I’m not sure what everyone thinks they deserve. 20, 30 and definitely not 40 years ago did we have the expense of Starbucks, cell phones, travel soccer, and everything else that eats into our pockets. Look at the difference in how we live now vs then, honestly, and then compare. Also, not everyone deserves to be rich because you think you do.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So my parents live very well on their retirement. My father was career military and then was a government service worker. My mom never worked. My grandfather also was career military. They have unbelievable pensions and my father even more so. Whereas my husband and I who are way better educated will never retire.

x1000

Exactly. I wonder if that generation realizes how good they have it?

People in that generation were not so lucky if they were black or gay. Better off now.

Anonymous wrote:Do you feel like a sucker if you grew up middle class...your family obeyed all of the rules...worked the proverbial "9-5" and had nothing to show for it? I feel like we were suckers to work so heard and then couldn't even afford to go out (ever) nor go on vacations. I suspect most Americans are like this and only the uMC/rich get to enjoy the perks/profits off the backs of the MC

I know teachers, suburban cops and firefighters, and paper pushing city/county bureaucrats who retired after 20 to 25 years with full pensions and platinum health care for life. Still in their 40s, many would then double dip and go build another pension or do lucrative consulting work. Sell the house, move to Florida coast, relax and live VERY comfortably. All with pretty basic 9 to 5 gigs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My rich aunt Recently told my husband:

“You’re middle class and middle class people are suckers.”

Very simple. We are suckers until we vote for people who advocate for our interests. Until then we can sit and watch the people around us struggle. Very fun!

I agree with this. We're not suckers as individuals for not gaming the system, we might be suckers for not trying harder to change it.

I grew up poor and now have an UMC HHI (low 400k). Of all the classes, the middle class has the most suckers because you have a formulaic view of success. You think, "if I do x, y, and z I will be comfortable" which is a form of laziness. The working class and below, and the secure UMC and higher, are hustlers. We know that if you must always be on the prowl for advantages and opportunities. I don't ever met MC people with this mentality.

400k is more than UMC.

I kind of hate the person who started “you can be anything you want!!” And drilled it into everyone’s head without really saying how to get there.

Opportunity and connections are the biggest thingsI did not have. I was very ill prepared and hope to make the transition easier for my kids, and find resources to help them as best I can.

I’m not saying I should have gotten a hand out, I just wish I knew more of what was out there, and what my possibilities were, what was realistic. I didn’t realize that certain people, even though they work hard, also have family connections and safety nets that give them an upper hand. If I would have known I probably would have focused on making better connections, a different career, etc. You don’t know, what you dont’t know.

Anonymous wrote:Totally agree with you, OP.

Thank you. I am thankful that I escaped my depraved past. But, when I go back to the midwest where I grew up ... I see people still believing in the system...voting for Trump...and thinking that things will change.

Anonymous wrote:Do you feel like a sucker if you grew up middle class...your family obeyed all of the rules...worked the proverbial "9-5" and had nothing to show for it? I feel like we were suckers to work so heard and then couldn't even afford to go out (ever) nor go on vacations. I suspect most Americans are like this and only the uMC/rich get to enjoy the perks/profits off the backs of the MC

Yes. Both my parents worked and they could only really afford to go on vacation or save money after we were out of school

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My rich aunt Recently told my husband:

“You’re middle class and middle class people are suckers.”

Very simple. We are suckers until we vote for people who advocate for our interests. Until then we can sit and watch the people around us struggle. Very fun!

I agree with this. We're not suckers as individuals for not gaming the system, we might be suckers for not trying harder to change it.

What exactly are you looking for......government handouts? How is it being a sucker to raise your children to be good people and to provide for your family? What rules exactly are you contemplating to break?

Np. I think maybe that we are the only ones who pay 33% taxes on our money. We don't have enough to pay people to figure out how to pay less.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not to get deep into this, but there is some argument that there was a post WWII period which provided more economic advantage for more people than had ever been known. . . and since then things have gone back to a kind of normal (inequality, etc).

It helps if 80% of the world was either blown to smithereens or was living barely hand to mouth, and within America the 15-20% of minorities were systems suppressed.

+1

Anonymous wrote:Our generation is getting screwed every which way. Our parents had reasonably priced healthcare, mostly reasonable college costs, company provided pensions.

We both work and can’t afford much past the house and daycare. Since his family isn’t local, all our vacation time and funds are spent on family visits rather than proper vacations.

People smoked in the workplace.
Women were contained to certain management jobs and made $.59 for every dollar men made in the same jobs (or less).
Insurance did not cover pregnancies
Women were required to quit when they were pregnant.
Mental health was not covered
college was still expensive


I am not going back. Today is much much much better.

"All the rules?" It sounds like you ended up exactly like anyone else who followed those same steps even 2 or 3 generations ago. It's called "genteel poverty."

You're not really poor, but your clothes, house, car are never going to be the newest brand names, and you're not going to retire to the Riviera (or whatever the equivalent is these days). Your peers will be living the high life because they decided to focus on money, while you decided to focus on a career of service. It's not a bad thing, but it's hard to understand why you thought it would get you to money.

IMO, in these times of income inequality, you should do the service career for a few years if you really want to, then focus on maximizing income for a few years. Or do it the other way around (as a friend of mine who went to Columbia law did).

Anonymous wrote:Not to get deep into this, but there is some argument that there was a post WWII period which provided more economic advantage for more people than had ever been known. . . and since then things have gone back to a kind of normal (inequality, etc).

It helps if 80% of the world was either blown to smithereens or was living barely hand to mouth, and within America the 15-20% of minorities were systems suppressed.

Anonymous wrote:Do you feel like a sucker if you grew up middle class...your family obeyed all of the rules...worked the proverbial "9-5" and had nothing to show for it? I feel like we were suckers to work so heard and then couldn't even afford to go out (ever) nor go on vacations. I suspect most Americans are like this and only the uMC/rich get to enjoy the perks/profits off the backs of the MC

Not a sucker. I realize now, much later, how important family connections are. That’s what gets you the good jobs. They get you in the door, and then you have to prove yourself. Many middle class and most working class people don’t have these connections.

Anonymous wrote:Do you feel like a sucker if you grew up middle class...your family obeyed all of the rules...worked the proverbial "9-5" and had nothing to show for it? I feel like we were suckers to work so heard and then couldn't even afford to go out (ever) nor go on vacations. I suspect most Americans are like this and only the uMC/rich get to enjoy the perks/profits off the backs of the MC

Boo hoo. News flash, you are not entitled to anything. Why do you feel that by growing up middle class and following the rules you are entitled to a certain lifestyle?

You probably live in comfortable home with heat, a/c, several televisions, and have a car. There are many people who have much much less. Are you sad because you don’t drive a Lexus and vacation in Paris every year? Not everyone can live in a McMansion.

Finally, it’s really not that hard to figure out how to have a high income if that is your priority. If you did not grow up rich, you will need a profession that pays well to have a more comfortable lifestyle. For example doctor, banking, big law. Engineering or business owner is another option. It’s not exactly a secret the professions such as teaching are hard work but pay less. Are you expecting to live a cushy lifestyle on a teacher salary?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My rich aunt Recently told my husband:

“You’re middle class and middle class people are suckers.”

Very simple. We are suckers until we vote for people who advocate for our interests. Until then we can sit and watch the people around us struggle. Very fun!

I agree with this. We're not suckers as individuals for not gaming the system, we might be suckers for not trying harder to change it.

What exactly are you looking for......government handouts? How is it being a sucker to raise your children to be good people and to provide for your family? What rules exactly are you contemplating to break?