Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have mental health issues. The fear my spouse would leave me adds to the anxiety and unlovable/rejected feeling. Maybe your DH can sense you hate him and want to leave?

There's certainly that possibility (i definitely don't hate him, but i can see how he could get into that thought spiral when i do resent how much i can't depend on him for anything). sometimes i feel like what he wants is for me to have no needs of my own and to just exist as a person to support him and catch all the balls he can't handle. he says he loves me so much but i often feel that love is only in relation to him, not about me as an individual unique person.

given your spouse is a human being also with their own needs for support and attention and their own stress and frustrations that sometimes come out in imperfect ways, what do you wish they'd do to make the overall situation better (i mean that as a serious question)

DP with mental health problems. Sometimes the spouse of the struggling person looks like they're really good at everything. I always thought it was cruel to make me do things that were sooooooo hard for me when they seemed so easy for spouse. I think if mentally healthy spouse said, "hey, I actually can't deal with the status quo, I'm struggling with xyz, and I know you're struggling too, and can we could talk about it?" I think struggling spouse would probably say "Oh come on, you're so good with the kids, whereas I'm terrible etc etc." It will probably take a while to convince them that you really do need help sometimes. Then it will take a while to convince struggling spouse that they actually have anything to offer. And maybe they don't and outside help is the answer.

Anonymous wrote:To at said, if someone’s incapable of seeing a child’s needs and doing something correct about it, get help yesterday!

I tried fir the first 7 years to get mentally ill spouse to be involved with the kids, house, family. He was incapable, could not learn, ultimately did not care. He was so overwhelmed at basic life with a family he shut down and only worked and blocked out all things family - kids friends, school emails, school performance, sports or ECs, holiday trips, etc. He’s crash at 8pm on the couch snoring from his performance all day at the office. We got the leftovers of him, nothing.

Asking seriously (I'm not OP) -- Was he formally diagnosed with a mental illness that doctors said was clearly the cause of his inability or unwillingness to be involved with family at all? Posts on DCUM often describe behaviors like what you describe here, but not in discussions of mental illness--in discussions about relationships. You can see where I'm going. At what point is it "this is caused by mental illness" and at what point is it "he's actually not ill, he's a terrible person"?

To at said, if someone’s incapable of seeing a child’s needs and doing something correct about it, get help yesterday!

I tried fir the first 7 years to get mentally ill spouse to be involved with the kids, house, family. He was incapable, could not learn, ultimately did not care. He was so overwhelmed at basic life with a family he shut down and only worked and blocked out all things family - kids friends, school emails, school performance, sports or ECs, holiday trips, etc. He’s crash at 8pm on the couch snoring from his performance all day at the office. We got the leftovers of him, nothing.

In our experience, whenever the nanny, au pair or grandparent is in the house the neuroatypical further checks out. He likes peace, quiet, nothing asked of him and the. Will tag along on outings to our on an external front.

Don’t expect him to speak with or interact with or manage a nanny or sitter, quite the opposite.

It will free up more of your time and energy, once you train the au pair. Constant feedback and instruction will be required.

Anonymous wrote:I was just discussing this with my therapist. She was our marriage therapist but then he stopped wanting to participate and I practically begged her to see me solo and she agreed, short-term.

Her advice was to detach emotionally. We talked through all of the difficulties of coparenting and being a single mother, huge for me right now with a newborn on the way and two other kids under 5. I agree with your assessment that it isn't worth all that divorce entails. She said there was no need for me to worry about the future right now, just focus on the present and enjoying my children. If you can swing an au pair or a nanny, I'd say go for it. I'd love an extra set of hands and to be able to take a break here and there.

New poster. Re: the bold: Both you, PP, and I think OP earlier, mention how great it would be to have a nanny or au pair. Totally see why that would be a gigantic help. But -- and I am not dissing the idea or the need for "extra hands"-- but isn't there some risk that bringing in another person might come with some risk of further throwing mentally unstable spouse(s) off kilter? Especially with an au pair, who lives in the household 24/7 with the family and is always around, isn't it possible that the new person could be viewed by the DH through a lens of anything from an open, "You don't trust ME with our kids" to an unspoken "I must be a total loser since DW is bringing in another adult" to, I hate to say it, a DH getting overly attached to this helper? Seeing that person's presence as an "out" or a tacit permission to be even more checked out of the family since there's someone else there to help the family?

I need to be clear that I am NOT saying you both can do without help. It's so clear you need breaks in a huge way. And hiring help sounds wiser than dong the "family needs to help out" stuff that DCUM always pushes at people--involving family (if they're close by) can just create rifts and drama. But I'm wondering what therapists would say about whether and how to introduce an employee into the scenario. I guess it really depends greatly on whether the DH would see or interact with that person much or if that person would be around during his work hours--? I would go for a nanny who doesn't live in the home, rather than an au pair who is in a gray area between nanny and "one of the family." Au pairs can be experienced with kids but I would not be too sure they would be experienced with dealing with a mentally ill adult living under the same roof day in and day out.

Anonymous wrote:I made a different decision - to give my kids the gift of one happy, functional, emotionally safe household where they won't grow up learning to be codependent and continuing the cycle for another generation and where they have one parent who is happy and functional.

Custody is 50/50 on paper, but in reality 70/30.

no judgment for that path! i don't feel i'm at the end of the road yet in terms of how much i can change my perspective and engagement but I absolutely support divorce if that overall is a better / safer environment for the kids

Anonymous wrote:I was just discussing this with my therapist. She was our marriage therapist but then he stopped wanting to participate and I practically begged her to see me solo and she agreed, short-term.

Her advice was to detach emotionally. We talked through all of the difficulties of coparenting and being a single mother, huge for me right now with a newborn on the way and two other kids under 5. I agree with your assessment that it isn't worth all that divorce entails. She said there was no need for me to worry about the future right now, just focus on the present and enjoying my children. If you can swing an au pair or a nanny, I'd say go for it. I'd love an extra set of hands and to be able to take a break here and there.

Did she give you any practical advice on how to detach emotionally. I *know* thats what Ineed to do but can't seem to actually do it

Meant it’s like dealing with an addict.

They have to themselves want to improve and do the work. Everything else is just masking and saying what they think you want to hear.

Many mental disorders are like dealing an an addiction who thinks nothing is wrong. First off, you’re not dealing with someone in tune with their own or your feelings or actions.

Second off, they have little to no self reflection or self awareness so get defiant and oppositional at anything and everything.

Third off, by the time they’re adults they’ve developed their own twisted, negative coping mechanisms for their mental deficiencies and shortcomings. Things get perverse fast.

Anonymous wrote:Amazing how people give up on their "loved ones" over a disease. If it were cancer-would you give up? Mental illness is a disease, not a choice

end the stigma

If the spouse with cancer refused to follow medical advice, refused to stop smoking, or refused chemotherapy, or radiation treatment, or did work with me to get help at home for when they needed to be out of the house for treatment or at home but unable to help with the house/kids?
So yes, mental health is a disease, just like cancer is a disease. You say "if it were cancer--would you give up?" but what if the person with the disease has given up. Is the partner supposed to do it for them 100%? That's not possible, or reasonable.
My partner is diagnosed with clinical depression and type II diabetes. Some days/ weeks are better than others, but partner has shown a true long term commitment to working on both, and because of that, I'm happy to stay and support them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Amazing how people give up on their "loved ones" over a disease. If it were cancer-would you give up? Mental illness is a disease, not a choice

end the stigma

Nope, sorry, doesn't work that way. The more we learn about the brain, the more we see that every undesirable trait or behavior that we used to ascribe to assholery is the result of some physiological thing. It's still abusive behavior toward the recipient. No one should be mistreated.

Leave before they drive you insane.

I made a different decision - to give my kids the gift of one happy, functional, emotionally safe household where they won't grow up learning to be codependent and continuing the cycle for another generation and where they have one parent who is happy and functional.

Custody is 50/50 on paper, but in reality 70/30.

I was just discussing this with my therapist. She was our marriage therapist but then he stopped wanting to participate and I practically begged her to see me solo and she agreed, short-term.

Her advice was to detach emotionally. We talked through all of the difficulties of coparenting and being a single mother, huge for me right now with a newborn on the way and two other kids under 5. I agree with your assessment that it isn't worth all that divorce entails. She said there was no need for me to worry about the future right now, just focus on the present and enjoying my children. If you can swing an au pair or a nanny, I'd say go for it. I'd love an extra set of hands and to be able to take a break here and there.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Amazing how people give up on their "loved ones" over a disease. If it were cancer-would you give up? Mental illness is a disease, not a choice

end the stigma

Nope, sorry, doesn't work that way. The more we learn about the brain, the more we see that every undesirable trait or behavior that we used to ascribe to assholery is the result of some physiological thing. It's still abusive behavior toward the recipient. No one should be mistreated.

+1 mental illness can cause abuse, neglect, withdrawal from marriage and other things no person should endure as part of their vows. Who does it serve to have two peoples mental health ruined by staying locked in the dynamic? If anything I fear I’m enabling my husband by being a crutch that allows him to not confront his issues. And if I go down in the process of staying with him, that’s devistating for our children

Also if you want to compare to the cancer analogy, someone with cancer does not get a free pass to be nasty to their spouse and children. They do not get to be endlessly supported if they don’t try to seek treatment and just want everyone to wallow in misery with them. Cancer or no cancer you still have responsibilities to others

Anonymous wrote:Amazing how people give up on their "loved ones" over a disease. If it were cancer-would you give up? Mental illness is a disease, not a choice

end the stigma

You are responsible for your actions. If you feel the need to sleep around, your spouse doesn’t stick with you. If you strike your spouse or child, you lose your family. That’s not stigma. That’s cause and effect.