Anonymous wrote:Putin and Prigozhin are two scorpions in a bottle now. And the long knives are out within the Russian elite (business and security). Putin has been losing slowly since February 25, 2023. Now he’s losing more quickly.

Unfortunately, he’s taking too many down with him. And I’m not hopeful that whoever comes after Putin will be better for Russia. But whoever it is will declare victory in Ukraine and leave. It’s not a uniting issue.

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Anonymous wrote:Looks like Ukraine has committed its forces in the southeast. Hopefully there's a breakthrough

Very perplexed by African countries going through with their summit meeting with Putin. Genuinely bizarre. There's no good outcome here.

I'm not worried at all.

Sure, they can buy off the corrupt government heads with hookers and money, but that will be similar to their relationship with Saudi Arabia - a marriage of convenience that ends in divorce when the water gets too hot.

It will give the Africans time to really get to know Russians well. The average ultranationalist supporting the government is exceptionally xenophobic and unconditionally racist. My guess is that some FSB agent or cop will see a black diplomat on the street, not realize they're a dignitary and treat them exactly the way the other 0.04% of blacks are treated in Russia. It will be a 'warm welcome' I'm sure. In the end, I think the Russian government will drive their own wedge between themselves and Africa.

LOL you say this like thousands of Africans haven't been educated in Russia over the last fifty years. They've experienced life on the Russian streets in full, and yet lived to tell the tale, and somehow retained a warm affection for the country.

Thirty thousand African students are enrolled in higher education programs in Russia today.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1131857/number-of-african-students-in-russia-by-country/

The US has tens of thousands of African students too. Interesting that hardly any of Russia's African students ever bother to stay in Russia, or to come back to Russia after finishing their studies. Russia's population is only 0.06% African origin, only around 90,000 total, including your 30,000 students. Compare that to to 2.1 million African immigrants living in the US. Russia goes through the motions with its legacy Soviet-era student program, but is NOT that attractive to Africans.

Are African students in the US studying on an all-expenses-paid program?

Russian education programs for the African students are explicitly designed for these students to return home so their communities can benefit from their expertise. (Which is exactly the purpose for the multiple US scholarship program like FUllbright and Muskie, where beneficiaries are legally required to return to their home country for at least 2 years).

I am sure you realize that historically there is no native African population in Russia. A bit disingenuous to compare that to the African immigrant community in the US.

No dear, you misread. There are 2.1 million African-born immigrants in the US. As in, not born in the US and came to the US. In addition to the African-Americans. Thus your excuse for why there aren't more Africans in Russia is a failure.

Does Russia need an excuse for not having enough Africans? It's not an immigration state like America is, for better or worse. There isn't any organic reason for there to be a sizable African community in Russia.

FAIL. What you mean to say is that Russia is racist, does not like Africans, and the only reason they do things like pay Africans to go to college in Russia is for performative reasons to try and use it to expand their sphere of influence. But the Africans who've actually done it, experienced the "streets of Russia" for themselves see right through it, they see that they are unwelcome in Russia, and for that reason, do not choose to stay.

If there isn't an "organic reason" for Africans to be in Russia, then there isn't an organic reason for anyone to be there.

Would you say the same thing to, like, Iceland? Their African population is probably negligible.

Every foreign student who elects not to stay is doing it because they feel unwelcome? Hmmm. You think immigration laws have nothing to do with that? You have magic powers that see into the hearts of men and discern the reasons they do things? Okay. I suggest you take steps to monetize them. Magic powers are fleeting!

On second thought though, do continue. Never change. I'm just gonna sit here and enjoy the delicious irony of America accusing other countries of racism. While you ponder your next tirade, I'm gonna switch to the DCPS section and enjoy the hand-wringing about "school quality" and lottery agony by way of illustrations to the racism conundrum. Please do come up with something fresh in the meantime.

Why are you here? All you do is bash and accuse America of hypocrisy, racism, whatever else. It's clear you hate America. And you're probably also the same poster who has repeatedly talked about how much x costs in back home in a Russian supermarket, and who was whining that you have a Russian family member "suffering" because they are named on a sanctions list for supporting the war in Ukraine. So why are you even here at all, in this country that you spew so much bile and hatred for? If Russia is so great and wonderful and America is so awful, how about you go there, and leave the rest of us, who don't hate America, out of your delusional hateful diatribes?

(This is why, boys and girls, you can never have a sincere conversation with an American about America. It always comes to this. Always. Trust me on this. As an immigrant, there are certain things you are simply not allowed to say.)

Why am I here? I'm a DC area mom - just like you. This is a free forum.

I don't happen to hate America. There are many things here that are wonderful. America's foreign policy, though, is not one of them.

Do feel free to write to Jeff, though. Maybe he'd introduce a set of thought rules and principles one must embrace before posting here. Until then, I'm as free to post here as you are.

This is why you can't have a sincere conversation about Russia with you. It always comes to "What about America?" Always. Trust me on this.

You kinda walk into these things when you make sweeping statements like "don't invade other countries if you don't want bad things to happen to you!"

I mean, pot, meet kettle.

This was 100% a war of choice for Russia. Russia did not have to invade. Russia was under no credible threat. Russia had no business waging this war.

All consequences are thus on Russia.

And if you don't like it, complain to Putin. He could end this conflict tomorrow, by ordering a complete withdrawal and return to 1991 borders. The longer he refuses to do that, the more Russia brings suffering and consequences upon itself.

You Ukraine boosters really harp on these 1991 borders as if they were magical. They have in fact been particularly bad, and have been modified dozens of times since 1991. They reflect the political wrangling of an aged Soviet bureaucracy as the chaos of the end of Soviet era became apparent. There is nothing about them that should over-rule the desires of the people who actually live in a place. We ourselves have military enforced modifications to 1991 borders, with Serbia/Kosovo being the most obvious.

Returning to 1991 borders wouldn't solve the conflict, it just kicks the can down the road for a few years. You can't put Russians in an anti-Russian country and expect peace. The only reason you would want Crimea/Donbass now, is if you wanted to purposely abuse the Russian population there. Which after reading some of the most recent posts, makes me think there may be something to that.

Ukraine was nowhere near as "anti-Russian" as it is now, until Russia escalated in their meddling with their internal politics, until you started trying to divert them away from the EU and so on. For example, Yanukovich's betrayal of the people and the Verkhovna Rada's decision to start moving to the EU is what sparked things in 2014, and that was all Russia And then of course the final straw was - and then the Crimean invasion and the phony "independence referenda" that were staged in Donbas by Russian FSB. And you delusional idiots thinking that they would for some reason welcome you with open arms.

READ SOME HISTORY OF HOW THIS WAR ACTUALLY HAPPENED from a source that isn't Russian propaganda, and there may be something to that.

Blame yourselves.

You still didn't address the problem of what does Ukraine do with ~8 million Russians that don't want to be a part of Ukraine.

And as far as history, if your history doesn't include the words/phrases "NATO expansion", "Victoria Nusland", "Coup" and "Minsk Accords" its not a very accurate history.

You funny!! Ha, ha, ha. OMG you're just really trash, aren't you. This is really the dumbest thing I've read all week! Made by Friday, thank you!

The reason that 8 million people are not living in Ukraine are because Russia destroyed Ukrainian electricity generation, threatens tactical nuclear strikes, bombs civilian houses, commits war crimes against non-combatants and POW's alike.

The difference is "NATO expansion" was voluntary using a pen, not via invasion at the end of a gun barrel.

Victoria Nusland, so you got the hots for her or something? I don't get it but whatever floats your boat. Not really my thing, but good luck with that.

The Minsk Accords? You mean yet-another-gunboat-diplomacy document where Russia subjugates it's neighbors? The one that Russia violated by arming an insurrection in Donbas and engineer a coup-d'etat in '21? That Minsk Accord?

The more pro-Russian propaganda I read like the stuff you wrote, the less I feel any sympathy for Russia.

Thank you for steeling my resolve!!!!

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Anonymous wrote:There are photos of African diplomats in St. Petersburg meeting with Prigozhin, the head of Wagner.

I genuinely don't understand why countries like South Africa, the Central African Republic, Egypt, and Ethiopia are choosing to align themselves with Russia at this moment in time, particularly since Russia is destroying Ukraine's capacity to export grain to the region.

Pathetic.

The Cold War is over. These countries should be regarded as pariah states. No aid. No trade.

Because there’s nothing to be gained from Ukraine and they want the Russian grain. Among other reasons

Fair enough. But North America, Europe, and Asia do not need Africa. They are playing an incredibly stupid game, particularly South Africa and Ethiopia. Genuine idiots.

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This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

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Anonymous wrote:There are reports out there now that the NATO plan was based on assumption that Russia had a half decent military they would take Ukraine in a couple weeks; and a garrison of 500k soldiers would be required to stay indefinitely to pacify the country.

The original plan was to fund the insurgency and bankrupt Russia in 3 years.

This version looks like it will take more than 3 years, but kill a lot more Russians than planned….so everything works out!

If NATO was counting on Russians going insurgent against Russia, then they've become mentally broken by Iraq.

Ukrainians going insurgent against Russians.

But NATO got super lucky with a full on war killing thousands of Russians. NATO over achieved on this one. Can you even guess how many Russians have died, or lost limbs, or have mental/brain injuries from this war?

It is like a gift that keeps on giving.

Imagine that number and then add “Ukrainians”. They died too.

Yeah, the Ukrainians who were just living in their country and got invaded.
Russia is murdering lots of them, it sucks.

But super fun to watch videos and images of the Russian casualties. I am sure Russia enjoyed American losses in our wars - but Russia is soooooo much better at getting their soldiers killed and stuff blown up. Way more content. Russia is like the new Netflix for combat videos and what “not to do” to win a war. It is like one one ongoing epic fail.

Hilarious!

My poor sweet child, you’re a perfect consumer for these videos and you don’t even realize it. You’re like an uncompensated focus group. Not even a plate of stale cookies and a glass of juice made from concentrate.

Yeah, but I mean…isn’t that what PP said? I enjoy them too. There’s going to be a lot more coming out over the next two weeks.

It’s not what PP said…it’s what it says about PP. He’s like a kid at the checkout counter next to the crappiest candy placed at his eye level for a reason.

The Russian military is crappy; sure. But the videos of their soldiers being left behind when they fall off a vehicle (and then the vehicle that left him behind gets blown up) or the one when the boat takes off, soldier was not ready and falls in the water and the solider swims almost to shore but dies feet from the bank from the weight of his gear are classics!

Russians in combat could be almost as lucrative as the female Russian porn producers.

Downside is the combat stars seem to only make one video.

You are going to be SO disappointed when you see the list of ingredients of these videos....almost as much as a kid reading the list of ingredients on a crappy candy wrapper...if that kid could read, that is.

Yeah, really do not care what is in a Hershey bar.

Prefer Reese’s - but again, no idea what’s in it.

My personal favorite Russian combat video is the one when the Russian tank drives over their own Russian anti tank mine in PLAIN SIGHT and the first guy jumps out, on fire; clearly does not know he is missing a leg and rolls off the tank.

Then, this is even funnier; the second dude comes out - all bloody and smoking and clearly blinded/disoriented from the blast and gets out of the tank….only to fall on the one legged dude on fire!!!

LoL….you cannot write this stuff…the second guy catches on fire from the one legged guy and they roll around for a few minutes and die.

It should be on AFV. Totally would win at least 10k.

Anonymous wrote:The sweetest irony of all is that the only thing these obnoxious pro-Russia trolls have ever accomplished here on DCUM is to even further annoy and alienate Americans and turn them against Russia even harder.

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This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

No. The sanctions did that. Sanctions for invading other countries are not automatic, they are a choice, and it's bullshit if you pretend otherwise.

What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?

LOL why don't you ask W Bush? Or your best friends the Al-Sauds and Al-Maktoums? They'd know. I mean ask Colin Powell, he's here in McLean. Should be an interesting convo.

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This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

No. The sanctions did that. Sanctions for invading other countries are not automatic, they are a choice, and it's bullshit if you pretend otherwise.

What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?

LOL why don't you ask W Bush? Or your best friends the Al-Sauds and Al-Maktoums? They'd know. I mean ask Colin Powell, he's here in McLean. Should be an interesting convo.

Putin should have studied the Iraq War. I'm sure he's marveling how the Americans kept their vehicles gassed up all the way to Baghdad, while his gas station country had to ditch and start hitchhiking halfway to Kyiv.

That's Afghanistan, not Iraq, as you may (or may not?) be aware. Also where the Soviets didn't have a good time of it.

In any event since you seem to know Russia a bit...in your opinion, why are the Russians so incompetent?

Didn't I say "another invasion"?

You continue to bring up Iraq for some reason. Didn't the Americans accomplish their military objective and take Baghdad and Saddam? Again, how were the Russians so grossly incompetent when it came to Kyiv and Zelensky?

I can't help it when you keep saying silly things like:

"What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?"

You make it too easy. Like shooting fish in a barrel.

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This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

No. The sanctions did that. Sanctions for invading other countries are not automatic, they are a choice, and it's bullshit if you pretend otherwise.

What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?

LOL why don't you ask W Bush? Or your best friends the Al-Sauds and Al-Maktoums? They'd know. I mean ask Colin Powell, he's here in McLean. Should be an interesting convo.

Putin should have studied the Iraq War. I'm sure he's marveling how the Americans kept their vehicles gassed up all the way to Baghdad, while his gas station country had to ditch and start hitchhiking halfway to Kyiv.

That's Afghanistan, not Iraq, as you may (or may not?) be aware. Also where the Soviets didn't have a good time of it.

In any event since you seem to know Russia a bit...in your opinion, why are the Russians so incompetent?

Didn't I say "another invasion"?

You continue to bring up Iraq for some reason. Didn't the Americans accomplish their military objective and take Baghdad and Saddam? Again, how were the Russians so grossly incompetent when it came to Kyiv and Zelensky?

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This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

No. The sanctions did that. Sanctions for invading other countries are not automatic, they are a choice, and it's bullshit if you pretend otherwise.

What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?

LOL why don't you ask W Bush? Or your best friends the Al-Sauds and Al-Maktoums? They'd know. I mean ask Colin Powell, he's here in McLean. Should be an interesting convo.

Putin should have studied the Iraq War. I'm sure he's marveling how the Americans kept their vehicles gassed up all the way to Baghdad, while his gas station country had to ditch and start hitchhiking halfway to Kyiv.

That's Afghanistan, not Iraq, as you may (or may not?) be aware. Also where the Soviets didn't have a good time of it.

In any event since you seem to know Russia a bit...in your opinion, why are the Russians so incompetent?

Didn't I say "another invasion"?

You continue to bring up Iraq for some reason. Didn't the Americans accomplish their military objective and take Baghdad and Saddam? Again, how were the Russians so grossly incompetent when it came to Kyiv and Zelensky?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

No. The sanctions did that. Sanctions for invading other countries are not automatic, they are a choice, and it's bullshit if you pretend otherwise.

What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?

LOL why don't you ask W Bush? Or your best friends the Al-Sauds and Al-Maktoums? They'd know. I mean ask Colin Powell, he's here in McLean. Should be an interesting convo.

Putin should have studied the Iraq War. I'm sure he's marveling how the Americans kept their vehicles gassed up all the way to Baghdad, while his gas station country had to ditch and start hitchhiking halfway to Kyiv.

That's Afghanistan, not Iraq, as you may (or may not?) be aware. Also where the Soviets didn't have a good time of it.

In any event since you seem to know Russia a bit...in your opinion, why are the Russians so incompetent?

Didn't I say "another invasion"?

You continue to bring up Iraq for some reason. Didn't the Americans accomplish their military objective and take Baghdad and Saddam? Again, how were the Russians so grossly incompetent when it came to Kyiv and Zelensky?

I can't help it when you keep saying silly things like:

"What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?"

You make it too easy. Like shooting fish in a barrel.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

No. The sanctions did that. Sanctions for invading other countries are not automatic, they are a choice, and it's bullshit if you pretend otherwise.

What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?

LOL why don't you ask W Bush? Or your best friends the Al-Sauds and Al-Maktoums? They'd know. I mean ask Colin Powell, he's here in McLean. Should be an interesting convo.

Putin should have studied the Iraq War. I'm sure he's marveling how the Americans kept their vehicles gassed up all the way to Baghdad, while his gas station country had to ditch and start hitchhiking halfway to Kyiv.

That's Afghanistan, not Iraq, as you may (or may not?) be aware. Also where the Soviets didn't have a good time of it.

In any event since you seem to know Russia a bit...in your opinion, why are the Russians so incompetent?

Didn't I say "another invasion"?

You continue to bring up Iraq for some reason. Didn't the Americans accomplish their military objective and take Baghdad and Saddam? Again, how were the Russians so grossly incompetent when it came to Kyiv and Zelensky?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

No. The sanctions did that. Sanctions for invading other countries are not automatic, they are a choice, and it's bullshit if you pretend otherwise.

What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?

LOL why don't you ask W Bush? Or your best friends the Al-Sauds and Al-Maktoums? They'd know. I mean ask Colin Powell, he's here in McLean. Should be an interesting convo.

Putin should have studied the Iraq War. I'm sure he's marveling how the Americans kept their vehicles gassed up all the way to Baghdad, while his gas station country had to ditch and start hitchhiking halfway to Kyiv.

That's Afghanistan, not Iraq, as you may (or may not?) be aware. Also where the Soviets didn't have a good time of it.

In any event since you seem to know Russia a bit...in your opinion, why are the Russians so incompetent?

Didn't I say "another invasion"?

You continue to bring up Iraq for some reason. Didn't the Americans accomplish their military objective and take Baghdad and Saddam? Again, how were the Russians so grossly incompetent when it came to Kyiv and Zelensky?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

No. The sanctions did that. Sanctions for invading other countries are not automatic, they are a choice, and it's bullshit if you pretend otherwise.

What about invading a country? Is that a choice, or is it automatic?

LOL why don't you ask W Bush? Or your best friends the Al-Sauds and Al-Maktoums? They'd know. I mean ask Colin Powell, he's here in McLean. Should be an interesting convo.

Putin should have studied the Iraq War. I'm sure he's marveling how the Americans kept their vehicles gassed up all the way to Baghdad, while his gas station country had to ditch and start hitchhiking halfway to Kyiv.

That's Afghanistan, not Iraq, as you may (or may not?) be aware. Also where the Soviets didn't have a good time of it.

In any event since you seem to know Russia a bit...in your opinion, why are the Russians so incompetent?

Didn't I say "another invasion"?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This thread has to been taken over by a clownish pro-Russian troll who claims the most laughably fake stuff, and a pro-Ukrainian over-enthusiastic poster who goes crazy refuting them.

You two suck all the air out of the discussion, because no one else can get a word in when you bicker and clog up the thread.

The point of a discussion is that we can all contribute. It would be nice if you could both calm down and post less. Only one of you is a troll at the service of a dictator, but the other is honestly also getting pretty annoying.

Thank you for saying this!

There are least three of us currently shoving back on the hypocrisy about Iraq and such. You can pick it up by writing styles and time-stamps if you know what to look for.

Call us stooges, trolls, bots or what have you, but you're hearing a chorus not a soloist.

No, I actually agree with you and I am sad you get branded as trolls.
Not saying Russia is a knight in shining armor but come on?? Everybody does it (if they are big enough) so the outrage is a little hypocritical

"Everyone does it so Russia should be allowed to invade Ukraine too!" Again, the fallacy of two wrongs somehow making a right - it's a fail.

Also, did the US remain in Iraq? No. And it was never the intention of the US to remain indefinitely. Given the rationalization of "well the US did it, so..." then tell me exactly when Russia plans to leave Ukraine, after invading? Because, Russia has EVERY intention of keeping Ukraine indefinitely. "Well, it's always been OUR Crimea" and "Well we need space between us and NATO" and worst of all, "Well, Ukraine was never really a country and Ukrainians are all just Russians so it's not really even an invasion to conquer it."

SO MUCH bullshit rhetoric from the Russia side, yet you want to sit there like it's all just some hypocritical manufactured outrage from Americans? Come on, man. You cannot be serious.

Wait wait don't tell me....are you admitting the invasion of Iraq was...drrrumm roll....wrong?

How are you going to atone? Give up your foreign assets? Disconnect yourself from SWIFT? Come on, I wanna see some self flagellation.

Are you new to the US? Have you been under a rock for the last 20 years?

Please explain how America's sins in Iraq have affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

Please do tell how Russia's invasion of Ukraine has affected your travel, your finances, and your foreign holdings. How did collective responsibility affect you specifically?

I don't live in Russia so it hasn't, but my family does and it has affected them.

DP.
I am in the same situation .
Costs me x2-3 in time and money to visit my elderly parents
Certain medications are no more

That's what Putin chose for you, and doesn't care that you have to deal with it.

No. The sanctions did that. Sanctions for invading other countries are not automatic, they are a choice, and it's bullshit if you pretend otherwise.

Well, Putin chose to gamble that the West wouldn't rally against him, and he was wrong. He chose poorly.