Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 17:28     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
There will always be many families who choose to live near well regarded parochial schools and send their kids there for religious immersion. Whether its Holy redeemer in the Kesington Parkwood neighborhood (highly rated school) or St Bernadettes near Montgomery Knolls/Pine crest (a transitional school). Parochial school enrollments are up in both types of neighborhoods - perhaps more in response to 2.0 rather than low income classmates
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 16:19     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Have you been in a dcc elementary neighborhood recently. There are many middle class families moving in esp close in. Homes are selling and rents are through the roof. Any family paying between 2-3 k for a two bedroom apartment is middle class


I have. We left. The families were middle class. They weren't the ones attending our neighborhood elementary. Silver spring has much looser zoning regulations than places like Bethesda, which means you can have middle class neighborhoods adjacent to large areas of low income housing. So yes, lots of middle class families who could afford parochial.


However, I don't think that the solution to this problem is segregating poor people even more than they are already segregated, in Montgomery County.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 16:15     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:Have you been in a dcc elementary neighborhood recently. There are many middle class families moving in esp close in. Homes are selling and rents are through the roof. Any family paying between 2-3 k for a two bedroom apartment is middle class


I have. We left. The families were middle class. They weren't the ones attending our neighborhood elementary. Silver spring has much looser zoning regulations than places like Bethesda, which means you can have middle class neighborhoods adjacent to large areas of low income housing. So yes, lots of middle class families who could afford parochial.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 15:29     Subject: Re:Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
700k for a modest sized home, in ok condition just so your child can go to an over crowded school or an excessively long commute that diminishes quality of life is getting harder and harder to justify. Especially when things in western schools aren't guaranteed to always be stellar.
as pp stated, near in dcc neighborhoods where you can get a home any where between 400-800K are seeing great home sales. Middle class flight is not that obvious if you live here


Yes. In the past with acceleration, your child could at least work at a more appropriate pace. The teaching may have been hit or miss but at least everyone was not held back by the curriculum. Spending more for the better clusters made sense back then because your child was able to work at an appropriate academic pace and be surrounded by peers who were serious about school. Now, all schools and all children are held back 2 years in equivalent to where they previously worked so why bother to spend the extra money and commute?
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 15:16     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
mcps doesn't have to do much to attract middle class families. housing prices in the area will take care of it. middle class families, especially those with government jobs are less and less being able to afford the 'better' clusters. 700k for a modest sized home, in ok condition just so your child can go to an over crowded school or an excessively long commute that diminishes quality of life is getting harder and harder to justify. Especially when things in western schools aren't guaranteed to always be stellar.
as pp stated, near in dcc neighborhoods where you can get a home any where between 400-800K are seeing great home sales. Middle class flight is not that obvious if you live here
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 14:58     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Have you been in a dcc elementary neighborhood recently. There are many middle class families moving in esp close in. Homes are selling and rents are through the roof. Any family paying between 2-3 k for a two bedroom apartment is middle class
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 14:43     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:"Caring about what will bring middle class families back to declining red zone schools should be part of their plan"

Agree. It is if course not feasible to improve the red zone schools by busing those kids over west. There are plenty of middle class families in the red zone - if MCPS focused on drawing them back in more that would help a lot.


They won't do this because it would require them to put money into programs or facilities that appeal to middle class families, which would look bad if it reduced the funding that is used to directly fund programs for at risk populations. The very real benefit of middle class integration in the classroom is too intangible to displace the priorities as they currently exist. What this means is middle class flight will continue, and the red zone's challenges will continue to grow. It's almost like MCPS needs a complete system re-boot because its current trajectory has predictable results for the red zone. Honestly, what will the DCC look like in 10 years? The green zone will continue to churn out well-educated kids who are appropriately challenged in the classroom. Nothing to worry about there, except for overcrowding.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 12:56     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
"Caring about what will bring middle class families back to declining red zone schools should be part of their plan"

Agree. It is if course not feasible to improve the red zone schools by busing those kids over west. There are plenty of middle class families in the red zone - if MCPS focused on drawing them back in more that would help a lot.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 12:16     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:

My guess is because it isn't politically correct. The lower classes would be all Hispanic and some African Americans. Add one or two snowflakes and there will be complaints. I grew up in tracked schools and they worked wonderful but this area here clearly shows that different cultures and races perform vastly different. They believe by putting blinders on, the kids will somehow work better together and close the gap. But kids know by 2nd grade who the smart and struggling kids are and keeping them together doesn't seem to work for anyone.


Which track were you in?
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 12:15     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:
MCPS enrollment will never drop because they build more homes, condos, townhouses and apartments to overcrowd the schools every year. But yes homeschooling has gone up the last 10 years and all the privates have massive wait lists. Not sure about parochial.


I'm waiting for data. Thanks.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 12:06     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

I agree and HGC are just a scam to increase lower performing school's grades. Your kid needs to get up earlier, deal with long commute rides to and from and not get home until after 4pm. Plus they are the outsiders of the school. Go in at 4th and never fit it in. My friend's child left mid year due to playground bullying and missing his neighborhood friends. It isn't ideal. But I agree that the ones who are almost at the top suffer the most. We pulled my oldest to private school on 70% financial aid. Best thing we ever did. I wanted to believe in MCPS but after 4 years of constant decline and supplementing at home, we looked for a change and it worked. I agree the gap continues to widen because the average kid's families are getting fed up and moving, leaving for private, parochial or homeschooling.


And you have enrollment data to support this, right? Enrollment at MCPS is dropping? Enrollment in private schools in the area is booming?

MCPS enrollment will never drop because they build more homes, condos, townhouses and apartments to overcrowd the schools every year. But yes homeschooling has gone up the last 10 years and all the privates have massive wait lists. Not sure about parochial. [/quote

Right - I am among the countless middle class families that finally gave up on MCPS. Most of my neighbors went parochial. For every one of our children that left the system, I'm sure they were replaced by children in the neighboring apartment complex. Enrollment is certainly going up, but at least where I'm from, middle class participation is on the decline. That may not be the case in the green zone, but things are getting bad enough in certain parts of the red zone. I may not have hard data, but I've seen it in action. MCPS turns a blind eye to this trend. Caring about what will bring middle class families back to declining red zone schools should be part of their plan, but it's not. I think MCPS has lost its way.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 10:22     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

I agree and HGC are just a scam to increase lower performing school's grades. Your kid needs to get up earlier, deal with long commute rides to and from and not get home until after 4pm. Plus they are the outsiders of the school. Go in at 4th and never fit it in. My friend's child left mid year due to playground bullying and missing his neighborhood friends. It isn't ideal. But I agree that the ones who are almost at the top suffer the most. We pulled my oldest to private school on 70% financial aid. Best thing we ever did. I wanted to believe in MCPS but after 4 years of constant decline and supplementing at home, we looked for a change and it worked. I agree the gap continues to widen because the average kid's families are getting fed up and moving, leaving for private, parochial or homeschooling.


And you have enrollment data to support this, right? Enrollment at MCPS is dropping? Enrollment in private schools in the area is booming?

MCPS enrollment will never drop because they build more homes, condos, townhouses and apartments to overcrowd the schools every year. But yes homeschooling has gone up the last 10 years and all the privates have massive wait lists. Not sure about parochial.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 10:19     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:I just can't understand why montgomery county teach the students at their level. If 5th grader can learn 7th math but manages only 5th grade English, promote him/her to 7th grader math but attend 5th grade English class. If a 6th grader can learn 8th grade English but feel more comfortable in6th grade science class, let her/him take the appropriate classes. Each student is evaluated for each class regularly, and allowed to skip a grade or two in the subject after a promotion test. Since all the classes are offered in each school, no extra resource will be needed. This way, each student is taught to his's/her potential. The school can mix the promoted students with the on grade students to achieve diversity.


My guess is because it isn't politically correct. The lower classes would be all Hispanic and some African Americans. Add one or two snowflakes and there will be complaints. I grew up in tracked schools and they worked wonderful but this area here clearly shows that different cultures and races perform vastly different. They believe by putting blinders on, the kids will somehow work better together and close the gap. But kids know by 2nd grade who the smart and struggling kids are and keeping them together doesn't seem to work for anyone.
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 10:16     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:

I agree and HGC are just a scam to increase lower performing school's grades. Your kid needs to get up earlier, deal with long commute rides to and from and not get home until after 4pm. Plus they are the outsiders of the school. Go in at 4th and never fit it in. My friend's child left mid year due to playground bullying and missing his neighborhood friends. It isn't ideal. But I agree that the ones who are almost at the top suffer the most. We pulled my oldest to private school on 70% financial aid. Best thing we ever did. I wanted to believe in MCPS but after 4 years of constant decline and supplementing at home, we looked for a change and it worked. I agree the gap continues to widen because the average kid's families are getting fed up and moving, leaving for private, parochial or homeschooling.


And you have enrollment data to support this, right? Enrollment at MCPS is dropping? Enrollment in private schools in the area is booming?
Anonymous
Post 04/28/2014 10:14     Subject: Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools
Anonymous wrote:MCPS has a lot to deal with. In schools where the majority of the kids struggle, the resources are almost entirely dedicated to the kids who are not meeting the standard the school is aiming toward.

This is necessary. However, students who are average or above average will get little or no attention. If they can get into Highly Gifted program, they are in good shape. Those students who just miss out on Highly gifted but who don't need lots of extra help are left out entirely. Parents of these students are going to move out of these districts if they can afford to and the gap widens.

This is our situation. We tried to stay in a struggling school but our kid wasn't struggling so there was nothing to offer him. He finished his work and was not challenged because it was just him and maybe one other kid in class who could do the work. The teacher needed to focus on the kids who needed help. There was no time to help kids who wanted work to get an ES.

To keep parents quiet, kids get an ES or two. The might deserve it but they certainly didn't get the ES level work that they needed. It's not the teacher's fault but it's just the way it is.


I agree and HGC are just a scam to increase lower performing school's grades. Your kid needs to get up earlier, deal with long commute rides to and from and not get home until after 4pm. Plus they are the outsiders of the school. Go in at 4th and never fit it in. My friend's child left mid year due to playground bullying and missing his neighborhood friends. It isn't ideal. But I agree that the ones who are almost at the top suffer the most. We pulled my oldest to private school on 70% financial aid. Best thing we ever did. I wanted to believe in MCPS but after 4 years of constant decline and supplementing at home, we looked for a change and it worked. I agree the gap continues to widen because the average kid's families are getting fed up and moving, leaving for private, parochial or homeschooling.