Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH and I are equally hands on with the kids and many household tasks. But we try to be aware of our own strengths and weaknesses and divide things accordingly; for example, I’m good at details and remembering things, he’s good at managing larger projects, interacting with people, and physical tasks.

But man oh man does he struggle to do any simple housework WHILE tending to a kid. If our oldest (elementary age) kid is doing something independently he’s fine, but we also have a preschooler and a toddler, and he cannot take care of them AND make breakfast or fold laundry without everyone in tears. To be clear he doesn’t refuse to do it, he does it, but inevitably he’s in a terrible mood afterward, the kids are grumpy, and the area where he was is a MESS that later has to be cleaned up when the kids are elsewhere.

I am sympathetic to his adhd, which he otherwise manages well, and was thinking about the other thread about parenting with adhd.

Any suggestions about what can be done to help him? Or should we just say this is something he’s bad at, and he has to either be doing housework or taking care of the little kids but not both at once?

Why does your husband have to do housework AND tend to the kid at the same time? Why can't he do one thing at a time? Or just let some housework go? Does the laundry HAVE to be folded? Why can't he just dump it in a drawer and call it a day?

Anonymous wrote:My DH and I are equally hands on with the kids and many household tasks. But we try to be aware of our own strengths and weaknesses and divide things accordingly; for example, I’m good at details and remembering things, he’s good at managing larger projects, interacting with people, and physical tasks.

But man oh man does he struggle to do any simple housework WHILE tending to a kid. If our oldest (elementary age) kid is doing something independently he’s fine, but we also have a preschooler and a toddler, and he cannot take care of them AND make breakfast or fold laundry without everyone in tears. To be clear he doesn’t refuse to do it, he does it, but inevitably he’s in a terrible mood afterward, the kids are grumpy, and the area where he was is a MESS that later has to be cleaned up when the kids are elsewhere.

I am sympathetic to his adhd, which he otherwise manages well, and was thinking about the other thread about parenting with adhd.

Any suggestions about what can be done to help him? Or should we just say this is something he’s bad at, and he has to either be doing housework or taking care of the little kids but not both at once?

Anonymous wrote:
Maybe it seems like a semantic quibble, but I don't think so, because there are important parts of parenting that are exclusive to parenting that people with ADHD are more likely to excel at. For example, in teaching your child-- which is, in fact, exclusive to parenting-- being willing to admit when you're wrong, to see things from your child's perspective, to open up worlds for them, come up with creative activities, and so on. Again, not everyone with ADHD is awesome in all these ways, but not everyone with ADHD is near-useless at managing a household or setting boundaries. Especially more likely that moms with ADHD are halfway decent at those household management things.

Anonymous wrote:PP, I was the one who made the coparenting comment. The compulsory parts of parenting (laundry! Schedule! Chores! Good!) are the ones that happen over and over on a schedule that’s not fungible. So by definition, a spouse that can’t pull their fair share of weight in those areas is not coparenting equally. Sure, the traits you describe are important to parenting, but they’re not exclusive to people with ADHD and frankly many people with ADHD who do have talents in those areas have trouble deploying those emotional resources in a timely and effective way if there is any other practical demand on their plate.

So I will stand by my comment that ADHD parents are not equal coparents. They can be good parents for sure- no one here is arguing about that- but their deficits mean that their fellow parent will not have an equal partner in the work of parenting their children.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone questioning why this has to do with ADHD has never experienced a spouse or child with ADHD.

I'm an NT wife to an ADHD husband. Things that I can do simply are things he just can't do. I'm not knocking ADHD, but just that they have a lot of trouble with managing a couple tasks at a time that others would be able to do.

10.18 again.

I'm a nanny specializing in adhd, odd and ocd. While I understand his perspective and struggles, he can learn, he just has to choose to do so. It may take a lot of help from you.

No (and yes re: the help piece). I have ADHD and there are many things we can't simply "learn" no matter how much we "want" to or "choose to do so." It's tremendously demoralizing!

What we CAN do...

-sometimes

-with a lot of effort

-and with just okay, but perhaps acceptable, results

...is to use tools and the support of other humans to get better at some things.

Not just "learn to do it" via practice or whatever. Or worse "sucking it up!" Most of us try to just brute force these things because we self-flagellate. "I'm a smart person! This shouldn't be that hard!"

But it doesn't work, or not consistently or for long.

For me, I turn into the grumpy mess others and the OP describe. It's sensory and attentional overload. Everything feels like a priority, so nothing is.

Folks w/ADHD seem like they'd be great at multitasking, and often think they are. But we're good at a specific kind of multi-tasking which is really just allowing or forcing our brains to focus by doing something active and which uses a different part of the brain. Writing or taking a meeting while on a treadmill. Discussing charged or complicated issues while putting laundry away. Typically we do something physically active and/or "mindless" while doing something that requires mindful concentration. This can work.

But even discussing a big planned expense with my husband while doing dishes is not the same as trying to keep track of multiple kids while doing dishes. (And dishes IMO are much more mindless than some other chores, like "picking things up and putting them away" which is a huge challenge to executive function for folks w/ADHD, even without any other distractions!)

Even if you aren't "engaging" little kids, and even if you set them up with some activity (and that takes executive function and planning!), small kids need to be monitored at least somewhat, they get into things, they fight at times, they say, "Mama, look!!" every two seconds. As many NT people said, this is hard for a lot of people. But for a person with ADHD, their brains CANNOT ignore that "Mama, look!!" and get irritable and frustrated. It feels urgent every single time, because a hallmark of ADHD is that we are great at taking in all kinds of information-- facts, sensory info, whatever-- but terrible at prioritizing it. It also takes executive function to figure out how to get kids to "help" in some way. It can be done, and I've done it with a lot of mental prep and buy-in that it's better for the kids in the long-term. But it's yet another thing it's hard to wrap an ADHD brain around.

I suspect the posters asking what any of this has to do with ADHD know very little about ADHD.

Anyway.

What would work best for me would be to not have to do both things at once. Period.

Second to that, to do the things that are the most rote and require the least conscious thought or proprioception skills (my biggest sensory issues). Making breakfast is a bit rough. The simpler it is, the better. Cereal, oatmeal, something prepped I can stick in the microwave. Breakfast foods placed in the same area of the kitchen every time, the same part of the fridge-- maybe even a short checklist-- "first pour three glasses of milk, then get fruit from the specific drawer, then get prepped oatmeal from the fridge and heat it up for exactly X seconds..." I have an IQ of 151, by the way.

Some things, like folding laundry-- I can do this, but I have developed a system over many years, so it IS mindless. But for others, it's not, because they don't know what's "hangy or foldy" as my husband says. Or they don't know which things belong to which kids (DH may need a primer). ADHDers, and especially men who haven't been conditioned, often can't tell, like... navy blue from black.

It's just not simple.

But those are the kinds of things that can help. Not just "practice." But actual tools and support.

Now, there's a whole 'nother issue in here about sexism and social conditioning. I am better-equipped to do some of these things than most men with ADHD because I've been more forced to learn them by exposure and societal expectations. Generally speaking, I firmly believe men shouldn't get a pass on ~*domestic duties*~ just because they traditionally have, or because "I really prefer grocery shopping anyway" or whatever. But people with ADHD really do have specific challenges and do need specific support for them.

I'm a DH with ADHD and the only problem I have with some of this is that it is kinda limiting. Like you said with Laundry, I have to develop "systems" to keep myself on track so I can watch the kids while cooking or washing dishes or sweeping the floor. Its been a trial and error thing and I've made my share of mistakes and been distracted a lot, but I have something now that I think works for me, at least at this phase of their lives.

One thing you said is that we CANNOT ignore the "mama look" comments. One thing is that I don't necessarily want to ignore those comments because it could be something drastic. Just like I have to remember to look up from doing the dishes to make sure that the kids don't hurt themselves when they're running across the living room and jumping off couches.

Part of my system is keeping my body active so I'm not just doing dishes. It may be just some mini jumping jacks, or maybe I'll wash a few dishes and do a lap around the kitchen. But the challenges from ADHD come when I'm busy thinking about say this comment, or something that had my interest at work or a puzzle I was doing earlier or a thousand other things that are more interesting than the dishes. Doing the laps helps me to not think about this stuff, so I think it has helped me to do better around the house.

Now, I'm not asking you to get a report from my wife on this because I'm sure I'm not perfect on chores yet, but I think I am getting better since DW and I had a conversation about my being distracted. So I think it can be improved. I'm not saying that my method works for everybody or even anybody other than me, but seeing that I'm getting better and reading your comment starts to put doubt into my mind - maybe I'm not understanding the situation, maybe I'm not doing well, maybe ADHD wasn't what was distracting me, maybe I can't get better. I don't know. But just thought I'd share.

Anonymous wrote:We have a similar issue. For me, it was coming to acceptance that he just could not do both. He is still a major team player. As the kids get older, it gets easier.

There are things I simply don’t do — like deal with the yard or cars. So, it all sort of evens out over time.

Anonymous wrote:PP, I was the one who made the coparenting comment. The compulsory parts of parenting (laundry! Schedule! Chores! Good!) are the ones that happen over and over on a schedule that’s not fungible. So by definition, a spouse that can’t pull their fair share of weight in those areas is not coparenting equally. Sure, the traits you describe are important to parenting, but they’re not exclusive to people with ADHD and frankly many people with ADHD who do have talents in those areas have trouble deploying those emotional resources in a timely and effective way if there is any other practical demand on their plate.

So I will stand by my comment that ADHD parents are not equal coparents. They can be good parents for sure- no one here is arguing about that- but their deficits mean that their fellow parent will not have an equal partner in the work of parenting their children.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone questioning why this has to do with ADHD has never experienced a spouse or child with ADHD.

I'm an NT wife to an ADHD husband. Things that I can do simply are things he just can't do. I'm not knocking ADHD, but just that they have a lot of trouble with managing a couple tasks at a time that others would be able to do.

10.18 again.

I'm a nanny specializing in adhd, odd and ocd. While I understand his perspective and struggles, he can learn, he just has to choose to do so. It may take a lot of help from you.

No (and yes re: the help piece). I have ADHD and there are many things we can't simply "learn" no matter how much we "want" to or "choose to do so." It's tremendously demoralizing!

What we CAN do...

-sometimes

-with a lot of effort

-and with just okay, but perhaps acceptable, results

...is to use tools and the support of other humans to get better at some things.

Not just "learn to do it" via practice or whatever. Or worse "sucking it up!" Most of us try to just brute force these things because we self-flagellate. "I'm a smart person! This shouldn't be that hard!"

But it doesn't work, or not consistently or for long.

For me, I turn into the grumpy mess others and the OP describe. It's sensory and attentional overload. Everything feels like a priority, so nothing is.

Folks w/ADHD seem like they'd be great at multitasking, and often think they are. But we're good at a specific kind of multi-tasking which is really just allowing or forcing our brains to focus by doing something active and which uses a different part of the brain. Writing or taking a meeting while on a treadmill. Discussing charged or complicated issues while putting laundry away. Typically we do something physically active and/or "mindless" while doing something that requires mindful concentration. This can work.

But even discussing a big planned expense with my husband while doing dishes is not the same as trying to keep track of multiple kids while doing dishes. (And dishes IMO are much more mindless than some other chores, like "picking things up and putting them away" which is a huge challenge to executive function for folks w/ADHD, even without any other distractions!)

Even if you aren't "engaging" little kids, and even if you set them up with some activity (and that takes executive function and planning!), small kids need to be monitored at least somewhat, they get into things, they fight at times, they say, "Mama, look!!" every two seconds. As many NT people said, this is hard for a lot of people. But for a person with ADHD, their brains CANNOT ignore that "Mama, look!!" and get irritable and frustrated. It feels urgent every single time, because a hallmark of ADHD is that we are great at taking in all kinds of information-- facts, sensory info, whatever-- but terrible at prioritizing it. It also takes executive function to figure out how to get kids to "help" in some way. It can be done, and I've done it with a lot of mental prep and buy-in that it's better for the kids in the long-term. But it's yet another thing it's hard to wrap an ADHD brain around.

I suspect the posters asking what any of this has to do with ADHD know very little about ADHD.

Anyway.

What would work best for me would be to not have to do both things at once. Period.

Second to that, to do the things that are the most rote and require the least conscious thought or proprioception skills (my biggest sensory issues). Making breakfast is a bit rough. The simpler it is, the better. Cereal, oatmeal, something prepped I can stick in the microwave. Breakfast foods placed in the same area of the kitchen every time, the same part of the fridge-- maybe even a short checklist-- "first pour three glasses of milk, then get fruit from the specific drawer, then get prepped oatmeal from the fridge and heat it up for exactly X seconds..." I have an IQ of 151, by the way.

Some things, like folding laundry-- I can do this, but I have developed a system over many years, so it IS mindless. But for others, it's not, because they don't know what's "hangy or foldy" as my husband says. Or they don't know which things belong to which kids (DH may need a primer). ADHDers, and especially men who haven't been conditioned, often can't tell, like... navy blue from black.

It's just not simple.

But those are the kinds of things that can help. Not just "practice." But actual tools and support.

Now, there's a whole 'nother issue in here about sexism and social conditioning. I am better-equipped to do some of these things than most men with ADHD because I've been more forced to learn them by exposure and societal expectations. Generally speaking, I firmly believe men shouldn't get a pass on ~*domestic duties*~ just because they traditionally have, or because "I really prefer grocery shopping anyway" or whatever. But people with ADHD really do have specific challenges and do need specific support for them.

I'm a DH with ADHD and the only problem I have with some of this is that it is kinda limiting. Like you said with Laundry, I have to develop "systems" to keep myself on track so I can watch the kids while cooking or washing dishes or sweeping the floor. Its been a trial and error thing and I've made my share of mistakes and been distracted a lot, but I have something now that I think works for me, at least at this phase of their lives.

One thing you said is that we CANNOT ignore the "mama look" comments. One thing is that I don't necessarily want to ignore those comments because it could be something drastic. Just like I have to remember to look up from doing the dishes to make sure that the kids don't hurt themselves when they're running across the living room and jumping off couches.

Part of my system is keeping my body active so I'm not just doing dishes. It may be just some mini jumping jacks, or maybe I'll wash a few dishes and do a lap around the kitchen. But the challenges from ADHD come when I'm busy thinking about say this comment, or something that had my interest at work or a puzzle I was doing earlier or a thousand other things that are more interesting than the dishes. Doing the laps helps me to not think about this stuff, so I think it has helped me to do better around the house.

Now, I'm not asking you to get a report from my wife on this because I'm sure I'm not perfect on chores yet, but I think I am getting better since DW and I had a conversation about my being distracted. So I think it can be improved. I'm not saying that my method works for everybody or even anybody other than me, but seeing that I'm getting better and reading your comment starts to put doubt into my mind - maybe I'm not understanding the situation, maybe I'm not doing well, maybe ADHD wasn't what was distracting me, maybe I can't get better. I don't know. But just thought I'd share.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone questioning why this has to do with ADHD has never experienced a spouse or child with ADHD.

I'm an NT wife to an ADHD husband. Things that I can do simply are things he just can't do. I'm not knocking ADHD, but just that they have a lot of trouble with managing a couple tasks at a time that others would be able to do.

10.18 again.

I'm a nanny specializing in adhd, odd and ocd. While I understand his perspective and struggles, he can learn, he just has to choose to do so. It may take a lot of help from you.

No (and yes re: the help piece). I have ADHD and there are many things we can't simply "learn" no matter how much we "want" to or "choose to do so." It's tremendously demoralizing!

What we CAN do...

-sometimes

-with a lot of effort

-and with just okay, but perhaps acceptable, results

...is to use tools and the support of other humans to get better at some things.

Not just "learn to do it" via practice or whatever. Or worse "sucking it up!" Most of us try to just brute force these things because we self-flagellate. "I'm a smart person! This shouldn't be that hard!"

But it doesn't work, or not consistently or for long.

For me, I turn into the grumpy mess others and the OP describe. It's sensory and attentional overload. Everything feels like a priority, so nothing is.

Folks w/ADHD seem like they'd be great at multitasking, and often think they are. But we're good at a specific kind of multi-tasking which is really just allowing or forcing our brains to focus by doing something active and which uses a different part of the brain. Writing or taking a meeting while on a treadmill. Discussing charged or complicated issues while putting laundry away. Typically we do something physically active and/or "mindless" while doing something that requires mindful concentration. This can work.

But even discussing a big planned expense with my husband while doing dishes is not the same as trying to keep track of multiple kids while doing dishes. (And dishes IMO are much more mindless than some other chores, like "picking things up and putting them away" which is a huge challenge to executive function for folks w/ADHD, even without any other distractions!)

Even if you aren't "engaging" little kids, and even if you set them up with some activity (and that takes executive function and planning!), small kids need to be monitored at least somewhat, they get into things, they fight at times, they say, "Mama, look!!" every two seconds. As many NT people said, this is hard for a lot of people. But for a person with ADHD, their brains CANNOT ignore that "Mama, look!!" and get irritable and frustrated. It feels urgent every single time, because a hallmark of ADHD is that we are great at taking in all kinds of information-- facts, sensory info, whatever-- but terrible at prioritizing it. It also takes executive function to figure out how to get kids to "help" in some way. It can be done, and I've done it with a lot of mental prep and buy-in that it's better for the kids in the long-term. But it's yet another thing it's hard to wrap an ADHD brain around.

I suspect the posters asking what any of this has to do with ADHD know very little about ADHD.

Anyway.

What would work best for me would be to not have to do both things at once. Period.

Second to that, to do the things that are the most rote and require the least conscious thought or proprioception skills (my biggest sensory issues). Making breakfast is a bit rough. The simpler it is, the better. Cereal, oatmeal, something prepped I can stick in the microwave. Breakfast foods placed in the same area of the kitchen every time, the same part of the fridge-- maybe even a short checklist-- "first pour three glasses of milk, then get fruit from the specific drawer, then get prepped oatmeal from the fridge and heat it up for exactly X seconds..." I have an IQ of 151, by the way.

Some things, like folding laundry-- I can do this, but I have developed a system over many years, so it IS mindless. But for others, it's not, because they don't know what's "hangy or foldy" as my husband says. Or they don't know which things belong to which kids (DH may need a primer). ADHDers, and especially men who haven't been conditioned, often can't tell, like... navy blue from black.

It's just not simple.

But those are the kinds of things that can help. Not just "practice." But actual tools and support.

Now, there's a whole 'nother issue in here about sexism and social conditioning. I am better-equipped to do some of these things than most men with ADHD because I've been more forced to learn them by exposure and societal expectations. Generally speaking, I firmly believe men shouldn't get a pass on ~*domestic duties*~ just because they traditionally have, or because "I really prefer grocery shopping anyway" or whatever. But people with ADHD really do have specific challenges and do need specific support for them.