Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except that they have a lot of D1 and D2 teams.

I met some VISTA parents at the Richmond tournament this weekend. They seemed a lot happier than the rest of us.

D1 and D2 in NCSL is impressive,... for 1990.

Hey, if you need to justify the money you're paying for CCL or VPL, go right ahead.

Many of those clubs in D1/D2 of NCSL charge the same as those clubs in CCL/CCLII. Maybe not VISTA but other established clubs do. And those clubs in D1/D2 in NCSL that are also in CCL/CCLII, the difference in cost is very little. I'm just referring to club fees not team fees where the cost can increase depending on the number of tournaments.

I kinda like knowing the team can be awarded with promotion or punished and put to the worse shame of all and be relegated to a lower division.

Agree which is why I think that CCL should find a way to do something similar with their members.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except that they have a lot of D1 and D2 teams.

I met some VISTA parents at the Richmond tournament this weekend. They seemed a lot happier than the rest of us.

D1 and D2 in NCSL is impressive,... for 1990.

Hey, if you need to justify the money you're paying for CCL or VPL, go right ahead.

Many of those clubs in D1/D2 of NCSL charge the same as those clubs in CCL/CCLII. Maybe not VISTA but other established clubs do. And those clubs in D1/D2 in NCSL that are also in CCL/CCLII, the difference in cost is very little. I'm just referring to club fees not team fees where the cost can increase depending on the number of tournaments.

I kinda like knowing the team can be awarded with promotion or punished and put to the worse shame of all and be relegated to a lower division.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except that they have a lot of D1 and D2 teams.

I met some VISTA parents at the Richmond tournament this weekend. They seemed a lot happier than the rest of us.

D1 and D2 in NCSL is impressive,... for 1990.

Hey, if you need to justify the money you're paying for CCL or VPL, go right ahead.

Many of those clubs in D1/D2 of NCSL charge the same as those clubs in CCL/CCLII. Maybe not VISTA but other established clubs do. And those clubs in D1/D2 in NCSL that are also in CCL/CCLII, the difference in cost is very little. I'm just referring to club fees not team fees where the cost can increase depending on the number of tournaments.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except that they have a lot of D1 and D2 teams.

I met some VISTA parents at the Richmond tournament this weekend. They seemed a lot happier than the rest of us.

D1 and D2 in NCSL is impressive,... for 1990.

Hey, if you need to justify the money you're paying for CCL or VPL, go right ahead.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How is this a debate. For some, Vista works, for others it may be FCBE. Does it really matter if the kids are developing and having fun? Fun???? That word ring a bell with anyone? It's a damn game and I don't care how good you are, if you aren't having fun you aren't going to get better.

Completely agree. Just stating what red flags I would consider with a small club over the price. It still always comes down to the overall value of the experience. It is to simplistic to say "we won a scrimmage and our fees are only $800 so we are better".

I don't think anybody was saying that, you probably made that connection after making an assumption about what the parent was thinking. Particularly, soccer should be a sport that allows you to move in an out depending on the season. The annual signup is a boon to the clubs.

I would see as a red flag any club that doesn't value their players enough to let every 8-9 year old know good at soccer the club thinks they are by ranking their athletic ability in a color-coded fashion. Then saying to the parents you will pay as much for your less-talented/athletically-gifted child as the other parent of the talented/coordinated child and will be assigned a coach that is less inclined to teach those kids as well as a coach that has a lower credential than the coach assigned to the talented/coordinated children AND you will show gratitude for being allowed to play in our club teams by doing as much volunteering as we ask you to do. Of BTW, for a few select clubs, an addendum is that if the parent of the less-talented child wishes to receive training they already paid for from the coaches who train the talented children, they will be expected to pay MORE.

YES!! +100 These travel clubs are f*cking ridiculous at the younger age groups. What's worse is that this is encouraged by the Coaches/Club administer and the obnoxious parents who think the Chartreuse team (or whatever stupid arbitrary color they have assigned the top team) at U9 means they are destined for greatness and superior to all other players in the age group. We have had our share of douches that love to say 'well I guess nobody has been good enough to move up from within so we got an outside player this season'. Oh yeah dipshit--that is what it means . They don't want to screw with the pecking order and cause anarchy in the ranks. Joke is on them---they get to spend more weekends in miserable Shitsville locations in the freezing cold, driving rain or intense heat and humidity---fighting hour long traffic jams while the rest of us kick back on our couch or travel somewhere actually desirable over the holiday weekends and stay in luxury vs the Hampton Inn in East Shitsville (which is another 20 min drive to the field).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How is this a debate. For some, Vista works, for others it may be FCBE. Does it really matter if the kids are developing and having fun? Fun???? That word ring a bell with anyone? It's a damn game and I don't care how good you are, if you aren't having fun you aren't going to get better.

Completely agree. Just stating what red flags I would consider with a small club over the price. It still always comes down to the overall value of the experience. It is to simplistic to say "we won a scrimmage and our fees are only $800 so we are better".

I don't think anybody was saying that, you probably made that connection after making an assumption about what the parent was thinking. Particularly, soccer should be a sport that allows you to move in an out depending on the season. The annual signup is a boon to the clubs.

I would see as a red flag any club that doesn't value their players enough to let every 8-9 year old know good at soccer the club thinks they are by ranking their athletic ability in a color-coded fashion. Then saying to the parents you will pay as much for your less-talented/athletically-gifted child as the other parent of the talented/coordinated child and will be assigned a coach that is less inclined to teach those kids as well as a coach that has a lower credential than the coach assigned to the talented/coordinated children AND you will show gratitude for being allowed to play in our club teams by doing as much volunteering as we ask you to do. Of BTW, for a few select clubs, an addendum is that if the parent of the less-talented child wishes to receive training they already paid for from the coaches who train the talented children, they will be expected to pay MORE.

Anonymous wrote:How is this a debate. For some, Vista works, for others it may be FCBE. Does it really matter if the kids are developing and having fun? Fun???? That word ring a bell with anyone? It's a damn game and I don't care how good you are, if you aren't having fun you aren't going to get better.

Completely agree. Just stating what red flags I would consider with a small club over the price. It still always comes down to the overall value of the experience. It is to simplistic to say "we won a scrimmage and our fees are only $800 so we are better".

How is this a debate. For some, Vista works, for others it may be FCBE. Does it really matter if the kids are developing and having fun? Fun???? That word ring a bell with anyone? It's a damn game and I don't care how good you are, if you aren't having fun you aren't going to get better.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except they play travel, join the travel tournaments, and do compete against travel teams, not just fodder. So it's not rec soccer in the sense that the scores don't matter. In truth, all organized soccer is rec(recreational) except for DA/ECNL which is geared towards being scouted.

Except dads coach, moms cook the books and socks don’t match. That sounds like rec soccer to me. Some things certainly are not worth the cost but not having daddy coaches and the politics that come with all the parent volunteers is not worth it. I can live with mismatched socks but not the parent volunteer crap. Nice that it works for you but that is likely because you put yourself in a position of influence.

This is Vista you are talking about?

This is the risk of any small club run by volunteers. It is great if the people are great but things can go to crap really fast.

So yes, a few parents attitudes suck on the sidelines, but if you have been through the travel soccer club scene already you know it's not any different. I found the main difference was if a parent or kid didn't like how we trained or how we played, they would tell us and either we could fix whatever their complaint was or they would leave the following season, fall, summer, or spring.

For a club team, I remember my son joining a team that already had group of boys that would only play with each other, and would only pass to each other. It would hurt us in games, and I never saw the parents publicly correct them, which means they probably weren't doing so privately either. On the private team, the players you had were the players you had, the parents would cheer for every kid, and they generally seemed to be content with competing. My son would come eagwr to go to practi e, whereas with the cliub team he would have to be pushed and reminded by me about his practice days, shin guards, training shirt and club shorts. He didnt enjoy them as much and saw them as a chore, I took him since I had already paid.

I wouldn't mind if a a few kids socks didn't match, I think we've been sold the professional apparel and accessories with the amateur training at these clubs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except they play travel, join the travel tournaments, and do compete against travel teams, not just fodder. So it's not rec soccer in the sense that the scores don't matter. In truth, all organized soccer is rec(recreational) except for DA/ECNL which is geared towards being scouted.

Except dads coach, moms cook the books and socks don’t match. That sounds like rec soccer to me. Some things certainly are not worth the cost but not having daddy coaches and the politics that come with all the parent volunteers is not worth it. I can live with mismatched socks but not the parent volunteer crap. Nice that it works for you but that is likely because you put yourself in a position of influence.

This is Vista you are talking about?

This is the risk of any small club run by volunteers. It is great if the people are great but things can go to crap really fast.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except they play travel, join the travel tournaments, and do compete against travel teams, not just fodder. So it's not rec soccer in the sense that the scores don't matter. In truth, all organized soccer is rec(recreational) except for DA/ECNL which is geared towards being scouted.

Except dads coach, moms cook the books and socks don’t match. That sounds like rec soccer to me. Some things certainly are not worth the cost but not having daddy coaches and the politics that come with all the parent volunteers is not worth it. I can live with mismatched socks but not the parent volunteer crap. Nice that it works for you but that is likely because you put yourself in a position of influence.

This is Vista you are talking about?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except they play travel, join the travel tournaments, and do compete against travel teams, not just fodder. So it's not rec soccer in the sense that the scores don't matter. In truth, all organized soccer is rec(recreational) except for DA/ECNL which is geared towards being scouted.

Except dads coach, moms cook the books and socks don’t match. That sounds like rec soccer to me. Some things certainly are not worth the cost but not having daddy coaches and the politics that come with all the parent volunteers is not worth it. I can live with mismatched socks but not the parent volunteer crap. Nice that it works for you but that is likely because you put yourself in a position of influence.

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except they play travel, join the travel tournaments, and do compete against travel teams, not just fodder. So it's not rec soccer in the sense that the scores don't matter. In truth, all organized soccer is rec(recreational) except for DA/ECNL which is geared towards being scouted.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except that they have a lot of D1 and D2 teams.

I met some VISTA parents at the Richmond tournament this weekend. They seemed a lot happier than the rest of us.

D1 and D2 in NCSL is impressive,... for 1990.

I think what the poster was saying, is that if you are looking for cheaper Travel Soccer options, you will find them. You cannot also expect the team to compete in Club based CCL, or expensive NPL league. As a parent, you will have to decide if club soccer is worth pursuing after U14, when all kids go to HS, academics become difficult and your player isn't really a kid anymore. I think a VISTA option does work for a few parents, not all though.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, it sounds like expensive rec soccer to me. No thanks

Except that they have a lot of D1 and D2 teams.

I met some VISTA parents at the Richmond tournament this weekend. They seemed a lot happier than the rest of us.

D1 and D2 in NCSL is impressive,... for 1990.