Anonymous
12/21/2017 20:44
Subject: Re:when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Ummm, where to start?
I'm a first grade teacher. Here is a list of just some of the assessments my students take each year:
*Easy CBM math (yes computer), 3 x a year to all kids 1:1. Weekly progress monitoring 1:1 to any kid severely behind, bi-weekly to kids somewhat behind, monthly to everyone.
*Easy CBM reading (part computer, part person based) given 1:1 3x a year. a) phonics sounds, b) word segmentation c) word reading d) passage fluency. Weekly progress monitoring to any kid severely behind, bi-weekly to kids somewhat behind, monthly to everyone.
*Sight word testing on 136 words, 3x a year benchmark. Weekly progress monitoring to any kid severely behind, bi-weekly to kids somewhat behind, monthly to everyone. Given 1:1
* Fountas and Pinnell running records. An intensive reading test where we measure miscues, comprehension, a written response and fluency. It takes about 30-45 per kid and in my district teachers have to do this while the entire rest of the class is working independently. This happens 3x a year for everyone and then another 3-6x a year per kid based on need. Given 1:1
*writing opinion paragraph benchmarks, 3x a year. Plus monthly to assess progress for instruction. Given whole group
* math unit tests. About 8 times a year. Quizzes another 6-8 times a year. Given whole group
*Access testing for ESL students 1x a year. Given in small groups
This is less than teachers used to do. It is not more. Also most of those reading tests that take so long are being taken out of school districts in favor of scantron tests after teachers have been complaining - see they were effective. I doubt your school system will have that for much longer. Do you remember the basal reading books? Teachers would have to grade reading responses weekly for those. They don't have to do that anymore. It was like grading one of those Fountas Pinnell tests weekly.
8 times a year tests on math? Again, do you remember weekly math tests plus cumulative tests for each unit? I do.
I'm not sure what is involved with weekly progress monitoring, however teachers have been monitoring progress weekly for years. If that is done ineffectively, that is an issue, but it is the process of it, not the task itself.
I'm a first grade teacher. Here is a list of just some of the assessments my students take each year:
*Easy CBM math (yes computer), 3 x a year to all kids 1:1. Weekly progress monitoring 1:1 to any kid severely behind, bi-weekly to kids somewhat behind, monthly to everyone.
*Easy CBM reading (part computer, part person based) given 1:1 3x a year. a) phonics sounds, b) word segmentation c) word reading d) passage fluency. Weekly progress monitoring to any kid severely behind, bi-weekly to kids somewhat behind, monthly to everyone.
*Sight word testing on 136 words, 3x a year benchmark. Weekly progress monitoring to any kid severely behind, bi-weekly to kids somewhat behind, monthly to everyone. Given 1:1
* Fountas and Pinnell running records. An intensive reading test where we measure miscues, comprehension, a written response and fluency. It takes about 30-45 per kid and in my district teachers have to do this while the entire rest of the class is working independently. This happens 3x a year for everyone and then another 3-6x a year per kid based on need. Given 1:1
*writing opinion paragraph benchmarks, 3x a year. Plus monthly to assess progress for instruction. Given whole group
* math unit tests. About 8 times a year. Quizzes another 6-8 times a year. Given whole group
*Access testing for ESL students 1x a year. Given in small groups
This is less than teachers used to do. It is not more. Also most of those reading tests that take so long are being taken out of school districts in favor of scantron tests after teachers have been complaining - see they were effective. I doubt your school system will have that for much longer. Do you remember the basal reading books? Teachers would have to grade reading responses weekly for those. They don't have to do that anymore. It was like grading one of those Fountas Pinnell tests weekly.
8 times a year tests on math? Again, do you remember weekly math tests plus cumulative tests for each unit? I do.
I'm not sure what is involved with weekly progress monitoring, however teachers have been monitoring progress weekly for years. If that is done ineffectively, that is an issue, but it is the process of it, not the task itself.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 20:36
Subject: when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Anonymous wrote:Who said I was too afraid to raise my voice or that I don't do it? My point is that systemic issues don't fix themselves easily or quickly. OP's issue is a systemic issue. Women should just be able to raise their voice without having to worry about being "afraid." Dismissively telling me to "Get over myself" when I complain about systemic sexism pretty much helps me make my point, women often aren't taken seriously and their concerns are dismissed.
The education field has the least amount of sexism of any field. The reason people don't want to speak up is because they are speaking up to their boss or the higher admins whether male or female. This issue has little to do with sexism.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 20:25
Subject: when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Who said I was too afraid to raise my voice or that I don't do it? My point is that systemic issues don't fix themselves easily or quickly. OP's issue is a systemic issue. Women should just be able to raise their voice without having to worry about being "afraid." Dismissively telling me to "Get over myself" when I complain about systemic sexism pretty much helps me make my point, women often aren't taken seriously and their concerns are dismissed.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 19:55
Subject: Re:when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
One of the great things about teaching is all the different women who work together, I've met so many in my 25+ years teaching young, old, shy outspoken - it's the best part of teaching.
The meetings, data review and time waste is out of control. I love the kids and my co - workers but the meeting ... too much already. Well said OP. Have a restful break.
The meetings, data review and time waste is out of control. I love the kids and my co - workers but the meeting ... too much already. Well said OP. Have a restful break.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 19:52
Subject: when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Kids these days take an assessment test on a computer that spits out an assessment analysis that teachers just have to read and plan lessons for. They are typically taken at the beginning of the year, middle of the year, and end. I really don't know how much easier they could make it for teachers. The assessment just confirms the 2-3 grade levels below for you to justify the teaching level. What do you actually have to do for it?
The sticky note example is just some example to help teachers work together better. It isn't related to assessments. Maybe your biggest beef is that teachers shouldn't have to collaborate so much.
The sticky note example is just some example to help teachers work together better. It isn't related to assessments. Maybe your biggest beef is that teachers shouldn't have to collaborate so much.
Ummm, where to start?
I'm a first grade teacher. Here is a list of just some of the assessments my students take each year:
*Easy CBM math (yes computer), 3 x a year to all kids 1:1. Weekly progress monitoring 1:1 to any kid severely behind, bi-weekly to kids somewhat behind, monthly to everyone.
*Easy CBM reading (part computer, part person based) given 1:1 3x a year. a) phonics sounds, b) word segmentation c) word reading d) passage fluency. Weekly progress monitoring to any kid severely behind, bi-weekly to kids somewhat behind, monthly to everyone.
*Sight word testing on 136 words, 3x a year benchmark. Weekly progress monitoring to any kid severely behind, bi-weekly to kids somewhat behind, monthly to everyone. Given 1:1
* Fountas and Pinnell running records. An intensive reading test where we measure miscues, comprehension, a written response and fluency. It takes about 30-45 per kid and in my district teachers have to do this while the entire rest of the class is working independently. This happens 3x a year for everyone and then another 3-6x a year per kid based on need. Given 1:1
*writing opinion paragraph benchmarks, 3x a year. Plus monthly to assess progress for instruction. Given whole group
* math unit tests. About 8 times a year. Quizzes another 6-8 times a year. Given whole group
*Access testing for ESL students 1x a year. Given in small groups
None of these "spit out assessment" data for me to use. I do it all myself. Easy CBM will "grade" the tests for you, but it doesn't tell you what to do with the info. More importantly, it doesn't help me with the fact that I only have 45 minutes to teach math, when I really need 90 to differentiate for the 4-5 different math levels I have. None of it helps me to lead small groups. None of it helps me to conference with writers and help them fix their mistakes.
My issue is NOT that I don't want to collaborate. My issue is that I spend so much time in useless meetings that I don't have time to collaborate. In fact, the district wastes so much of my time that I go into the building on Saturdays for 3-4 hours every week in order to make copies, clean up, prep things, etc. because I cannot get it all done between the hours of 6:30 a.m. and 4:30 p.m., even though I work through every single lunch and the little non meeting prep time I have. Its insane.
To the poster who says we should all just "tell our principal" how we see things.....are you insane? Do you just tell your boss what to do and how to do it? Sheesh.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 19:42
Subject: Re:when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
19:04. I work in a male dominated field. I would love to work in a field with that many women. I'm just used to going against the grain.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 19:41
Subject: when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Anonymous wrote:I LOVE the comments saying teachers just need to stand up to the principal!! I’m just sitting here laughing at your naïveté. You must work in a profession where you are respected and isn’t a traditionally women’s profession. Let me help you. Elementary schools are traditionally women’s work and there is this history in our country of sexism. It is an entrenched, systemic problem. Because of that history, the profession of teaching in our country still runs on very sexist principles. Even though it is mainly comprised of women! If you complain you are someone who must be rooted out because your critical ideas (however thoughtful they may be) are critical. If you question those in authority you are seen as being “aggressive”again in part because you are a woman who is questioning authority. Principals are very unsure of themselves and will bully (to the point of yelling and degrading others), threaten and make your job very uncomfortable- transfer you to a different grade, nitpick you lessons and generally make you life miserable until you decide either to leave or shut up. To the poster who suggested that all the teachers band together and ask the principal for things that is why unions are created - great idea..except ..... politicians and many others are against unions.
And yes, many of these issues have arisen in large part because teaching is a woman’s profession and the problem endemic in teaching are issues that many women face in the workforce, politics and society.
So yes change needs to be made starting with supporting listening and acting upon the reflections and needs of those “in the trenches”rather than power or money, but isn’t that also just reflective of our society...
19+ year veteran with direct experience with 3 local districts and 8 principals
And I have news for you. Women all over the workforce do what you are too afraid to do every day. They just don't have 100 other women to stand up and say the same thing. So get over yourself.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 19:14
Subject: when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
I used to teach elementary special ed and agree with OP.
Teaching is considered a family friendly profession but it’s anything but. Yeah, you get time off during the summer, but you easily work 60 hour weeks during the school year and put up with abuse from administration, parents, and students. No remote work. Pensions are going the way of the dinosaurs, as are unions. And it’s the teachers’ fault that children aren’t meeting standards?
Teaching is considered a family friendly profession but it’s anything but. Yeah, you get time off during the summer, but you easily work 60 hour weeks during the school year and put up with abuse from administration, parents, and students. No remote work. Pensions are going the way of the dinosaurs, as are unions. And it’s the teachers’ fault that children aren’t meeting standards?
Anonymous
12/21/2017 19:13
Subject: when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Anonymous wrote:I LOVE the comments saying teachers just need to stand up to the principal!! I’m just sitting here laughing at your naïveté. You must work in a profession where you are respected and isn’t a traditionally women’s profession. Let me help you. Elementary schools are traditionally women’s work and there is this history in our country of sexism. It is an entrenched, systemic problem. Because of that history, the profession of teaching in our country still runs on very sexist principles. Even though it is mainly comprised of women! If you complain you are someone who must be rooted out because your critical ideas (however thoughtful they may be) are critical. If you question those in authority you are seen as being “aggressive”again in part because you are a woman who is questioning authority. Principals are very unsure of themselves and will bully (to the point of yelling and degrading others), threaten and make your job very uncomfortable- transfer you to a different grade, nitpick you lessons and generally make you life miserable until you decide either to leave or shut up. To the poster who suggested that all the teachers band together and ask the principal for things that is why unions are created - great idea..except ..... politicians and many others are against unions.
And yes, many of these issues have arisen in large part because teaching is a woman’s profession and the problem endemic in teaching are issues that many women face in the workforce, politics and society.
So yes change needs to be made starting with supporting listening and acting upon the reflections and needs of those “in the trenches”rather than power or money, but isn’t that also just reflective of our society...
19+ year veteran with direct experience with 3 local districts and 8 principals
Anonymous
12/21/2017 19:05
Subject: Re:when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
OMG..You are just realizing this?
Anonymous
12/21/2017 19:04
Subject: when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
I LOVE the comments saying teachers just need to stand up to the principal!! I’m just sitting here laughing at your naïveté. You must work in a profession where you are respected and isn’t a traditionally women’s profession. Let me help you. Elementary schools are traditionally women’s work and there is this history in our country of sexism. It is an entrenched, systemic problem. Because of that history, the profession of teaching in our country still runs on very sexist principles. Even though it is mainly comprised of women! If you complain you are someone who must be rooted out because your critical ideas (however thoughtful they may be) are critical. If you question those in authority you are seen as being “aggressive”again in part because you are a woman who is questioning authority. Principals are very unsure of themselves and will bully (to the point of yelling and degrading others), threaten and make your job very uncomfortable- transfer you to a different grade, nitpick you lessons and generally make you life miserable until you decide either to leave or shut up. To the poster who suggested that all the teachers band together and ask the principal for things that is why unions are created - great idea..except ..... politicians and many others are against unions.
And yes, many of these issues have arisen in large part because teaching is a woman’s profession and the problem endemic in teaching are issues that many women face in the workforce, politics and society.
So yes change needs to be made starting with supporting listening and acting upon the reflections and needs of those “in the trenches”rather than power or money, but isn’t that also just reflective of our society...
19+ year veteran with direct experience with 3 local districts and 8 principals
And yes, many of these issues have arisen in large part because teaching is a woman’s profession and the problem endemic in teaching are issues that many women face in the workforce, politics and society.
So yes change needs to be made starting with supporting listening and acting upon the reflections and needs of those “in the trenches”rather than power or money, but isn’t that also just reflective of our society...
19+ year veteran with direct experience with 3 local districts and 8 principals
Anonymous
12/21/2017 18:48
Subject: Re:when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Can you give me an example of what you are talking about?
Our school district is implementing "Data Wise"
This isn't my school but here's what we are doing:
https://www.slideshare.net/MichelleJeffersonLam/data-wise-journey-presentation
Is your school failing or do you not collaborate? If you collaborate well already most of this isn't needed. If the collaborating is ineffective, there is data on this somewhere. This method is mostly about collaboration, not data. It's also mostly for principals to implement on things like attendance.
A lot of times these meetings are ineffective because people discuss important things but unless a running list of items discussed and resolved is generated, teachers and administrators are often just repeating the same thing over and over from meeting to meeting.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 18:35
Subject: Re:when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Is this just an issue at the elementary level? Kids in middle and high school take specific courses that only teach one level.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 18:33
Subject: when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Also, don't act like you really check whether Johnny is achieving whether you know his skills the first week or the 100th. Weeks go by and you probably haven't checked a single paper. Teachers don't grade papers at home or after work anymore and are just as on board with getting rid of worksheets and any proof of learning as the admin.
If he was in our school last June, we absolutely know what skills he knows in September -- unless he went to summer school or got substantial tutoring.
I have students on day one who I know are 2-3 grade levels below in basic math skills or decoding skills, for instance. It's no secret they are behind/below where they should be.
Kids these days take an assessment test on a computer that spits out an assessment analysis that teachers just have to read and plan lessons for. They are typically taken at the beginning of the year, middle of the year, and end. I really don't know how much easier they could make it for teachers. The assessment just confirms the 2-3 grade levels below for you to justify the teaching level. What do you actually have to do for it?
The sticky note example is just some example to help teachers work together better. It isn't related to assessments. Maybe your biggest beef is that teachers shouldn't have to collaborate so much.
Anonymous
12/21/2017 18:32
Subject: Re:when schools focus on the wrong things (from a teacher)
Anonymous wrote:Can you give me an example of what you are talking about?
Our school district is implementing "Data Wise"
This isn't my school but here's what we are doing:
https://www.slideshare.net/MichelleJeffersonLam/data-wise-journey-presentation