Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just bite the bullet and move to the Wilson catchment area (mostly WOTP). Honestly, some of the MD/VA school might be better, but the difference seems to me mostly marginal and driven by socio-economics. The schools are safe and pretty average with little crime and violence.

In our schools (Stoddert -> Hardy); things seem fine. Most importantly, we don't sit down and worry about the school and our kids' life trajectory. (I.e. no TJ worries like some of our VA friends; or Middle/HS worries like our Cap Hill friends) The kids can walk to school, their friends are in the neighborhood, and there is racial diversity. Life is pretty relaxing (other than the younger one throwing tantrums about food preference).

Dude not everyone wants to attend Wilson.

LOL! True, not interested in Wilson for us either.

Anonymous wrote:I believe that teachers touch a child’s life, even change it, inspire. Also, I believe that people around us influence who we become.

We gave public schools a chance in Elementary. But even the best teachers there were overworked, spent a lot of time on disciplining students rather than teaching, didn’t encourage asking questions because the class sizes (27 kids) and taught to test. The peer group had some good kids but also a lot of kids with undesired behavior - sexualized.

So we moved DD to a private. This is her first year in middle school. The max class size is 20. The teachers are awesome. They truly try to spark the joy of learning, they do a lot project based learning and games, encourage asking questions.

DD is surrounded by kids from good families, with high academic level, some overachievers. These are kids that travel, read books, go to museums and theaters, and do a lot of extra curricular activities- robotics, swimming, orchestra, etc. They don’t come home and plop in front of TV. So I’m hoping DD will thrive in this environment. So far she’s doing very well.

What exactly is a "good family?"

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our daughter is 1 year old. We currently live downtown, and we're thinking we'll need to move in the next year or two to get a little more space. As we think about the parts of the city we'd love to live in, though, we keep coming back to the school conversation. A desirable (and affordable!) neighborhood to live in does not necessary have schools known for being great.

Does that matter? What is the lifelong impact of sending your kid to an amazing school? An okay one? A kind of crappy one? And then how are we defining amazing/okay/crappy.. is it just test scores?

I'm curious how you chose the school you chose (or how you chose to wing it with the lottery). And I'm curious your philosophy on the importance--or lack thereof--of K-12 education.

And then to get into practical advice.. any feeder patterns you love or would avoid?

Many desirable neighborhoods EOTP don’t have great schools. Many families go charter, and it works for them.

Test scores are not the be all and end all but it gives you a sense of peer group. How many kids are below grade level, on grade level, above grade level?
This starts to become important in the upper elementary as the academic gap widens between those below and those on or above grade level, especially since there is no G & T or AAP or tracking.

We wanted language immersion because felt it was important to be bilingual in today’s diverse society. Language immersion also tends to be a harder curriculum in general because the child is learning all topics in 2 languages. We were very lucky in the lottery and are currently very happy with DC’s experience so far. Private was our back up if the lottery did not work out. Our IB school was not a viable option.

The language immersion charters has a feeder pattern to not only middle school but also high school with DCI.

You're asking the right question. I'm a grandparent. We raised our kids in a wealthy DC suburb and sent them to very highly regarded public schools. Very few poor kids, if any. Zero diversity. But man, did it have high test scores.

Fast forward 25 years, we're living in DC and our grandkids are enrolled in a largely black, largely poor school. When we show up, everyone in the school knows who we are because we don't look like anybody else. And guess what? The grandkids are reading well above grade level and are doing very well socially. In the end, it all boils down to who they go home to.

Don't get caught up in the rat race like we did.

I guarantee your kids are not going to send their kids to the zoned middle or HS.

Why is this ALWAYS the response?

In this area, there is a lot of choice as to where to live. It should be easy to find a nice area with good schools - assuming you can afford. Over time, you will find that many of your friendships come from the parents of your chlid's schoolmates. Same for your child's friends. Life works out better in so many respects if you find a home close to your child's school and you make sure that it's a good school.

It makes a difference. I went to a diverse school that did have a top cohort but it wasn't large. Classes were not that challenging and I complained by third grade that I was bored. Took honors classes in high school and got good grades and into a top 5 college. Classes there were soooo hard because I didn't have the right preparation. I did fine but it was a lot more work than kids who came from better schools.

Classes are taught to the average. If your average is below grade level then the class will not be as challenging.

So it does make a difference but it doesn't mean you can't be successful.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:2 things matter regarding schools

1. The number one factor in school success is the parents/home environment. Points to the poster commenting that having a shorter commute pays dividends

2. The second thing that matters is having a highly motivated cohort. Now, since this is DCUM I'm assuming the kid in question is top 10%. Usually, most schools have at least a collection of high performing students. Now unfortunately in DC, this is not the case. The majority of middle and high schools in DC are terrible. There are only 3-5 good middle schools in DC which requires either living in the most expensive parts of the city are getting lucky through a charter. For high school the selective high schools are an option but again middle school is a big problem.

Based on this I would leave DCPS after 4th grade unless you had a path to one of the 3-5 decent middle school options.

OP has a one year old. The middle school landscape could change sognificantly by then.

OP, the school is only one part of your life. A long commute will make it very hard to do other things like an instrument, a sport, any special activity that you may choose, especially if you can't afford a lot of household help. And with your child so young and your preference for downtown, it seems silly to make sacrifices for a middle or high school so far in the future.

People where saying the same thing when my child, who will enter middle school next year, was one as well. No change to the quality of the middle schools in my neighborhood, just additional charter options.

Anonymous wrote:Just bite the bullet and move to the Wilson catchment area (mostly WOTP). Honestly, some of the MD/VA school might be better, but the difference seems to me mostly marginal and driven by socio-economics. The schools are safe and pretty average with little crime and violence.

In our schools (Stoddert -> Hardy); things seem fine. Most importantly, we don't sit down and worry about the school and our kids' life trajectory. (I.e. no TJ worries like some of our VA friends; or Middle/HS worries like our Cap Hill friends) The kids can walk to school, their friends are in the neighborhood, and there is racial diversity. Life is pretty relaxing (other than the younger one throwing tantrums about food preference).

Dude not everyone wants to attend Wilson.

Anonymous wrote:Just bite the bullet and move to the Wilson catchment area (mostly WOTP). Honestly, some of the MD/VA school might be better, but the difference seems to me mostly marginal and driven by socio-economics. The schools are safe and pretty average with little crime and violence.

In our schools (Stoddert -> Hardy); things seem fine. Most importantly, we don't sit down and worry about the school and our kids' life trajectory. (I.e. no TJ worries like some of our VA friends; or Middle/HS worries like our Cap Hill friends) The kids can walk to school, their friends are in the neighborhood, and there is racial diversity. Life is pretty relaxing (other than the younger one throwing tantrums about food preference).

This is bad advice. You don't need to do this. Skip the bullet and stay urban until you need to. You'll know when that is, if it comes up. I really don't think WOTP people understand that the don't actually live in a city whatsoever, they live in a fancy suburb. If that's not your cup of tea, wait and see but you can (gasp!) move twice within the next 13 years if you need to. The worrying doesn't set in for a while, for most. We enjoy our lives.

Our goal was to live somewhere that had good schools but also walkable for our kids and an easy commute for us. We found a house IB for Hearst when hardly any of the neighborhood kids went there (totally different now). Our kids had great experiences there but we were not obsessed with going to the "best" school, aka a JKLM school.

This plan worked for us and made our lives much less stressful. We didn't stress about middle and high schools, we didn't stress about driving our kids to school, and we stress about our work commute.

So yes, we did look for a good school but those other factors were also important to us.

Just bite the bullet and move to the Wilson catchment area (mostly WOTP). Honestly, some of the MD/VA school might be better, but the difference seems to me mostly marginal and driven by socio-economics. The schools are safe and pretty average with little crime and violence.

In our schools (Stoddert -> Hardy); things seem fine. Most importantly, we don't sit down and worry about the school and our kids' life trajectory. (I.e. no TJ worries like some of our VA friends; or Middle/HS worries like our Cap Hill friends) The kids can walk to school, their friends are in the neighborhood, and there is racial diversity. Life is pretty relaxing (other than the younger one throwing tantrums about food preference).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:2 things matter regarding schools

1. The number one factor in school success is the parents/home environment. Points to the poster commenting that having a shorter commute pays dividends

2. The second thing that matters is having a highly motivated cohort. Now, since this is DCUM I'm assuming the kid in question is top 10%. Usually, most schools have at least a collection of high performing students. Now unfortunately in DC, this is not the case. The majority of middle and high schools in DC are terrible. There are only 3-5 good middle schools in DC which requires either living in the most expensive parts of the city are getting lucky through a charter. For high school the selective high schools are an option but again middle school is a big problem.

Based on this I would leave DCPS after 4th grade unless you had a path to one of the 3-5 decent middle school options.

OP has a one year old. The middle school landscape could change sognificantly by then.

OP, the school is only one part of your life. A long commute will make it very hard to do other things like an instrument, a sport, any special activity that you may choose, especially if you can't afford a lot of household help. And with your child so young and your preference for downtown, it seems silly to make sacrifices for a middle or high school so far in the future.

Well the middle school landscape did not change for 20 years in Capitol Hill where the overwhelming majority are UMC and concentrated in 1 neighborhood so I would not hold your breath OP. This is especially true when it’s clear from the actions of those in DCPS that their goal is to close the achievement gap and bring up the bottom while neglecting and not meeting the needs of the higher performing students. You can’t rely on a hopeful what if in the future for something so important as your child’s education.

Move where you want EOTP but know that if you don’t get into a charter, most likely be prepared to go private or move. Depending on what IB school that is, it might even be earlier than 4th. Depending on the school, some even see a big exodus of middle class families as early as K or 1st.

This is such a great question. we have a Kindergartener and grappled with this so much... my husband was of the mindset that we don't need to optimize elementary school, and that our kids will be fine anywhere (he didnt go to good public schools and is brilliant and went to a top 5 university; i was a great test-taker who went to bad public schools and ended up at a good state school and feel like I didn't quite live up to my potential -- I definitely had more anxiety than he did about it about the school choice process.)

In the end, we decided that elementary school did not need to be optimized. I think the most important thing about elementary is that he was going a lot of individual attention and being pushed, and was happy with his peer group. We are at an EOTP DCPS school that checks those boxes. the diversity is also a HUGE plus, truly -- he has friends of all races and isn't growing up with the same kind of homogeniety and biases that we had.

We might start getting more picky in middle school, so he has access to more advanced classes if he is able, and definitely i would want him at the best high school he can get into.

Anonymous wrote:2 things matter regarding schools

1. The number one factor in school success is the parents/home environment. Points to the poster commenting that having a shorter commute pays dividends

2. The second thing that matters is having a highly motivated cohort. Now, since this is DCUM I'm assuming the kid in question is top 10%. Usually, most schools have at least a collection of high performing students. Now unfortunately in DC, this is not the case. The majority of middle and high schools in DC are terrible. There are only 3-5 good middle schools in DC which requires either living in the most expensive parts of the city are getting lucky through a charter. For high school the selective high schools are an option but again middle school is a big problem.

Based on this I would leave DCPS after 4th grade unless you had a path to one of the 3-5 decent middle school options.

OP has a one year old. The middle school landscape could change sognificantly by then.

OP, the school is only one part of your life. A long commute will make it very hard to do other things like an instrument, a sport, any special activity that you may choose, especially if you can't afford a lot of household help. And with your child so young and your preference for downtown, it seems silly to make sacrifices for a middle or high school so far in the future.

Anonymous wrote:I believe that teachers touch a child’s life, even change it, inspire. Also, I believe that people around us influence who we become.

We gave public schools a chance in Elementary. But even the best teachers there were overworked, spent a lot of time on disciplining students rather than teaching, didn’t encourage asking questions because the class sizes (27 kids) and taught to test. The peer group had some good kids but also a lot of kids with undesired behavior - sexualized.

So we moved DD to a private. This is her first year in middle school. The max class size is 20. The teachers are awesome. They truly try to spark the joy of learning, they do a lot project based learning and games, encourage asking questions.

DD is surrounded by kids from good families, with high academic level, some overachievers. These are kids that travel, read books, go to museums and theaters, and do a lot of extra curricular activities- robotics, swimming, orchestra, etc. They don’t come home and plop in front of TV. So I’m hoping DD will thrive in this environment. So far she’s doing very well.

Side note: the public school was high performing, but it was still like day and night.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thnk it depends on the age and peer group at some point. we are white UMC family and our kid is not in fourth year at Title EoTP school. Only white kid in class. She is have a great experience. Learning a lot, small class sizes and very little teacher turnover. This makes a huge difference. Schools that have more teachers with at least 5 years of experience really has an impact on classroom management. But I know middle school is going to be the break off point for us. I don't want my kid in a class where 75% of kids are scoring below grade level on tests. I know its not all about the test. but by 5th grade it definitely is a major factor.

Are the other children not reaping the same positive benefits as your daughter? Will they end up below grade level by middle school despite the capable teachers?

There is only so much a great teacher can do in the hours she has a kid if the parents are home are absent,dysufnctional, illiterate, transient, drug addicted etc. We ask way too much of teachers. If a kids come to school prepared to learn, they will be fine at schools with low test scores. Other kids will too but each year the achievement gap will grow as will major behavioral issues, especially in kids who live with trauma daily. Its terrible but ultimately I have to put my kid first and I will by middle school.