I'm sorry, OP. I feel the same way when folks go on about "stable, two parent families."

The circumstances under which I became a single parent are stupid and chiched, but had nothing to do with bad decisions, or lack of education, or getting married too young. It wasn't even due to choosing the wrong partner, except insofar as people change.

I really wish I could have given my kids the stable two parent family that everyone talks about, but the fact that circumstances beyond my control made that impossible? It doesn't make my kids any less amazing, or worse friends and classmates.

Anonymous wrote:NP. I actually didn't have an opinion about this one way or the other until I tried to figure out why one of the schools in our district (not in DMV) was rated a 4/10 when all the others were rated at least 9/10 and generally 10/10. Then I realized that there are many apartments there, and the rest of the district is basically all SFHs.

So objectively it seems like the apartments are (or at least sometimes are) correlated with dramatically lower school test scores.

You look down on families who live in apartments because the school with low test scores in your school district is also the school the kids who live in apartments go to?

NP. I actually didn't have an opinion about this one way or the other until I tried to figure out why one of the schools in our district (not in DMV) was rated a 4/10 when all the others were rated at least 9/10 and generally 10/10. Then I realized that there are many apartments there, and the rest of the district is basically all SFHs.

So objectively it seems like the apartments are (or at least sometimes are) correlated with dramatically lower school test scores.

Anonymous wrote:People that rent typically don’t plan on sticking around long and don’t make connections to the community.

There’s a house that’s rented out down the street from me and they don’t take care of the property like they should. They drove their car up the curb and parked half the tires on the lawn - destroying a section of it. They leave trash strewn around. They don’t cut the grass as often as they should. If this was their house they would have treated it better.

Sounds like my ex-husband’s house, except he “owns” the property. Some people just have no self-respect.

Anonymous wrote:People that rent typically don’t plan on sticking around long and don’t make connections to the community.

There’s a house that’s rented out down the street from me and they don’t take care of the property like they should. They drove their car up the curb and parked half the tires on the lawn - destroying a section of it. They leave trash strewn around. They don’t cut the grass as often as they should. If this was their house they would have treated it better.

You just explained why property owners who aren't landlords look down on renters, not why people look down on people who live in apartments.

Also, people who rent, typically do so not because they don't plan on sticking around long, but because they can't afford to buy. Especially these days.

People that rent typically don’t plan on sticking around long and don’t make connections to the community.

There’s a house that’s rented out down the street from me and they don’t take care of the property like they should. They drove their car up the curb and parked half the tires on the lawn - destroying a section of it. They leave trash strewn around. They don’t cut the grass as often as they should. If this was their house they would have treated it better.

I think sometimes "apartment people" is a dog whistle for lower SES minority residents (I'm a "brown" minority, and wish people would be more upfront with their prejudices).

In the wealthier clusters I believe there’s a sentiment that apartment dwellers are likelier to move and therefore aren’t as invested in the school community (so the snobs won’t invest their time towards you). Similar to the attitudes you see towards military families or other families with transient jobs.

Man, this country is so provincial it's sad.
You people should get out more.

Anonymous wrote:No, apartments mean lots of people in not a lot of space.

At least from my perspective. In my head, it just leads to over crowded. I don’t care if it’s rich over crowding or poor over crowding. Too many kids in a class, is too many kids.

It leads to overcrowded in your head because you believe that the appropriate density is people living in free-standing houses with yards.

Anonymous wrote:I think it's because apartments are where section 8 housing vouchers mostly go. While I don't always agree with apartment = poor, our local school's rating dropped when a new apartment complex opened. The apartments aren't even that cheap, but I think they're the cheapest thing that low income people can afford in this area and multiple families are living in each apartment.

Most poor people in Montgomery County don't have Section 8 vouchers, and most apartments in Montgomery County aren't occupied by people with Section 8 vouchers.

Some data here.

In Montgomery County, there are currently 5,624 standard Section 8 housing vouchers, for $1,125 per month. The average wait for a voucher is ~43 months (3 years 7 months). The average voucher household has 2.5 persons and has a household income of $18,561 per year.

About 35% of households in Montgomery County rent. The median income of renting households in Montgomery County is about $62,000. About 40% of renting households spend 35% or more of their income on housing costs. Median gross rent is about $1,700.

There are about 134,000 units in multi-family buildings in Montgomery County.

About 57,000 students in MCPS receive free or reduced meals.



Median household income is about $103,000.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, apartments mean lots of people in not a lot of space.

At least from my perspective. In my head, it just leads to over crowded. I don’t care if it’s rich over crowding or poor over crowding. Too many kids in a class, is too many kids.

Most of Europe is much denser, from a housing standpoint, and they have average primary school class sizes that are equivalent to what we have (mid-20s) or smaller (https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/183364/DFE-RR169.pdf). Secondary school class sizes are more like the low 20s.

But we aren’t in Europe

My point is that PP is wrong that lots of kids in apartments = overcrowding.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, apartments mean lots of people in not a lot of space.

At least from my perspective. In my head, it just leads to over crowded. I don’t care if it’s rich over crowding or poor over crowding. Too many kids in a class, is too many kids.

Most of Europe is much denser, from a housing standpoint, and they have average primary school class sizes that are equivalent to what we have (mid-20s) or smaller (https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/183364/DFE-RR169.pdf). Secondary school class sizes are more like the low 20s.

But we aren’t in Europe

I think it's because apartments are where section 8 housing vouchers mostly go. While I don't always agree with apartment = poor, our local school's rating dropped when a new apartment complex opened. The apartments aren't even that cheap, but I think they're the cheapest thing that low income people can afford in this area and multiple families are living in each apartment.

Anonymous wrote:No, apartments mean lots of people in not a lot of space.

At least from my perspective. In my head, it just leads to over crowded. I don’t care if it’s rich over crowding or poor over crowding. Too many kids in a class, is too many kids.

Most of Europe is much denser, from a housing standpoint, and they have average primary school class sizes that are equivalent to what we have (mid-20s) or smaller (https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/183364/DFE-RR169.pdf). Secondary school class sizes are more like the low 20s.