Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve been trying hard to ignore this thread but people need to hear another good why. I don’t push my kids in the way OP suggests is healthy because last year one of my friends died by suicide. He had a perfect life on paper and had always achieved and pushed for the next level. His father, even in his adulthood, pushed him relentlessly and made clear that he should always be achieving more. Nothing was good enough unless he exceeded the father’s accomplishments, which are too public and well-known to write about here. In our modern competitive world, it would be nearly impossible to pull that off two generations in a row.

We all loved my friend but now he is gone, because he got the message from the time he was a child that he was only his accomplishments and nothing would ever be enough.

I support my kids. I encourage them. I don’t push them because I want them to know they are enough and they are loved for who they are.

Thanks for posting this.

So sorry about your friend. But normally, people who are mentally ill enough to commit suicide would’ve done it no matter how hard their parents pushed. I have a feeling even if your friend had “gentle parents” they still would’ve died.

I disagree. So much of life begins with nature (genetic predisposition) but is then influenced by nurture (environmental influences). I believe we may be pointed in certain directions biologically, but our experiences and influences along the way certainly are influential, as well.

For some kids (and adults), external pressure by their parents will have marginal impact, either because they're not particularly sensitive to (natural temprament) it or because their mental health is just not that close to the "edge". Other kids (and adults) are far more sensitive to parental input and pressure, some of whom are naturally very tightly wound, anxious, or depressed already.

Those are the high-risk kids (and adults) - the ones whose internal voice + environmental influences both tell them a story of "not good enough". Again, most fall far short of suicide, of course. But even so, there's a lot of avoidable suffering due to anxiety and depression . . . .

Okay. So what do you do when you have a kid predisposed to anxiety or depression? Not push them at all?

The fact is, we all need to do some amount of pushing if we don't want failure to launch kids. Everyone (except for the trust funders) needs to hold down a relatively well-paying job to support themselves. So we need to push our kids to develop the work ethic, discipline, and habits necessary to build up to that. Being predisposed to mental illness doesn't change that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve been trying hard to ignore this thread but people need to hear another good why. I don’t push my kids in the way OP suggests is healthy because last year one of my friends died by suicide. He had a perfect life on paper and had always achieved and pushed for the next level. His father, even in his adulthood, pushed him relentlessly and made clear that he should always be achieving more. Nothing was good enough unless he exceeded the father’s accomplishments, which are too public and well-known to write about here. In our modern competitive world, it would be nearly impossible to pull that off two generations in a row.

We all loved my friend but now he is gone, because he got the message from the time he was a child that he was only his accomplishments and nothing would ever be enough.

I support my kids. I encourage them. I don’t push them because I want them to know they are enough and they are loved for who they are.

Thanks for posting this.

So sorry about your friend. But normally, people who are mentally ill enough to commit suicide would’ve done it no matter how hard their parents pushed. I have a feeling even if your friend had “gentle parents” they still would’ve died.

I disagree. So much of life begins with nature (genetic predisposition) but is then influenced by nurture (environmental influences). I believe we may be pointed in certain directions biologically, but our experiences and influences along the way certainly are influential, as well.

For some kids (and adults), external pressure by their parents will have marginal impact, either because they're not particularly sensitive to (natural temprament) it or because their mental health is just not that close to the "edge". Other kids (and adults) are far more sensitive to parental input and pressure, some of whom are naturally very tightly wound, anxious, or depressed already.

Those are the high-risk kids (and adults) - the ones whose internal voice + environmental influences both tell them a story of "not good enough". Again, most fall far short of suicide, of course. But even so, there's a lot of avoidable suffering due to anxiety and depression . . . .

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve been trying hard to ignore this thread but people need to hear another good why. I don’t push my kids in the way OP suggests is healthy because last year one of my friends died by suicide. He had a perfect life on paper and had always achieved and pushed for the next level. His father, even in his adulthood, pushed him relentlessly and made clear that he should always be achieving more. Nothing was good enough unless he exceeded the father’s accomplishments, which are too public and well-known to write about here. In our modern competitive world, it would be nearly impossible to pull that off two generations in a row.

We all loved my friend but now he is gone, because he got the message from the time he was a child that he was only his accomplishments and nothing would ever be enough.

I support my kids. I encourage them. I don’t push them because I want them to know they are enough and they are loved for who they are.

Thanks for posting this.

So sorry about your friend. But normally, people who are mentally ill enough to commit suicide would’ve done it no matter how hard their parents pushed. I have a feeling even if your friend had “gentle parents” they still would’ve died.

I know it makes you feel better to believe that but it has no grounding in reality. Mental illness is not innate. Even people who are born with mental health problems will benefit from healthy parenting. Which is why people talk about parenting the child you have, not the one you wish you had. Pushing a child whose mental health is obviously made worse by that pushing is crap parenting, regardless of what you personally think about gentle parenting methods.

Anonymous wrote:People are averse to pushing kids because they most likely have a fat nest egg/inheritance. Why bother if kids inherit 5 mill each?

Because they will blow through it if they don’t have any work ethic or skill.

I wonder who pushes OP?

People are averse to pushing kids because they most likely have a fat nest egg/inheritance. Why bother if kids inherit 5 mill each?

Anonymous wrote:You are insufferable.

This. You perceive weakness in your peers because you need to pat yourself on the back. Get a grip.

You are insufferable.

Sounds like the raskin situation. Two very busy, successful parents.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve been trying hard to ignore this thread but people need to hear another good why. I don’t push my kids in the way OP suggests is healthy because last year one of my friends died by suicide. He had a perfect life on paper and had always achieved and pushed for the next level. His father, even in his adulthood, pushed him relentlessly and made clear that he should always be achieving more. Nothing was good enough unless he exceeded the father’s accomplishments, which are too public and well-known to write about here. In our modern competitive world, it would be nearly impossible to pull that off two generations in a row.

We all loved my friend but now he is gone, because he got the message from the time he was a child that he was only his accomplishments and nothing would ever be enough.

I support my kids. I encourage them. I don’t push them because I want them to know they are enough and they are loved for who they are.

Thanks for posting this.

So sorry about your friend. But normally, people who are mentally ill enough to commit suicide would’ve done it no matter how hard their parents pushed. I have a feeling even if your friend had “gentle parents” they still would’ve died.

Anonymous wrote:I’ve been trying hard to ignore this thread but people need to hear another good why. I don’t push my kids in the way OP suggests is healthy because last year one of my friends died by suicide. He had a perfect life on paper and had always achieved and pushed for the next level. His father, even in his adulthood, pushed him relentlessly and made clear that he should always be achieving more. Nothing was good enough unless he exceeded the father’s accomplishments, which are too public and well-known to write about here. In our modern competitive world, it would be nearly impossible to pull that off two generations in a row.

We all loved my friend but now he is gone, because he got the message from the time he was a child that he was only his accomplishments and nothing would ever be enough.

I support my kids. I encourage them. I don’t push them because I want them to know they are enough and they are loved for who they are.

Thanks for posting this.

I’ve been trying hard to ignore this thread but people need to hear another good why. I don’t push my kids in the way OP suggests is healthy because last year one of my friends died by suicide. He had a perfect life on paper and had always achieved and pushed for the next level. His father, even in his adulthood, pushed him relentlessly and made clear that he should always be achieving more. Nothing was good enough unless he exceeded the father’s accomplishments, which are too public and well-known to write about here. In our modern competitive world, it would be nearly impossible to pull that off two generations in a row.

We all loved my friend but now he is gone, because he got the message from the time he was a child that he was only his accomplishments and nothing would ever be enough.

I support my kids. I encourage them. I don’t push them because I want them to know they are enough and they are loved for who they are.

My 10 yr old doesn’t need pushing so far (we’ll see about her younger sister). She wanted to play a sport and do an instrument, so we supported that, but would have been fine with her interests falling elsewhere too.

She started soccer last year and got moved up a level mostly on commitment / passion (ie skills weren’t 100% there). She has made huge progress this season and looks so happy when she’s playing. At the same time this comes at the cost of other interests (such as singing) and is a big commitment already for us. There’s a child who was on her team last year whose mom is upset our child moved up. They’re still at practices at the same time and the mom really pushes the child (borders on yelling) at pickup time. It seems the child really doesn’t want to be there. Needless to say, compared to my daughter who practices every chance she gets, just isn’t going to make progress. If she were sitting in her room all the time (there’s plenty of that too) I might push more, but I’d rather see who she is and lean in to her natural interests.

I hear a lot of excuses and wining from middle to upper class parents whenever someone mentions standardized tests. I understand that some people have a harder time than others, but if your kid with a personal laptop and internet access at home can’t get a four digit SAT score you’ve probably failed as a parent.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I tried to push my kid academically when she was younger and I think I have contributed to her teenage depression and anxiety. I now gently encourage but no more pressure.

This is not true. She probably would have depression or anxiety even if you didn't push her. PP, please don't blame yourself for your daughter's mental health issues.

Oh sweetie you need to do a little research on how parents are the main reason for their kid's mental health issues.

+1

I agree with this based on observing the community around me - at least in most cases. Often it's a matter of degree. The underlying issue would be there no matter what (a genetic/chemical tendency towards anxiety or depression) but the parents' behavior (pressure/demands) escalates the underlying issue rather than difuses it.

But I don't have any research to back this up. Would you be willing to share a source or two?

(I think Wendy Grolnick's work speaks to this, but I'm not sure. https://www.amazon.com/Psychology-Parental-Control-Well-meant-Parenting/dp/0805835415 )

-1

You are gross, PP. We know many families where one kid is perfectly mentally fine and the other kid has severe depression or anxiety. Blaming parents for their kids' mental health issues is disgusting.

Read what I wrote - GENETICS + environment.

Siblings share sone genes but certainly not all. One may have a genetic predisposition while the other sibling doesn’t.

For the sibling who does not have the predisposition, parental behavior likely won’t have an influence on mental health (unless it’s awful, traumatic parental behavior, and no one is talking about this here!!)

But for the sibling who is genetically predisposed to depression/anxiety, I think it’s crazy to be so certain parental behavior has no impact. Just as positive interventions can help steer things in a healthy direction, loving but misguided behavior could have a negative impact.

Nothing about this is talking about all kids and all parents.

But if a child is genetically predisposed to anxiety/depression, I think it’s irresponsible and outright cruel for parents to intentionally apply strong and consistent pressure on a kid to achieve with academics or sports (or popularity or appearance/weight). In that case, yes, the parent is doing harm.

LMAO! You are insane. Expecting your kid to do well in school is not contributing to their anxiety and depression. Actually, having high expectations of kids has been shown to benefit their mental health and self-esteem.

It’s all in the execution though.

Be specific pls. For example, one pp mentioned removing screen time privilege if not straight As, how will that impact kids mental health? The following discussions seem to indicate that it will hurt the kids in the long run. How exactly to have high expectations while without any external positive or negative feedbacks? Just do nothing and trust capable kids would naturally want to study and keep good grades? What’s if the kids internal drive points to video games or social media?

Parents should be careful punishing the outcome (lack of an A). What should matter is the effort. If my kid does not do well because they blow off assignments etc., Then I think that is when consequences should come in and NOT if they get a B etc after hard work.