Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:These NNAT and COGAT scores are not on the cusp, nor is “frequently observed” in all sections of the GBRS. You’ll need a high WISC or some really compelling work samples to make the case that your child needs more than gened can offer.

PP her - I thought OP said GBRS was consistently's... You are right. With 4F's and those scores, you will need probably 130+ WISC to get in. But you can always put together an appeal package and submit if you believe your child needs AAP education.

Unless things have changed from the last couple years, the committees don't care about the WISC, only GBRS. For the reasons the next PP expressed: it is seen as an unfair advantage for those who can pay. For anecdata: my kid who had a 138 Cogat and 139 WISC was rejected. Four frequently observed.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Of course, but some want to sew grievance and misinformation by claiming otherwise. It is wholly illegal, and selection to these programs is race-blind as a matter of law. The crazy part is they're pushing the myth that the most well-represented group is being discriminated against completely ignores reality and fact.

This kind of thinking oversimplifies things. The problem with admissions to anything is that it's a zero-sum game. If you create programs to "help" one group, it is going to hurt other groups by virtue of it being a zero-sum game. For example, many states, counties (e.g., TJ admissions), etc. have adopted a "Top 10%" or "Top 20%" policy to encourage diversity in a race-neutral manner. In the short-term, policies like this likely do increase diversity of underrepresented groups. Policies like this can be couched in a positive light and people can even claim that it's not per se discrimination. While I agree that it's no longer per se discrimination, it is a more subtle, nuanced version of discrimination, with the arguably good intent of helping underrepresented groups. The problem is that helping underrepresented groups in a zero-sum game will hurt other groups in the short-term. In the long-term, those other groups will figure out a way to work through the new system (e.g., move to underrepresented neighborhoods to increase your chance of getting into schools).

I personally am fine with what is being done because I do actually think underrepresented groups should be given help and I accept that there will be some harm to other groups. That being said, I don't think people should discount the reality that other groups are in fact being harmed and that this is a subtle form of discrimination, which understandably angers and frustrates people.

Affirmative Action is to eliminate discrimination, yet in the recent years, this is the cause of discrimination. to truly eliminate discrimination and racism is to have race blind admission process to let the true achievers shine. If the country or the states want to truly help these kids, provide them the free access to test preps and stem classes. To truly help someone you want to teach them how to fish, not to give them free fish to eat...

It’s not illegal to use race for program admissions, hiring, etc. Affirmative Action is not illegal. Programs like Young Scholars that overtly use race as a qualifier are not illegal. It is not illegal for programs to try to balance their demographics. It’s not illegal for colleges to admit people in a way that creates a diverse class. Sheesh.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Of course, but some want to sew grievance and misinformation by claiming otherwise. It is wholly illegal, and selection to these programs is race-blind as a matter of law. The crazy part is they're pushing the myth that the most well-represented group is being discriminated against completely ignores reality and fact.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Aw that's cute you think that stops people

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Which country you living in? even the college admission is biased! I can guarantee you that the kids got in with below 130 NNAT and CogAT are not Asians

For those who aren't aware, one factor in AAP selection is diversity considerations. This isn't stated anywhere in the FCPS AAP literature, but it is obvious to most parents when you see who gets into AAP. There are always a number of "surprises" and this makes a lot of parents very upset because it becomes obvious that there are different admission standards and people start to think it's unfair. Myself personally, I don't actually have a problem with there being diversity considerations and there being different standards. I really, however, dislike the complete lack of transparency. If you're going to do the foregoing, be transparent about it and live with the consequences (i.e., getting sued a la TJ).

Related to the foregoing, it's stuff like this that makes Asians feel like they have to test prep for everything. Asian families intuitively sense that they are being compared to other Asians in any admission process and so their test scores need to be higher than others to even be eligible. It's a horrible, vicious cycle.

I don't know if it is stated in the AAP literature, but the inclusion of Young Scholar* status, English learner status and minority language spoken at home are factors in AAP selection. These are explicit on the screening form that the committee receives. *Young Scholar is for historically underrepresented minorities: https://www.fcps.edu/academics/elementary/advanced-academic-programs/young-scholars and is designed to promote their inclusion in AAP.

The Asians are minorities, am I right? If you check the Asian kids in school they all speak another minority language at home or at least parents speak…. And all these forms were submitted to the school. So the AAP admission are blind to this?

That makes it easier for AAP admissions to differentiate between Asian and white kids. If a kid is a Young Scholar, the kid is probably low income, Black, or Hispanic. Asians are not considered a minority for Young Scholars.
Young Scholar box checked means the kid is probably a URM.
No boxes checked means the kid is probably white.
If a kid is not a Young scholar but then checks the box for speaking another language at home, the committee would know that the kid is probably Asian.
AAP admissions is not blind to any of this, and they certainly take it into consideration.

there are Asian populations with low income. when my parents came to this country i received free lunches for few years... That was the Montgomery County public school system. they were somewhat fair, at least back then, i was able to take multivariable calculus and differential equation in 11th grade. Not sure how is it now 20 years later.

Low income Asians will get into Young Scholars, and then they'll get those bonus points with the AAP admissions committee.

So, what a way to show our kids that work hard and earn more can have a social disadvantage...

When government come up with these benefits, they need to think about the social consequences. the Cons out weight the Pros? Why do we have a huge population quit their jobs and live happily on government benefits? Maybe this action not only benefits them also benefits their children in school. Sounds like a great loophole to be taken advantage of!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Which country you living in? even the college admission is biased! I can guarantee you that the kids got in with below 130 NNAT and CogAT are not Asians

For those who aren't aware, one factor in AAP selection is diversity considerations. This isn't stated anywhere in the FCPS AAP literature, but it is obvious to most parents when you see who gets into AAP. There are always a number of "surprises" and this makes a lot of parents very upset because it becomes obvious that there are different admission standards and people start to think it's unfair. Myself personally, I don't actually have a problem with there being diversity considerations and there being different standards. I really, however, dislike the complete lack of transparency. If you're going to do the foregoing, be transparent about it and live with the consequences (i.e., getting sued a la TJ).

Related to the foregoing, it's stuff like this that makes Asians feel like they have to test prep for everything. Asian families intuitively sense that they are being compared to other Asians in any admission process and so their test scores need to be higher than others to even be eligible. It's a horrible, vicious cycle.

I don't know if it is stated in the AAP literature, but the inclusion of Young Scholar* status, English learner status and minority language spoken at home are factors in AAP selection. These are explicit on the screening form that the committee receives. *Young Scholar is for historically underrepresented minorities: https://www.fcps.edu/academics/elementary/advanced-academic-programs/young-scholars and is designed to promote their inclusion in AAP.

The Asians are minorities, am I right? If you check the Asian kids in school they all speak another minority language at home or at least parents speak…. And all these forms were submitted to the school. So the AAP admission are blind to this?

That makes it easier for AAP admissions to differentiate between Asian and white kids. If a kid is a Young Scholar, the kid is probably low income, Black, or Hispanic. Asians are not considered a minority for Young Scholars.
Young Scholar box checked means the kid is probably a URM.
No boxes checked means the kid is probably white.
If a kid is not a Young scholar but then checks the box for speaking another language at home, the committee would know that the kid is probably Asian.
AAP admissions is not blind to any of this, and they certainly take it into consideration.

there are Asian populations with low income. when my parents came to this country i received free lunches for few years... That was the Montgomery County public school system. they were somewhat fair, at least back then, i was able to take multivariable calculus and differential equation in 11th grade. Not sure how is it now 20 years later.

Low income Asians will get into Young Scholars, and then they'll get those bonus points with the AAP admissions committee.

So, what a way to show our kids that work hard and earn more can have a social disadvantage...

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Which country you living in? even the college admission is biased! I can guarantee you that the kids got in with below 130 NNAT and CogAT are not Asians

For those who aren't aware, one factor in AAP selection is diversity considerations. This isn't stated anywhere in the FCPS AAP literature, but it is obvious to most parents when you see who gets into AAP. There are always a number of "surprises" and this makes a lot of parents very upset because it becomes obvious that there are different admission standards and people start to think it's unfair. Myself personally, I don't actually have a problem with there being diversity considerations and there being different standards. I really, however, dislike the complete lack of transparency. If you're going to do the foregoing, be transparent about it and live with the consequences (i.e., getting sued a la TJ).

Related to the foregoing, it's stuff like this that makes Asians feel like they have to test prep for everything. Asian families intuitively sense that they are being compared to other Asians in any admission process and so their test scores need to be higher than others to even be eligible. It's a horrible, vicious cycle.

I don't know if it is stated in the AAP literature, but the inclusion of Young Scholar* status, English learner status and minority language spoken at home are factors in AAP selection. These are explicit on the screening form that the committee receives. *Young Scholar is for historically underrepresented minorities: https://www.fcps.edu/academics/elementary/advanced-academic-programs/young-scholars and is designed to promote their inclusion in AAP.

The Asians are minorities, am I right? If you check the Asian kids in school they all speak another minority language at home or at least parents speak…. And all these forms were submitted to the school. So the AAP admission are blind to this?

That makes it easier for AAP admissions to differentiate between Asian and white kids. If a kid is a Young Scholar, the kid is probably low income, Black, or Hispanic. Asians are not considered a minority for Young Scholars.
Young Scholar box checked means the kid is probably a URM.
No boxes checked means the kid is probably white.
If a kid is not a Young scholar but then checks the box for speaking another language at home, the committee would know that the kid is probably Asian.
AAP admissions is not blind to any of this, and they certainly take it into consideration.

there are Asian populations with low income. when my parents came to this country i received free lunches for few years... That was the Montgomery County public school system. they were somewhat fair, at least back then, i was able to take multivariable calculus and differential equation in 11th grade. Not sure how is it now 20 years later.

Low income Asians will get into Young Scholars, and then they'll get those bonus points with the AAP admissions committee.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Which country you living in? even the college admission is biased! I can guarantee you that the kids got in with below 130 NNAT and CogAT are not Asians

For those who aren't aware, one factor in AAP selection is diversity considerations. This isn't stated anywhere in the FCPS AAP literature, but it is obvious to most parents when you see who gets into AAP. There are always a number of "surprises" and this makes a lot of parents very upset because it becomes obvious that there are different admission standards and people start to think it's unfair. Myself personally, I don't actually have a problem with there being diversity considerations and there being different standards. I really, however, dislike the complete lack of transparency. If you're going to do the foregoing, be transparent about it and live with the consequences (i.e., getting sued a la TJ).

Related to the foregoing, it's stuff like this that makes Asians feel like they have to test prep for everything. Asian families intuitively sense that they are being compared to other Asians in any admission process and so their test scores need to be higher than others to even be eligible. It's a horrible, vicious cycle.

I don't know if it is stated in the AAP literature, but the inclusion of Young Scholar* status, English learner status and minority language spoken at home are factors in AAP selection. These are explicit on the screening form that the committee receives. *Young Scholar is for historically underrepresented minorities: https://www.fcps.edu/academics/elementary/advanced-academic-programs/young-scholars and is designed to promote their inclusion in AAP.

The Asians are minorities, am I right? If you check the Asian kids in school they all speak another minority language at home or at least parents speak…. And all these forms were submitted to the school. So the AAP admission are blind to this?

That makes it easier for AAP admissions to differentiate between Asian and white kids. If a kid is a Young Scholar, the kid is probably low income, Black, or Hispanic. Asians are not considered a minority for Young Scholars.
Young Scholar box checked means the kid is probably a URM.
No boxes checked means the kid is probably white.
If a kid is not a Young scholar but then checks the box for speaking another language at home, the committee would know that the kid is probably Asian.
AAP admissions is not blind to any of this, and they certainly take it into consideration.

there are Asian populations with low income. when my parents came to this country i received free lunches for few years... That was the Montgomery County public school system. they were somewhat fair, at least back then, i was able to take multivariable calculus and differential equation in 11th grade. Not sure how is it now 20 years later.

Love the Davidson Institute, they only take kids with IQ score above 145 to avoid the dilution of the program. They are not taking any test scores that can be easily prepped. And this leaves the true population that can be benefitted from the program.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Which country you living in? even the college admission is biased! I can guarantee you that the kids got in with below 130 NNAT and CogAT are not Asians

For those who aren't aware, one factor in AAP selection is diversity considerations. This isn't stated anywhere in the FCPS AAP literature, but it is obvious to most parents when you see who gets into AAP. There are always a number of "surprises" and this makes a lot of parents very upset because it becomes obvious that there are different admission standards and people start to think it's unfair. Myself personally, I don't actually have a problem with there being diversity considerations and there being different standards. I really, however, dislike the complete lack of transparency. If you're going to do the foregoing, be transparent about it and live with the consequences (i.e., getting sued a la TJ).

Related to the foregoing, it's stuff like this that makes Asians feel like they have to test prep for everything. Asian families intuitively sense that they are being compared to other Asians in any admission process and so their test scores need to be higher than others to even be eligible. It's a horrible, vicious cycle.

I don't know if it is stated in the AAP literature, but the inclusion of Young Scholar* status, English learner status and minority language spoken at home are factors in AAP selection. These are explicit on the screening form that the committee receives. *Young Scholar is for historically underrepresented minorities: https://www.fcps.edu/academics/elementary/advanced-academic-programs/young-scholars and is designed to promote their inclusion in AAP.

The Asians are minorities, am I right? If you check the Asian kids in school they all speak another minority language at home or at least parents speak…. And all these forms were submitted to the school. So the AAP admission are blind to this?

That makes it easier for AAP admissions to differentiate between Asian and white kids. If a kid is a Young Scholar, the kid is probably low income, Black, or Hispanic. Asians are not considered a minority for Young Scholars.
Young Scholar box checked means the kid is probably a URM.
No boxes checked means the kid is probably white.
If a kid is not a Young scholar but then checks the box for speaking another language at home, the committee would know that the kid is probably Asian.
AAP admissions is not blind to any of this, and they certainly take it into consideration.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Which country you living in? even the college admission is biased! I can guarantee you that the kids got in with below 130 NNAT and CogAT are not Asians

For those who aren't aware, one factor in AAP selection is diversity considerations. This isn't stated anywhere in the FCPS AAP literature, but it is obvious to most parents when you see who gets into AAP. There are always a number of "surprises" and this makes a lot of parents very upset because it becomes obvious that there are different admission standards and people start to think it's unfair. Myself personally, I don't actually have a problem with there being diversity considerations and there being different standards. I really, however, dislike the complete lack of transparency. If you're going to do the foregoing, be transparent about it and live with the consequences (i.e., getting sued a la TJ).

Related to the foregoing, it's stuff like this that makes Asians feel like they have to test prep for everything. Asian families intuitively sense that they are being compared to other Asians in any admission process and so their test scores need to be higher than others to even be eligible. It's a horrible, vicious cycle.

Exactly, I am seeing that whatever information given on the websites, be it TJ website or AAP. They should mention that diversity is considered. 5 years back I used to see mostly east and south asians in AAP classes. Lately, I don't see them. Looks like there is something that is not unofficially declared but keeping it only during admission process.

Do you see them in gen ed classes? Nope. Because they've moved and are in different schools now. They aren't being kept out of AAP. Or TJ.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Which country you living in? even the college admission is biased! I can guarantee you that the kids got in with below 130 NNAT and CogAT are not Asians

For those who aren't aware, one factor in AAP selection is diversity considerations. This isn't stated anywhere in the FCPS AAP literature, but it is obvious to most parents when you see who gets into AAP. There are always a number of "surprises" and this makes a lot of parents very upset because it becomes obvious that there are different admission standards and people start to think it's unfair. Myself personally, I don't actually have a problem with there being diversity considerations and there being different standards. I really, however, dislike the complete lack of transparency. If you're going to do the foregoing, be transparent about it and live with the consequences (i.e., getting sued a la TJ).

Related to the foregoing, it's stuff like this that makes Asians feel like they have to test prep for everything. Asian families intuitively sense that they are being compared to other Asians in any admission process and so their test scores need to be higher than others to even be eligible. It's a horrible, vicious cycle.

Exactly, I am seeing that whatever information given on the websites, be it TJ website or AAP. They should mention that diversity is considered. 5 years back I used to see mostly east and south asians in AAP classes. Lately, I don't see them. Looks like there is something that is not unofficially declared but keeping it only during admission process.

Exactly, maybe it's better to start an Asian parents' alliance so we can better fight for our children, to bring equality and fairness for the kids that can be most benefit from this program. And avoid unfair dilutions of this program.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is your child Asian?

That wouldn't matter, nor could it be used as a factor for selection since discrimination is illegal in this country.

Which country you living in? even the college admission is biased! I can guarantee you that the kids got in with below 130 NNAT and CogAT are not Asians

For those who aren't aware, one factor in AAP selection is diversity considerations. This isn't stated anywhere in the FCPS AAP literature, but it is obvious to most parents when you see who gets into AAP. There are always a number of "surprises" and this makes a lot of parents very upset because it becomes obvious that there are different admission standards and people start to think it's unfair. Myself personally, I don't actually have a problem with there being diversity considerations and there being different standards. I really, however, dislike the complete lack of transparency. If you're going to do the foregoing, be transparent about it and live with the consequences (i.e., getting sued a la TJ).

Related to the foregoing, it's stuff like this that makes Asians feel like they have to test prep for everything. Asian families intuitively sense that they are being compared to other Asians in any admission process and so their test scores need to be higher than others to even be eligible. It's a horrible, vicious cycle.

Exactly, I am seeing that whatever information given on the websites, be it TJ website or AAP. They should mention that diversity is considered. 5 years back I used to see mostly east and south asians in AAP classes. Lately, I don't see them. Looks like there is something that is not unofficially declared but keeping it only during admission process.