Sure, just let them sit in front of a screen until they are 10 or 13.

Anonymous wrote:With exception of dyslexia or other learning issue, I feel like a fairly smart kid would not be able to help learning to read before 10. I am thinking about some stories I have read about kids kept out of school but not actively homeschooled either, with neglectful or abusive parents. They figured out how to read.

I am just kinda thinking this through now -- ok, so there are illiterate adults. But fewer than ever probably? I am thinking - illiterate parents with kids who only went to a few years of elementary before it was required, and also probably super isolated. I don't really know, but it seems like you'd have to be almost trying to keep a kid from learning to read.

A majority of the population finds reading intuitive. For this reason, many of us do not have a specific memory of learning to read. It was something we just started to do with a little adult guidance, and we learned it before we were old enough to form stable memories. Roughly 30 percent of children need explicit phonics instruction to start reading a develop into stable readers. Some subset of that 30 percent will receive a dyslexia diagnosis. There are a lot of people who are functionally illiterate from this 30 percent group. You may not know them, but I have worked with them, ages 14 to adult.

While children start reading in K-1, they are not expected to be fluent readers who have multi-syllable-word attack skills, stamina, expressiveness and comprehension until grade 3. If a child has received three years of reading instruction and is not yet fluent, then educators usually suspect a learning disability. Since fluency is expected by grade 3, academic standards shift to expecting “reading to learn” instead of “learning to read” at grade 4.

With exception of dyslexia or other learning issue, I feel like a fairly smart kid would not be able to help learning to read before 10. I am thinking about some stories I have read about kids kept out of school but not actively homeschooled either, with neglectful or abusive parents. They figured out how to read.

I am just kinda thinking this through now -- ok, so there are illiterate adults. But fewer than ever probably? I am thinking - illiterate parents with kids who only went to a few years of elementary before it was required, and also probably super isolated. I don't really know, but it seems like you'd have to be almost trying to keep a kid from learning to read.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We start learning abc’s at 7 when we enter grade 1. The good thing about the late start is that most kids are ready and the whole class can move on together. Expectations are high since kids were able to play-all-day for over 7 years and are more than ready to start schooling.

Who is we?

NP: Mennonites? Kindergarten is rare among them and the Amish. Amish are even less likely to be posting to argumentative internet chat boards, though.

There are situations where kids read in front of other kids. My friend's son is dyslexic and is not reading well at age 8 (3rd grade). I've witnessed every day situations where he's embarrassed because he can't read a sign, for example. I know this family is working hard to get him on track. However, parents who refuse to intervene are setting their kids up for not just academic failure but social problems too.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep seeing posts from parents about letting redshirting their Kindergarteners or letting their Kindergarteners just play during DL. And I’m not sure they realize that taking a year off a six has consequences.

Do you have K'er who is distance learning? If you did, you would realize that it really isn't working for a lot of kids, especially kids on the younger end of K. We are sticking with it (at least for now) and probably won't have him do K again, but I can absolutely understand why someone would wait a year or not worry too much about what someone is doing in DL.

Dl can work really well with an involved parent who also works with their child at home. The issue is most parents don't want to put in the effort.

Well taxpayers are still paying for an entire school system but now each child is expected to have an involved parent coaching them throughout the day.

Anonymous wrote:Kindergarten didn't used to be universal. Students would go to 1st grade and that would be the beginning of their school career, not their second year (or third or fourth for those who attended traditional preschools or fifth for those who started earlier). Would it be rough initially? Yes. Is it ultimately harmful to miss kindergarten? No.

No, ultimately, it's not harmful to miss kindergarten. But to imply that it's okay not to be able to read at 10 - 13, barring some severe special needs, is ridiculous.

Kindergarten didn't used to be universal. Students would go to 1st grade and that would be the beginning of their school career, not their second year (or third or fourth for those who attended traditional preschools or fifth for those who started earlier). Would it be rough initially? Yes. Is it ultimately harmful to miss kindergarten? No.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Saw this on my FB. This is the direct quote

"Some children don't read until they're 10. Others, 13. And then they pick up and are reading at the same level as their been-reading-since-kindergarten peers. Without intervention."

That’s potentially the stupidest thing I’ve read in weeks.

Same here.
13 is almost high school! If you don't read until you're 13, you also don't write until you're 13. Seriously???

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep seeing posts from parents about letting redshirting their Kindergarteners or letting their Kindergarteners just play during DL. And I’m not sure they realize that taking a year off a six has consequences.

Do you have K'er who is distance learning? If you did, you would realize that it really isn't working for a lot of kids, especially kids on the younger end of K. We are sticking with it (at least for now) and probably won't have him do K again, but I can absolutely understand why someone would wait a year or not worry too much about what someone is doing in DL.

Dl can work really well with an involved parent who also works with their child at home. The issue is most parents don't want to put in the effort.

Nah, the issue is that most parents have to work and produce results or risk being fired in a shit economy. It is not that most parents don't want to be involved or "put in the effort," as you claim... it is just that they cannot put in the amount of effort or be as involved as required for a K student success.

I have mentioned it before here - I have to sit by my K for 95% of her class to help her, direct her, and work with her. Plus I work one on one after class... but I am a SAHM; HOW can a working parent do this? It is impossible.

I have a first grader and a preschooler and I have to be on top of distance learning the whole day. We also worked through spring and summer. The point is that I am witnessing a lot of handwaving over early elementary students “let them play!”, as though dropping off a year of academic progress won’t have any consequences. DL doesn’t work for K (or pre-K or 1st), which is precisely why you can’t just “let them play”; despite what misguided play-based learning supporters say “playing” eventually needs to progress to reading, writing and arithmetic.

I guess it depends on the school? My kids' private would not allow a kid who can't read to leave K or at least 1st grade.

I'm a sahm and keeping kids on zoom is a full time job.

I was reading simple books at age 5!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep seeing posts from parents about letting redshirting their Kindergarteners or letting their Kindergarteners just play during DL. And I’m not sure they realize that taking a year off a six has consequences.

Do you have K'er who is distance learning? If you did, you would realize that it really isn't working for a lot of kids, especially kids on the younger end of K. We are sticking with it (at least for now) and probably won't have him do K again, but I can absolutely understand why someone would wait a year or not worry too much about what someone is doing in DL.

Dl can work really well with an involved parent who also works with their child at home. The issue is most parents don't want to put in the effort.

Nah, the issue is that most parents have to work and produce results or risk being fired in a shit economy. It is not that most parents don't want to be involved or "put in the effort," as you claim... it is just that they cannot put in the amount of effort or be as involved as required for a K student success.

I have mentioned it before here - I have to sit by my K for 95% of her class to help her, direct her, and work with her. Plus I work one on one after class... but I am a SAHM; HOW can a working parent do this? It is impossible.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep seeing posts from parents about letting redshirting their Kindergarteners or letting their Kindergarteners just play during DL. And I’m not sure they realize that taking a year off a six has consequences.

Do you have K'er who is distance learning? If you did, you would realize that it really isn't working for a lot of kids, especially kids on the younger end of K. We are sticking with it (at least for now) and probably won't have him do K again, but I can absolutely understand why someone would wait a year or not worry too much about what someone is doing in DL.

Dl can work really well with an involved parent who also works with their child at home. The issue is most parents don't want to put in the effort.