Just like that transgender track athlete who was almost dead last running as a man. A year and a half later, taking hormones, completely blows past all other women competing as a transgender woman. The times run as a man and later as a woman were not too far off. And even looking st the athlete, she towered at least a foot taller than other women competitors and had muscle development visibility similar to. A man.

One lawsuit away from blowing all this sports stuff up.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't see us making any progress on this front. There are two things the sides would have to agree with.

1. There is no such thing as hate speech.
2. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness.

Until there is common ground on these two topics there is very little that can be done.

I attended the school board meeting last night, and was deeply saddened to observe parents who are unwilling to teach their children these facts but go beyond basic negligence and teach the opposite. It is child abuse at the very least.

I suppose homosexuality is a mental illness too? The American College of Pediatricians, which is a primary source for the Arlington Parent Coalition, believes that too, and supports conversion therapy: https://keepkidshealthy.com/2017/09/06/what-is-the-american-college-of-pediatricians/

No, we are not going to agree that gender dysphoria or homosexuality is a mental illness, and they are not "facts."

Gender dysphoria is listed in the DSM as a mental illness and the American Psychiatry Association refers to it as such. https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/gender-dysphoria/what-is-gender-dysphoria

I''m not the poster who said this, but I completely agree it is a mental illness. I don't understand 2- there is such a thing as hate speech. I don't view stating that gender dysphoria is a mental illness as hate speech, and I think the term 'hate speech' has been dramatically abused in this conversation- but I don't think pretending that hate speech doesn't exist is useful either.

My bad. Yes, gender dysphoria is an illness. The illness is the conflict, though, not the fact that an individual doesn't feel like their birth gender.

The goal of treatment isn't to "make a person live with their birth gender" - that's the issue here, and the ACP/APC are definitely not in favor of APS being supportive of some treatment options. The goal of treatment is to resolve the conflict, not to make people live with their birth gender and all the societal conventions (such as having to use a certain bathroom) that go along with it. From the article:

"Treatment options for gender dysphoria include counseling, cross-sex hormones, puberty suppression and gender reassignment surgery."

It is an important first step, acknowledging it is an illness! I appreciate that you provided some of the treatment options for gender dysphoria. They are probably very valuable options for a person who is struggling with gender dysphoria. The current PIP goes well beyond the non-discrimination policy put in place by the school board some years ago. The PIP must include provisions to cover highly probable scenarios and it does not in its current state. In fact it leaves almost no common sense options for students/staff. There are are some rules that need to be bent, and then there are some that can not. In its current state the PIP would allow an 18 year old boy to enter the common dressing/locker/shower room of 14 year old girl? I would also allow superior athletes of the opposite birth sex to compete where it might impact the other students in how they are evaluated against competition or awarded because of success. It would also allow for students/teachers/administrative staff to be penalized for incorrectly using the pronouns that are required on the days old whim of a 6 year old. At the conclusion of the school board meeting last night the speaker for APS admin staff could not address any of these three scenarios appropriately when question by the board and there are so many other impacts that have not been assessed. Full disclosure, she kicked the can on the title ix violations over to the governing body of high school sports...

I am the PP who said who cares what this group says or what is on next door. You call me a bigot! Dude, that is the problem. You automatically assume that anyone who isn't jumping up and down all over this is AGAINST YOU.

There are a lot of us out there who don't care whether you are gay, trans what ever. Marry and sleep with whomever you want. Live your life as a man or woman. Go for it.

Lots of us who want to support people who are trans. Some of us even have known and adored kids who are trans. That doesn't stop us from questioning what school board policies should be. That does not, and should not stop us from questioning how those policies would impact non-trans kids. You expect me and everyone else to adopt your version of the world hook, line and sinker. No independent or cautious thought. No consideration of others or anyone others. Nada.

I do not agree with people who believe in conversion therapy or that being gay, trans or whatever is morally wrong. I do want to support the trans community, but people like you make that very hard. Your tactics and name calling are a huge turn off and do harm to the cause.

You need people like me....stop alienating me.

Anonymous wrote:also- I say that gender dsyphoria is a mental illness as a parent of a child with significant mental illness. I don't view identifying something that is mental illness as mental illness as hateful or objectionable. It's helpful to obtaining treatment.

Why do you think gender dysphoria has to be "treated?" Do you pray away the gay, too?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't see us making any progress on this front. There are two things the sides would have to agree with.

1. There is no such thing as hate speech.
2. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness.

Until there is common ground on these two topics there is very little that can be done.

I attended the school board meeting last night, and was deeply saddened to observe parents who are unwilling to teach their children these facts but go beyond basic negligence and teach the opposite. It is child abuse at the very least.

I suppose homosexuality is a mental illness too? The American College of Pediatricians, which is a primary source for the Arlington Parent Coalition, believes that too, and supports conversion therapy: https://keepkidshealthy.com/2017/09/06/what-is-the-american-college-of-pediatricians/

No, we are not going to agree that gender dysphoria or homosexuality is a mental illness, and they are not "facts."

Gender dysphoria is listed in the DSM as a mental illness and the American Psychiatry Association refers to it as such. https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/gender-dysphoria/what-is-gender-dysphoria

I''m not the poster who said this, but I completely agree it is a mental illness. I don't understand 2- there is such a thing as hate speech. I don't view stating that gender dysphoria is a mental illness as hate speech, and I think the term 'hate speech' has been dramatically abused in this conversation- but I don't think pretending that hate speech doesn't exist is useful either.

My bad. Yes, gender dysphoria is an illness. The illness is the conflict, though, not the fact that an individual doesn't feel like their birth gender.

The goal of treatment isn't to "make a person live with their birth gender" - that's the issue here, and the ACP/APC are definitely not in favor of APS being supportive of some treatment options. The goal of treatment is to resolve the conflict, not to make people live with their birth gender and all the societal conventions (such as having to use a certain bathroom) that go along with it. From the article:

"Treatment options for gender dysphoria include counseling, cross-sex hormones, puberty suppression and gender reassignment surgery."

also- I say that gender dsyphoria is a mental illness as a parent of a child with significant mental illness. I don't view identifying something that is mental illness as mental illness as hateful or objectionable. It's helpful to obtaining treatment.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't see us making any progress on this front. There are two things the sides would have to agree with.

1. There is no such thing as hate speech.
2. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness.

Until there is common ground on these two topics there is very little that can be done.

I attended the school board meeting last night, and was deeply saddened to observe parents who are unwilling to teach their children these facts but go beyond basic negligence and teach the opposite. It is child abuse at the very least.

I suppose homosexuality is a mental illness too? The American College of Pediatricians, which is a primary source for the Arlington Parent Coalition, believes that too, and supports conversion therapy: https://keepkidshealthy.com/2017/09/06/what-is-the-american-college-of-pediatricians/

No, we are not going to agree that gender dysphoria or homosexuality is a mental illness, and they are not "facts."

Gender dysphoria is listed in the DSM as a mental illness and the American Psychiatry Association refers to it as such. https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/gender-dysphoria/what-is-gender-dysphoria

I''m not the poster who said this, but I completely agree it is a mental illness. I don't understand 2- there is such a thing as hate speech. I don't view stating that gender dysphoria is a mental illness as hate speech, and I think the term 'hate speech' has been dramatically abused in this conversation- but I don't think pretending that hate speech doesn't exist is useful either.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don’t have to listen to anyone. So what if someone posts something on next door. Just move on. If you disagree with their opinions so much then don’t give their opinions more coverage. By sharing on this website you have shared their opinions far and wide.

Such a tizzy over people who disagree with you.

In Arlington, you are not allowed to disagree.

You can disagree all you want, but it's not like your viewpoint is valid. When your central argument is hate-based and your "evidence" is fabricated, no one will take what you have to say seriously. Stomping your feet and crying like a toddler won't make anyone take you seriously.

Love the tolerant liberals - this is why Trump won.

Ah, the "why won't you tolerate my intolerance" trope. Right on cue.

Anonymous wrote:I don't see us making any progress on this front. There are two things the sides would have to agree with.

1. There is no such thing as hate speech.
2. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness.

Until there is common ground on these two topics there is very little that can be done.

I attended the school board meeting last night, and was deeply saddened to observe parents who are unwilling to teach their children these facts but go beyond basic negligence and teach the opposite. It is child abuse at the very least.

I suppose homosexuality is a mental illness too? The American College of Pediatricians, which is a primary source for the Arlington Parent Coalition, believes that too, and supports conversion therapy: https://keepkidshealthy.com/2017/09/06/what-is-the-american-college-of-pediatricians/

No, we are not going to agree that gender dysphoria or homosexuality is a mental illness, and they are not "facts."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don’t have to listen to anyone. So what if someone posts something on next door. Just move on. If you disagree with their opinions so much then don’t give their opinions more coverage. By sharing on this website you have shared their opinions far and wide.

Such a tizzy over people who disagree with you.

In Arlington, you are not allowed to disagree.

You can disagree all you want, but it's not like your viewpoint is valid. When your central argument is hate-based and your "evidence" is fabricated, no one will take what you have to say seriously. Stomping your feet and crying like a toddler won't make anyone take you seriously.

Love the tolerant liberals - this is why Trump won.

So your idea of tolerance is accepting made-up research as fact?

By that definition, I'm proud to be intolerant. Typical Trumpster gaslighting: refuting fake research = intolerance. I guess it's not surprising since what we've come to expect from Trump is lies and doctored videos.

I don't see us making any progress on this front. There are two things the sides would have to agree with.

1. There is no such thing as hate speech.
2. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness.

Until there is common ground on these two topics there is very little that can be done.

I attended the school board meeting last night, and was deeply saddened to observe parents who are unwilling to teach their children these facts but go beyond basic negligence and teach the opposite. It is child abuse at the very least.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don’t have to listen to anyone. So what if someone posts something on next door. Just move on. If you disagree with their opinions so much then don’t give their opinions more coverage. By sharing on this website you have shared their opinions far and wide.

Such a tizzy over people who disagree with you.

In Arlington, you are not allowed to disagree.

You can disagree all you want, but it's not like your viewpoint is valid. When your central argument is hate-based and your "evidence" is fabricated, no one will take what you have to say seriously. Stomping your feet and crying like a toddler won't make anyone take you seriously.

Love the tolerant liberals - this is why Trump won.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don’t have to listen to anyone. So what if someone posts something on next door. Just move on. If you disagree with their opinions so much then don’t give their opinions more coverage. By sharing on this website you have shared their opinions far and wide.

Such a tizzy over people who disagree with you.

In Arlington, you are not allowed to disagree.

You can disagree all you want, but it's not like your viewpoint is valid. When your central argument is hate-based and your "evidence" is fabricated, no one will take what you have to say seriously. Stomping your feet and crying like a toddler won't make anyone take you seriously.

Exactly

Anonymous wrote:Without of course, recognizing that the one calling out the bigots may be just as intolerant as the bigot.

Oh look. A gaslighting bigot.

Anonymous wrote:I know almost nothing about the American College of Pediatricians. I know quite a bit more about the SPLC-my only view is that the SPLC is no longer a reliable source.
Frankly, I don't care what the ACP says. I already said that I am on the fence about a lot of the transgender issues as it relates to kids. It is a complicated issue and anyone who says otherwise is lying.

So, back to schools. How do you feel about transgenders and girl's sports? I strongly believe that transgender women should not be competing with biological girls.
I really don't care about bathrooms, and I am not too sure about locker rooms. Frankly, in my experience, girls are fairly modest and go into corners. I would think that might be more difficult in a boys' shower room for transgender boys.

I don't care what they say either. But, I do care when someone in my community is using them as a primary source of authority and presents them as legitimate, when making a case for a certain policy position. It's deceptive, disingenuous, and the fact that they are so easily willing to present fake research as fact makes me highly suspicious of their motives and the basis of their viewpoints.

I agree with the draft policy. This thread isn't about the policy itself, feel free to start one if you want to discuss it. It's about the Arlington Parent Coalition, which presents itself as a "a diverse group of Arlington Public School parents and community members, who are committed to safeguarding parents' rights to raise their children according to their family's values and beliefs." Yet it lists no members, so it's pretty hard for me to believe it's "diverse", or more than the work of a single person. It references a great deal of research from fake academic and otherwise discredited organizations while presenting it as legitimate research.

My concern is that members of the community may be fooled into believing APC represents more than the position of a single anti-LGBT individual, and may believe that the citations they present represent actual balanced research. The point of this post is to discuss that group, and the deceptive way they present themseleves and their positions, not the policy.