Anonymous
Post 03/28/2021 11:16     Subject: 2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Does AAP even matter anymore as the county seems hell bent on not opening schools? Even AAP distance learning is well below any learning from a normal school year in gen ed.

How are teachers going to get the AAP kids back to where they should be after losing over a year of school?
Anonymous
Post 03/28/2021 11:12     Subject: 2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Is AAP placement biased against shy children who don't speak up in class?


Yes. I don't think it was before. But the current overweighing of GBRS seems to be creating this issue.


When we asked about AAP, our K teacher responded it was not about being smart it was for kids who stood out as leaders. We just wanted to learn about the program as we are new to teh district and the websites talk about AAP 1 & 2 for lower grades, and knew our kid was solidly ahead on some things, and she basically said our kid did not have a chance because she did not view him as a leader.


Expecting a 7-year-old to demonstrate leadership skills is nuts. It’s Advanced ACADEMICS, not future leaders of America. Sounds like some teachers need a refresher in what they’re measuring.


Yeah... it was a disheartening exchange. I’ve continued to see him be pretty significantly more advanced than other kids as his progress through the school. It’s sort of become clear that the school is not interested in working closely with kids like him as they have to focus more on the population in need of more help. Feel like he got lost in the noise. We’re going to try a different school option this coming year.
Anonymous
Post 03/28/2021 11:08     Subject: 2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Is AAP placement biased against shy children who don't speak up in class?


Yes. I don't think it was before. But the current overweighing of GBRS seems to be creating this issue.


When we asked about AAP, our K teacher responded it was not about being smart it was for kids who stood out as leaders. We just wanted to learn about the program as we are new to teh district and the websites talk about AAP 1 & 2 for lower grades, and knew our kid was solidly ahead on some things, and she basically said our kid did not have a chance because she did not view him as a leader.


Expecting a 7-year-old to demonstrate leadership skills is nuts. It’s Advanced ACADEMICS, not future leaders of America. Sounds like some teachers need a refresher in what they’re measuring.
Anonymous
Post 03/28/2021 11:04     Subject: 2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
What is your racial/ethnic background?

What was the racial/ethnic breakdown of the kids you sent vs. the kids in your class?

What work have you done to unpack implicit bias?
Anonymous
Post 03/28/2021 11:02     Subject: 2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Is AAP placement biased against shy children who don't speak up in class?


Yes. I don't think it was before. But the current overweighing of GBRS seems to be creating this issue.


When we asked about AAP, our K teacher responded it was not about being smart it was for kids who stood out as leaders. We just wanted to learn about the program as we are new to teh district and the websites talk about AAP 1 & 2 for lower grades, and knew our kid was solidly ahead on some things, and she basically said our kid did not have a chance because she did not view him as a leader.


It's never been billed as a leadership program, but I think you're absolutely correct. In my older child's grade, the kids that are in AAP are not necessarily the ones I would have thought were gifted or exceptionally intelligent, they're the ones that TALK a lot.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 20:13     Subject: 2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Is AAP placement biased against shy children who don't speak up in class?


Yes. I don't think it was before. But the current overweighing of GBRS seems to be creating this issue.


When we asked about AAP, our K teacher responded it was not about being smart it was for kids who stood out as leaders. We just wanted to learn about the program as we are new to teh district and the websites talk about AAP 1 & 2 for lower grades, and knew our kid was solidly ahead on some things, and she basically said our kid did not have a chance because she did not view him as a leader.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 20:09     Subject: 2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:Is AAP placement biased against shy children who don't speak up in class?


Yes. I don't think it was before. But the current overweighing of GBRS seems to be creating this issue.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 19:31     Subject: 2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Is AAP placement biased against shy children who don't speak up in class?
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 19:19     Subject: Re:2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Op. I had kids who got all fours but I gave them low GBRs because they did very little in class. Getting fours in second grade is not that difficult. Kids who had thoughtful or creative ays of thinking and shared those in class were the ones I looked for. I had two students who had a 142 and 145 CoGAT, respectively, who I gave GBRs of 7 (raised from 4 because my Aart said I needed to) who had no useful work samples and had mostly fours both get in. Neither ever did anything to evidence advanced abilities but were able to get 4s in subject matter (except for writing) because they studied and could regurgitate what was needed to do well on math, social studies, and science tests. Neither ever contributed to class discussions.


First bolded language assumes a lot about why the students were doing well in those subjects. Also, could be viewed as implicit bias?

Second is not related to whether a child is gifted or not.

The response above illustrates why GBRS should only be a small factor in AAP placement and not a determinative one.


Agree 100%! Some little kids are introverted/anxious and talk very less but that does not mean they don't have advanced abilities!


Yep, I had that model of kid in second grade. Fortunately, she had a wonderful second-grade teacher who was good at helping her warm up and participate. The teacher also handled her freezing up during an presentation to the class so well that it actually helped her get over her stage fright longer-term. My daughter's standardized and psychoeducational testing has consistently put her in the gifted range, and I'd be mad if her teacher had sabotaged her because she has anxiety and is shy. She's doing very well in AAP.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 19:07     Subject: Re:2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Op. I had kids who got all fours but I gave them low GBRs because they did very little in class. Getting fours in second grade is not that difficult. Kids who had thoughtful or creative ays of thinking and shared those in class were the ones I looked for. I had two students who had a 142 and 145 CoGAT, respectively, who I gave GBRs of 7 (raised from 4 because my Aart said I needed to) who had no useful work samples and had mostly fours both get in. Neither ever did anything to evidence advanced abilities but were able to get 4s in subject matter (except for writing) because they studied and could regurgitate what was needed to do well on math, social studies, and science tests. Neither ever contributed to class discussions.


First bolded language assumes a lot about why the students were doing well in those subjects. Also, could be viewed as implicit bias?

Second is not related to whether a child is gifted or not.

The response above illustrates why GBRS should only be a small factor in AAP placement and not a determinative one.


The first statement bothers me. Why is studying and answering questions a bad thing? Why is it judged negatively as regurgitating?
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 19:00     Subject: Re:2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Op. I had kids who got all fours but I gave them low GBRs because they did very little in class. Getting fours in second grade is not that difficult. Kids who had thoughtful or creative ays of thinking and shared those in class were the ones I looked for. I had two students who had a 142 and 145 CoGAT, respectively, who I gave GBRs of 7 (raised from 4 because my Aart said I needed to) who had no useful work samples and had mostly fours both get in. Neither ever did anything to evidence advanced abilities but were able to get 4s in subject matter (except for writing) because they studied and could regurgitate what was needed to do well on math, social studies, and science tests. Neither ever contributed to class discussions.


First bolded language assumes a lot about why the students were doing well in those subjects. Also, could be viewed as implicit bias?

Second is not related to whether a child is gifted or not.

The response above illustrates why GBRS should only be a small factor in AAP placement and not a determinative one.


Agree 100%! Some little kids are introverted/anxious and talk very less but that does not mean they don't have advanced abilities!


That was my kid in K and First. His Teachers noticed it, talked to us about it, and actively called on him. They said he always knew the answer and answered in interesting ways. The question is, are Teachers trying to get kids to engage and they are not responding?
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 18:53     Subject: Re:2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Op. I had kids who got all fours but I gave them low GBRs because they did very little in class. Getting fours in second grade is not that difficult. Kids who had thoughtful or creative ays of thinking and shared those in class were the ones I looked for. I had two students who had a 142 and 145 CoGAT, respectively, who I gave GBRs of 7 (raised from 4 because my Aart said I needed to) who had no useful work samples and had mostly fours both get in. Neither ever did anything to evidence advanced abilities but were able to get 4s in subject matter (except for writing) because they studied and could regurgitate what was needed to do well on math, social studies, and science tests. Neither ever contributed to class discussions.


First bolded language assumes a lot about why the students were doing well in those subjects. Also, could be viewed as implicit bias?

Second is not related to whether a child is gifted or not.

The response above illustrates why GBRS should only be a small factor in AAP placement and not a determinative one.


Agree 100%! Some little kids are introverted/anxious and talk very less but that does not mean they don't have advanced abilities!


Yeah. I'm pretty skeptical about a teacher "not seeing" giftedness in kids with 99.9th percentile scores. Maybe the teacher was doing a terrible job with engaging those kids, and they were bored out of their minds. OP didn't answer whether they were considered above grade level in reading and math.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 18:31     Subject: Re:2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Op. I had kids who got all fours but I gave them low GBRs because they did very little in class. Getting fours in second grade is not that difficult. Kids who had thoughtful or creative ays of thinking and shared those in class were the ones I looked for. I had two students who had a 142 and 145 CoGAT, respectively, who I gave GBRs of 7 (raised from 4 because my Aart said I needed to) who had no useful work samples and had mostly fours both get in. Neither ever did anything to evidence advanced abilities but were able to get 4s in subject matter (except for writing) because they studied and could regurgitate what was needed to do well on math, social studies, and science tests. Neither ever contributed to class discussions.


First bolded language assumes a lot about why the students were doing well in those subjects. Also, could be viewed as implicit bias?

Second is not related to whether a child is gifted or not.

The response above illustrates why GBRS should only be a small factor in AAP placement and not a determinative one.


Agree 100%! Some little kids are introverted/anxious and talk very less but that does not mean they don't have advanced abilities!
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 17:01     Subject: Re:2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA
Anonymous wrote:Op. I had kids who got all fours but I gave them low GBRs because they did very little in class. Getting fours in second grade is not that difficult. Kids who had thoughtful or creative ays of thinking and shared those in class were the ones I looked for. I had two students who had a 142 and 145 CoGAT, respectively, who I gave GBRs of 7 (raised from 4 because my Aart said I needed to) who had no useful work samples and had mostly fours both get in. Neither ever did anything to evidence advanced abilities but were able to get 4s in subject matter (except for writing) because they studied and could regurgitate what was needed to do well on math, social studies, and science tests. Neither ever contributed to class discussions.


First bolded language assumes a lot about why the students were doing well in those subjects. Also, could be viewed as implicit bias?

Second is not related to whether a child is gifted or not.

The response above illustrates why GBRS should only be a small factor in AAP placement and not a determinative one.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2021 16:49     Subject: Re:2nd grade teacher who placed lots of students in AAP. AMA

I pushed for kids who showed creative thinking in any subject area and these kids were also usually diligent workers. Lowest CoGAT was probably 122 without other (WISC that parents arranged) test scores. Obviously, a high Naglieri made up for even lower CoGAT scores.