Anonymous
Post 01/13/2020 14:58     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Any idea, when the results will be mailed? Looks like last year results were mailed the same day when the cogat results were displayed online.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 19:13     Subject: 5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Anonymous wrote:National percentile really provides zero information for the high end. An almost full score might not be much different from 1-3 wrongs, but should be quite different from 10-15 wrongs, yet we can see the national percentiles are the same at 99%.


Yes and no. There are even more meaningful differences, such as # attempted versus # total. If a kid got 50 questions right but only attempted 50/60, that's different information than a kid who got 40 right but attempted 60. What does it mean, exactly? I'm not sure...this is why we leave these interpretations to actual trained statisticians.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 19:12     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Anonymous wrote:A cohort of 20 "highly able" kids seems too small. Some of them would appeal and get in, so the cohort number might reduce to teens. 30 or above seems to be a more reasonable number.

Also, does "highly able" mean 99%? If it is 95%, the pool is very big.


7. Can you clarify what “availability of an academic peer group” means?
One of the criteria considered was the availability of an academic peer group within the local school. This is demonstrated when there is a cohort of 20 or more students in the same middle school with a similar academic profile and ability which serves as an academic peer group. Students who perform at high levels may or may not be invited to the program based on the availability of a similar academic peer group at their middle school.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 18:57     Subject: 5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
National percentile really provides zero information for the high end. An almost full score might not be much different from 1-3 wrongs, but should be quite different from 10-15 wrongs, yet we can see the national percentiles are the same at 99%.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 18:37     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Anonymous wrote:A cohort of 20 "highly able" kids seems too small. Some of them would appeal and get in, so the cohort number might reduce to teens. 30 or above seems to be a more reasonable number.

Also, does "highly able" mean 99%? If it is 95%, the pool is very big.

I think what 'highly able' means is left to the discretion of MCPS. They get to decide who are the chosen ones to be sent to the magnets and who will be going to the enriched magnet programs. I believe the 'cohort' should be just the right size to fit one class, so if only a few kids scored in the 99% in each MS, MCPS might as well add lower-scoring kids to the class.
And, in certain schools, 99% might be the cut-off.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 18:31     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
A cohort of 20 "highly able" kids seems too small. Some of them would appeal and get in, so the cohort number might reduce to teens. 30 or above seems to be a more reasonable number.

Also, does "highly able" mean 99%? If it is 95%, the pool is very big.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 17:24     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:As per one of the forums here, 7300 kids out of 12000 kids in county have attended the Magnet Cogat test. does it mean that 73 kids have 99 percentile?
Will all these 73 kids will get into the magnet program?


I think those numbers are wrong. I think there are 7300 5th graders and guessing about 4000 were tested. The 4000 number comes from last year.

Meaning about 1333 kids in each SES grouping and the percentiles are assigned by grouping. 13 99th percentile in each group or 39 in the county. But that assumes more of an even distribution. I think based on numbers I've seen before for high school that it's not an even distribution.

If there are lots of kids with the same score like if a whole bunch (10 percent of the total) got a perfect verbal score a perfect verbal score might only be 90th percentile. All of those kids would have gotten 90th percentile.


Except that would be local percentile, which still hasn’t come out yet. They would all be 99th percentile nationally, which is what we have now.

Agreed. Local percentiles are yet to be seen -- and I think those are the most interesting - while, nationally, 99% is not that hard of a bar to clear.


I just feel lucky that DD crosses that bar. The FARM rate is above 40% for DD's school, so that would help, I guess.


I just want to prepare you for all outcomes. The first year they did the cohort thing (but they didn’t do the MCPS percentiles), my 99 percentile kid who barely missed any questions on Q and V and a few on NV, going to a school with 50 percent FARMS, was rejected from both magnets. Not even waitlisted.


I believe that. They said in the FAQ that a cohort of other highly abled kids, which means there is a lower chance of admission, is about 20. Schools like PBES fit this criteria and it is close to 50% farms according to the school profile.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 16:23     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:As per one of the forums here, 7300 kids out of 12000 kids in county have attended the Magnet Cogat test. does it mean that 73 kids have 99 percentile?
Will all these 73 kids will get into the magnet program?


I think those numbers are wrong. I think there are 7300 5th graders and guessing about 4000 were tested. The 4000 number comes from last year.

Meaning about 1333 kids in each SES grouping and the percentiles are assigned by grouping. 13 99th percentile in each group or 39 in the county. But that assumes more of an even distribution. I think based on numbers I've seen before for high school that it's not an even distribution.

If there are lots of kids with the same score like if a whole bunch (10 percent of the total) got a perfect verbal score a perfect verbal score might only be 90th percentile. All of those kids would have gotten 90th percentile.


Except that would be local percentile, which still hasn’t come out yet. They would all be 99th percentile nationally, which is what we have now.

Agreed. Local percentiles are yet to be seen -- and I think those are the most interesting - while, nationally, 99% is not that hard of a bar to clear.


I just feel lucky that DD crosses that bar. The FARM rate is above 40% for DD's school, so that would help, I guess.


I just want to prepare you for all outcomes. The first year they did the cohort thing (but they didn’t do the MCPS percentiles), my 99 percentile kid who barely missed any questions on Q and V and a few on NV, going to a school with 50 percent FARMS, was rejected from both magnets. Not even waitlisted.


Race?
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 15:45     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:As per one of the forums here, 7300 kids out of 12000 kids in county have attended the Magnet Cogat test. does it mean that 73 kids have 99 percentile?
Will all these 73 kids will get into the magnet program?


I think those numbers are wrong. I think there are 7300 5th graders and guessing about 4000 were tested. The 4000 number comes from last year.

Meaning about 1333 kids in each SES grouping and the percentiles are assigned by grouping. 13 99th percentile in each group or 39 in the county. But that assumes more of an even distribution. I think based on numbers I've seen before for high school that it's not an even distribution.

If there are lots of kids with the same score like if a whole bunch (10 percent of the total) got a perfect verbal score a perfect verbal score might only be 90th percentile. All of those kids would have gotten 90th percentile.


Except that would be local percentile, which still hasn’t come out yet. They would all be 99th percentile nationally, which is what we have now.

Agreed. Local percentiles are yet to be seen -- and I think those are the most interesting - while, nationally, 99% is not that hard of a bar to clear.


I just feel lucky that DD crosses that bar. The FARM rate is above 40% for DD's school, so that would help, I guess.


I just want to prepare you for all outcomes. The first year they did the cohort thing (but they didn’t do the MCPS percentiles), my 99 percentile kid who barely missed any questions on Q and V and a few on NV, going to a school with 50 percent FARMS, was rejected from both magnets. Not even waitlisted.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 14:56     Subject: 5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
I think it's highly ridiculous that we are all participating in this conjecture, but I continue to, so whatever.

I found a study stating that students most likely to succeed in academic gifted programs will have consistently high scores in Q and V, and the N scores have less of an impact. Seems to be a pretty standard best practice for selection. So if your child has a high composite but with markedly higher Q and V scores, that seems to be the biggest CogAT indicator for selection according to experts.

No I will not post the study. If I found it you can too.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 13:05     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Very impressive scores. I hope kids with these extraordinary scores are all admitted to the magnet programs no matter where they are from.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 13:02     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Anonymous wrote:Just curious about the "student profile" on the score report- is it depending on each question the student did right or wrong? sound like the CogAT is pretty powerful test.
Anonymous wrote:

It's boilerplate and depends on the difference between areas. Was verbal much higher than quant? And the number they got right. I think it's useful but I wouldn't have too much faith in it. Group tests can be misleading for some kids. Use it as part of the whole picture of grades and other performance factors. DD is a good example. She had one score lower than others but when she has taken other tests (due to an LD) that has same area has consistently been an area of strength. This includes the 3rd grade Cogat screener, Inview, WPPSI and Woodcock Johnson achievement.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 12:26     Subject: 5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
forget about national %, we will have a new set of MCPS 'local' percentiles which will be used for decision.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 11:46     Subject: Re:5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Just curious about the "student profile" on the score report- is it depending on each question the student did right or wrong? sound like the CogAT is pretty powerful test.



Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Wow, this post sounds very professional. I hope MCPS could post something like this for parents- whoever want to know.

Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, no intention for competition at all, just want to have an idea where DD is in the whole map.
Now seems 9B is better than 9A.


9B is not better or worse than 9A.

A means that the child’s scores are consistent across all three tests.

B means that two of the scores are consistent and there is a relative outlier, either lower or higher than the other two.

C means that the three scores are spread out with a clear low, middle, and high score.

E is an extreme example of either B (outlier) or C (spread).


Read the pdf with your results. There is a link for more info about the profiles and it’s all there.
Anonymous
Post 01/12/2020 11:44     Subject: 5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Your kid did very well. It’s not a competition.

Except it is. Competitive magnet admissions depend on these scores.
I'd say, out of all the scores above, 20:35 has the best shot. My own child got 54, 50, 45 and I'm positive she won't get into any magnets but will, most likely, be picked for enriched MS courses. We'll see in about a week.


Not necessarily. It all depends on how those scores compare to those within the home middle school. Plus, as many others have pointed out, Cogat scores are just one factor.