Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:57     Subject: Re:Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:So the take away here is that if I go to another country and I find any customs or practices creepy, weird or uncomfortable, that country should stop doing them to accommodate me. Got it.

At least you've got American Entitlement™ down pat.


I guess I missed the posts where people said that they are immigrants and want the county schools to stop doing the pledge of allegiance because they think it's weird.

Also, one of the great things about America is, or at least used to be, that people who became American citizens through immigration are just as American as people who become American citizens through birth. And you agree that people get to criticize their country, right? "America, love it or leave it" went out in the 1960s - probably before you were born.


Yeah, I don't think that we need to import more people to criticize the country. Sorry, but the people coming here should be the first to stand during the pledge and thank their lucky stars that they were given the ability to come. Yes, we have freedom of speech here, but we should be able to expect a modicum of gratitude and allegiance, especially from new arrivals.
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:47     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:
See, be real. I am an immigrant too. If you choose to enroll your kid in a Catholic school, they will say the Lord's prayer daily. If you choose to come to this country, don't feign surprise about these things, just go back to where you came from, where you apparently have such a high level of personal rights.


I am an immigrant too and I don't have much problem with the pledge either.

However, I don't have issues when other people have problems with it. If they have problems, instead of going back (which some people keep touting), why can't they try to change it? We are now part of the process anyway, right? The pledge is at least not something we grow up with and I won't feel upset if people want to go against it.

Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:47     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I wasn't born in this country and I am uncomfortable about the idea of my kids doing it


This is why many of us are frustrated. You want to come here and benefit from the economy and from the protection of your rights, but don't feel "allegiance"? This is a civic ritual, and if it "brainwashes" kids into valuing "liberty and justice for all", I'm good.


"Many of us", who? I'm not frustrated. I understand that feeling allegiance, and saying the pledge of allegiance, are two different things. One may feel allegiance but not say the pledge (me, for example). One may also not feel allegiance but say the pledge.

-person who was born in this country


Yes, apparently there are "many of us"...
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:42     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:Ok so it’s weird for kids to drone out the pledge every morning. So what? It does built a spirit of national pride and norms — correct my history but I am guessing it grew out of the big immigrant waves, the world wars, etc., when reinforcing American identity and citizenship was crucial.

And similarly so today!


Actually, no.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/the-man-who-wrote-the-pledge-of-allegiance-93907224/
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:39     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Ok so it’s weird for kids to drone out the pledge every morning. So what? It does built a spirit of national pride and norms — correct my history but I am guessing it grew out of the big immigrant waves, the world wars, etc., when reinforcing American identity and citizenship was crucial.

And similarly so today!
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:33     Subject: Re:Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:So the take away here is that if I go to another country and I find any customs or practices creepy, weird or uncomfortable, that country should stop doing them to accommodate me. Got it.

At least you've got American Entitlement™ down pat.


I guess I missed the posts where people said that they are immigrants and want the county schools to stop doing the pledge of allegiance because they think it's weird.

Also, one of the great things about America is, or at least used to be, that people who became American citizens through immigration are just as American as people who become American citizens through birth. And you agree that people get to criticize their country, right? "America, love it or leave it" went out in the 1960s - probably before you were born.
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:30     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I wasn't born in this country and I am uncomfortable about the idea of my kids doing it


This is why many of us are frustrated. You want to come here and benefit from the economy and from the protection of your rights, but don't feel "allegiance"? This is a civic ritual, and if it "brainwashes" kids into valuing "liberty and justice for all", I'm good.


I was also not born here and neither were my children and I find it weird too, I'm sorry. We love it here, we (the adults) feel allegiance to the ideas set out in the pledge (not including the god part which feels unnecessary to me), but I don't expect my children to feel that when they can barely understand the words. They learned about the pledge in pre-k and learned the words then, and I'm fine with that, but I would be very uncomfortable with them having to recite it every day as a ritual. If when they are old enough to understand it they wish to say it, then that is fine with me. But mindlessly reciting a promise every day that they cannot possibly understand feels really uncomfortable to me, and similar to how I would feel if they were made to say the Lord's Prayer every day.


See, be real. I am an immigrant too. If you choose to enroll your kid in a Catholic school, they will say the Lord's prayer daily. If you choose to come to this country, don't feign surprise about these things, just go back to where you came from, where you apparently have such a high level of personal rights.
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:27     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:I wasn't born in this country and I am uncomfortable about the idea of my kids doing it


Do you have a green card or did you become a US citizen?
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:24     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I wasn't born in this country and I am uncomfortable about the idea of my kids doing it


This is why many of us are frustrated. You want to come here and benefit from the economy and from the protection of your rights, but don't feel "allegiance"? This is a civic ritual, and if it "brainwashes" kids into valuing "liberty and justice for all", I'm good.

Many others of us were born here and want to tell you that your kids don't have to do it. It's up to them! That choice is another of the great things about this country.
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:20     Subject: Re:Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
So the take away here is that if I go to another country and I find any customs or practices creepy, weird or uncomfortable, that country should stop doing them to accommodate me. Got it.

At least you've got American Entitlement™ down pat.
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:14     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:All 500+ of us said it for 13 years in my nova public HS/MS/elem graduating class. We turned out fine. Most of us are very liberal to boot!

I don’t get the complaint. It takes 1 minute, and you don’t have to mean it, and you don’t even have to participate. And it shows a tiny appreciation for what we have.


I agree. And, I'm the kid of immigrants, FWIW.

However, this is Montgomery County. I'm pretty sure if you're bothered by the pledge, you could get some other parents together and ban it in MCPS. I would bet that would be a successful campaign actually. MCPS might even spend some money, form a committee, get some 'feedback' from parents, and have an independent agency run a report.

It's crazy, because parents don't seem willing to band together to get MCPS to take action against the ridiculous number of sexual predators in school, or to get a solid curriculum implemented in ES. However, a cause like this would very likely get lots of support. I'm not from this area, and this is such an interesting county, IMO.


Now wait a minute. Don’t forget about the consultants! MCPS would have to hire consultants!
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:04     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:What exactly do the PPs disapprove of about the pledge?

If it's the 'under God' part, then just tell your kid not to say that.

Is it the 'liberty and justice for all' part that is offensive to many? I'm not sure how to respond to that, because isn't that what this country is built on? Striving for liberty and justice for all.


I very much doubt the 'liberty and justice for all' part alone would be a big issue for anyone.

There are other parts to it, and there are also issues like where, when to say it and how often we say it. Also whether we feel pressured to say it.

Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 14:03     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:What exactly do the PPs disapprove of about the pledge?

If it's the 'under God' part, then just tell your kid not to say that.

Is it the 'liberty and justice for all' part that is offensive to many? I'm not sure how to respond to that, because isn't that what this country is built on? Striving for liberty and justice for all.


I haven't noticed anybody saying they were offended. Just people saying that they don't like it or think it's weird, for reasons they explained right there in their posts.
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 13:58     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
What exactly do the PPs disapprove of about the pledge?

If it's the 'under God' part, then just tell your kid not to say that.

Is it the 'liberty and justice for all' part that is offensive to many? I'm not sure how to respond to that, because isn't that what this country is built on? Striving for liberty and justice for all.
Anonymous
Post 03/20/2019 13:24     Subject: Do they do the pledge of allegiance in your kids' school?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I wasn't born in this country and I am uncomfortable about the idea of my kids doing it


This is why many of us are frustrated. You want to come here and benefit from the economy and from the protection of your rights, but don't feel "allegiance"? This is a civic ritual, and if it "brainwashes" kids into valuing "liberty and justice for all", I'm good.


I was also not born here and neither were my children and I find it weird too, I'm sorry. We love it here, we (the adults) feel allegiance to the ideas set out in the pledge (not including the god part which feels unnecessary to me), but I don't expect my children to feel that when they can barely understand the words. They learned about the pledge in pre-k and learned the words then, and I'm fine with that, but I would be very uncomfortable with them having to recite it every day as a ritual. If when they are old enough to understand it they wish to say it, then that is fine with me. But mindlessly reciting a promise every day that they cannot possibly understand feels really uncomfortable to me, and similar to how I would feel if they were made to say the Lord's Prayer every day.