can generate more D1 recruits AND $$$ if they address RAE, which means when they find that promising player, sometimes the best move will be to play on age, not grade, especially at first. It's just a whole another level that you don't want to see. BUT it's needed if our country is to ever get off the mat to produce enough elite soccer players to better compete on the world stage (for men) and to help the women stay ahead.

You cant help yourself from playing the rae card.

At the highest levels especially as players get older rae doesnt matter. Unicorns playing up 1-2 years will all find each other and form a team that kills everyone they play. You dont know this because your kid doesn't play ar the highest levels and you've never seen it.

To answer what you're harping on more directly. Players that choose to play down dont matter. They're not going to get ahead doing it and if they plan to play in college its just going to be much more difficult than all the other players in their grade.

This is your blindness. That Ole Miss QB was D2. He took the long road. Players all have different development paths that don't go according to Hoyle and the savvy club learns to work with athletes, not pigeonhole them, especially through this upcoming transition.

For example, I know a summer born kid who has gone to YNT camps but is in a LOWER grade, so the kid would get trapped from their current BY or new SY team. The kid will bioband to play down while the rest of the team goes to HS for 1 season. This is what responsible leagues and clubs do. It's not cheating. It's adjusting to the player's developmental needs in the moment.

In terms of recruiting, that's where you seem to ignore the whole current system where the top players start to get scouted even before HS, and those families start to reach out to various schools which then maybe look at highlight reels and watch at showcases and various ID camps. And some of these kids, especially at the top level leagues, won't even play HS as they've got enough club stuff to keep them developing (and some play multiple club sports). By the time they are ready to sign, they've been seen multiple times online, in games and at camps. Grade only will matter in terms when they can arrive at school. This is because the youth system at the end of the day is more about individuals than teams, and if an Aug misaligned kid can "play up on age" to a better club, an elite club in SY, it's being sold this is a win, in part because you can get seen and because it's definitely a high enough level, and just another part of a kid's larger athletic resume.

Anonymous wrote:
Number 1 and 2 work with college recruiting. Number 3 makes college recruiting much more difficult.