Anonymous
05/08/2019 21:54
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
I like how it's "so saaaaaad" when you're describing a mom, but when it's a dad, he's just...a dad.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 21:50
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
Anonymous wrote:I’m a biglaw mom and I admit it. I don’t like the drudgery of parenting. I try to see my kids every night but I also don’t come home earlier even when I could because I just don’t want to deal.
Same. And I have no problems going out to drinks or dinner with people, which surprises them at first because they assume I'll have no interest in doing that because I'm trying to run home to my 4 and 7 year olds. At first they ask the -- oh do the kids have sleepovers; are they off visiting their grandparent -- questions. And then after the 2nd-3rd time going out, they realize the kids may be home but it has no effect on my plans.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 20:42
Subject: Re:Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
Yes, I had a female boss like this. She could only deal with her kids for short periods of time. It was really sad.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 20:41
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
Honey, you just described dads in the 1950s-80s.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 20:41
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
I see this and i don’t work in law or medicine. A friend thinks she’s indispensable. She called me daily on my maternity leave to tell me what was happening at work and how my absence was making so much more work for her. Because we used to be close friends I felt bad and ended my maternity leave a bit earlier. Since then she has found ways to make me and other moms the scapegoat for everything at work. She works constantly and makes more work for others that isn’t needed or even wanted. She will someday have to work through that with herself and her family. Not my circus. Not my monkeys.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 20:40
Subject: Re:Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
For women there is pressure to prove that you aren't mommy tracking and you still have a brain. You also know that there will be times when you can't travel or need to leave early so you put in extra time when you can so that option will be there when you need it.
This happens in so many situations. If the mother is surrounded by a bunch of men with SAHMs then she'll feel pressure not to be left out of important work activities or seen as not available for tough assignments. If the mother is younger and around millennial it can be worse.
As a manager, I can tell you that single millennials really resent their co-workers who have children and change their schedule. I used to hear complaining all the time about how so and so has to leave early now so meetings now need to be at 9:00 am which is so early instead of 5pm when everyone could go to happy hour afterwards. I've had a millennial complain that it isn't fair for the person with a new baby to not get called in to work super late because their personal plans are just as important with zero realization that the mother they are trashing was the one who worked late home the last two times while they went drinking.
This happens in so many situations. If the mother is surrounded by a bunch of men with SAHMs then she'll feel pressure not to be left out of important work activities or seen as not available for tough assignments. If the mother is younger and around millennial it can be worse.
As a manager, I can tell you that single millennials really resent their co-workers who have children and change their schedule. I used to hear complaining all the time about how so and so has to leave early now so meetings now need to be at 9:00 am which is so early instead of 5pm when everyone could go to happy hour afterwards. I've had a millennial complain that it isn't fair for the person with a new baby to not get called in to work super late because their personal plans are just as important with zero realization that the mother they are trashing was the one who worked late home the last two times while they went drinking.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 20:33
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
Anonymous wrote:This thread is very sad. The kids pay the price.
My parents were divorced with perfect 50/50 custody. I would say “I’m fine” but I will consider the counterpoint that by being the kind of mom who avoids parenting drudgery, maybe I’m not. I love them. I just can’t do so many hours at a stretch with them.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 20:32
Subject: Re:Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
I will admit that I am really surprised that people are mostly mentioning moms on this thread.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 20:31
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
I’m a biglaw mom and I admit it. I don’t like the drudgery of parenting. I try to see my kids every night but I also don’t come home earlier even when I could because I just don’t want to deal.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 20:09
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
This thread is very sad. The kids pay the price.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 19:57
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
Oh yeah, my DH has been doing this since our child was maybe 5 weeks old? Has to "do lots of work" and "work late" almost every night.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 19:51
Subject: Re:Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
I know a whole bunch. You can easily tell. Work first, kids .. not so much.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 16:48
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
Yes. Both attorneys (though this is likely coincidental).
I worked for a solo practitioner who wasted so much time and would do anything to avoid going home to her baby/husband. On her "half days," she would go play on her computer at Starbucks if the babysitter was available to watch her DS. She was on Facebook constantly looking for nannies and babysitters (she wouldn't shell out the money to use a service or agency). In hinddight, the whole situation was bizarre.
Other was a female who didn't really want kids, but her DH pressured her into it. She does anything to spend time away from them, and when she is home, is clearly peeved at the nature of parenting.
I worked for a solo practitioner who wasted so much time and would do anything to avoid going home to her baby/husband. On her "half days," she would go play on her computer at Starbucks if the babysitter was available to watch her DS. She was on Facebook constantly looking for nannies and babysitters (she wouldn't shell out the money to use a service or agency). In hinddight, the whole situation was bizarre.
Other was a female who didn't really want kids, but her DH pressured her into it. She does anything to spend time away from them, and when she is home, is clearly peeved at the nature of parenting.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 14:45
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
Anonymous wrote:Of course. They delude themselves into thinking they are indispensable at work.
Spoiler alert: no one is indispensable to their employer.
This. I have one friend like this and I often wonder if she’s really going to regret everything she voluntarily put into work. She just cannot say no to work when they ask her to wear yet another hat, but they keep giving her more responsibilities because she doesn’t push back. I think she doesn’t push back so she can avoid being at home. Her child has some special needs and needs a LOT of attention and she feels validated at work.
She can always justify why she needs to take that extra trip or stay late at an event or work on vacation or on a day she’s taken PTO etc. On the weekends she’ll text me that she’s working inside and ask if she can send her kid out to play with mine. There’s always a work related reason why she can’t be with her kid. My opinion is not due to her being a woman and mom—her DH can have similar tendencies but knows when enough is enough and can set some boundaries. My friend cannot or will not set boundaries with work and therefore she almost is never not working.
Anonymous
05/08/2019 14:27
Subject: Do you know people who throw themselves into their jobs to avoid childcare?
I've seen it more than once in biglaw but not across the board by any means. It was definitely more guys that did this than women. Typically male mid levels/senior associates. Don't know them personally enough to know what the story was -- either they didn't want kids OR they wanted a family but didn't realize how much work it was/that their wives would expect some involvement until the kids arrived. And then suddenly all of those guys were "going for partner" -- in departments where we didn't have work; no chance of partner etc. But it was a good way to be in the office from 10 am to 10 pm nightly.
Saw it in some of the male partners too -- with them it wasn't even babies so much as just not wanting interaction with their families. They would waste SOOOO much time all day -- walking around, chatting, reading the newspaper etc. and then suddenly at 4 pm they were SOOO busy (you often heard them on the phone telling their wives) and then would stay in the office from 4 pm to 10 pm. Reality is there was nothing going on -- no trial, depos etc. -- so they could've done their work in a 6-8 hr day and gone home but didn't want to.
Didn't really see this in women -- though I do have one female friend who is a junior partner who travels more than necessary. We know each other well though and she's told me that she didn't want kids but her DH did, so they agreed to have one and then the second was an oops. When the kids were babies, she'd be in our NYC office at least 1-2/month for at least 2-3 days (she's DC based and didn't HAVE TO be there). At first it was -- I'm an associate, I HAVE TO show the NYC partners how much I care, need face time with them, am not mommy track. Then she made partner and it was much more "networking" -- yet when she's in NYC she hardly ever goes to events etc. Really it's more being able to get 2-3 night of solid sleep and go out to dinner with friends/socialize. I will say, that has fallen off for her -- maybe it's the DH noticing but moreso I think it's because the kids are school age now and in an easier stage, she doesn't mind going to school plays and soccer and helping with home work. It was the toddler tantrums and diapers she was avoiding.
Saw it in some of the male partners too -- with them it wasn't even babies so much as just not wanting interaction with their families. They would waste SOOOO much time all day -- walking around, chatting, reading the newspaper etc. and then suddenly at 4 pm they were SOOO busy (you often heard them on the phone telling their wives) and then would stay in the office from 4 pm to 10 pm. Reality is there was nothing going on -- no trial, depos etc. -- so they could've done their work in a 6-8 hr day and gone home but didn't want to.
Didn't really see this in women -- though I do have one female friend who is a junior partner who travels more than necessary. We know each other well though and she's told me that she didn't want kids but her DH did, so they agreed to have one and then the second was an oops. When the kids were babies, she'd be in our NYC office at least 1-2/month for at least 2-3 days (she's DC based and didn't HAVE TO be there). At first it was -- I'm an associate, I HAVE TO show the NYC partners how much I care, need face time with them, am not mommy track. Then she made partner and it was much more "networking" -- yet when she's in NYC she hardly ever goes to events etc. Really it's more being able to get 2-3 night of solid sleep and go out to dinner with friends/socialize. I will say, that has fallen off for her -- maybe it's the DH noticing but moreso I think it's because the kids are school age now and in an easier stage, she doesn't mind going to school plays and soccer and helping with home work. It was the toddler tantrums and diapers she was avoiding.