And yes, insecure attachment was definitely the issue with my mom (I’m the pp who is able to bond with mom over the grandkids). She was not good with me as a young child (think neglect and annoyance one minute, then overly smothering the next) and this pattern lasted my entire childhood. During a lot of my childhood I withheld from her because i found her reactions to be too dicey — sometimes loving but mostly angry or negligent. I used to get yelled at for not telling her about my ear infections until they were full blown, but I was always worried that if I told her about them sooner I would waste her time by making her take me to the doctor only to not have an ear infection. That kind of stuff

Op I have a similar experience, I think. Once I had kids it actually gave me something to talk about with my mom and the relationship improved. I do not really enjoy hanging out with just my mom, I find it awkward, but she is a great grandma and it brings her and my kids a lot of joy to be together. She is in her mid 70s and I am trying to make her most of her “twilight” years with my kids. Through my 20s and 30s I found her to always be trying to build a relationship on her terms, which weren’t terms I was interested in (she tried to tell me how to live my life, was super judgy, was always giving me tips on things and then getting upset if I disagreed, etc). I didn’t trust her enough to ever open up about anything. And so we practically had no relationship, or a very hostile one with a lot of guilt on my part.

OP I just searched some posts about toxic parent relationships. I'm glad you're on the mend.
I'm now in my late 30s and have a toxic mother. I didn't realize how toxic she was until I hit my 30s. Now as a mother myself I realize how much of an emotional impact parents can have - even on grown children. I've had near panic attacks being along with her for even 5 minutes. She is negative and breaks me down every moment she can and brags about my other siblings non stop (they are absolutely nothing to brag about - one sibling hasn't been employed in about 7 yrs ( mid 30s, and she and my father pay for his everything including a car). My other one only sees them max 2weeks out of every year and so they artificially elevate her. I had to spend yesterday with my parents and I felt like I couldn't breath because of her. I've never told my father anything. I rarely go visit the m ( they moved 5 minutes away from me, which is hell about 6 yrs ago). She has mental health issues, but I think she is bringing me down with her. It's so hard to explain the emotions. I think spending yesterday with her really put me in a low spot. I really wish she had self awareness. She is one of the most toxic women I know and loves to turn family against one another.

What does - I stayed in the van for 2.5 days - mean?

OP - I agree with others who suggested you see a therapist to process this a bit more.

Interestingly, I have a bit of a similar current situation with my Mom, but with additional complications. I'm in my 40s and right now we just superficially tolerate one another. It really sucks.

My young childhood was pretty great. In middle school, however, my Mom started having recovered memories of sexual abuse, there was a lot of secrecy about what was going on. A hospitalization. Lots of me seeing Mom crying uncontrollably or me being asked to "watch" my Mom while my Dad took care of something. Lots of times Dad would take Mom out for a "break" while leaving us home alone. I was 12 years old and had no idea what was going on.

As a teenager I was really resentful of my parents. They also verbally argued a lot and I would intercede to defend my father who I always thought she was treating horribly. Then both would turn as an allied force against ME. I became the problem in the family then. Meanwhile, I was on the honor role, played sports, had an after school job. I didn't drink, smoke or have sex in HS. But I was still the "bad" kid.

It's really hard to get past all of this and have a healthy relationship with your parents as an adult. When I shared my anger and resentment years ago, my Mom was incredibly offended and has never let me live it down. It's still constantly thrown in my face that I thought she was a "bad mother" (though I never said that). Geez, I was a kid in a chaotic household who had no idea what was going on and no empathy for that experience at all.

Anyway - best advice I ever got was to rise beyond all of that. To not let my Mom drag me backwards. Not let her keep rehashing old disagreements or misunderstandings of one another. Don't let her drag you down into the mud. The best thing is good boundaries and give yourself the love and understanding that she wasn't ever able to provide. She just can't do it and likely will never do it - getting your arms around that will require a grieving process for the relationship you hope to have with her.

It's very sad and very frustrating, but you can only do what you can for yourself. You can't fix everyone or every relationship.

Read up on insecure attachment or disorganized attachment.

Basically you have attachment issues that occurred in early infancy and created life long issues.

Many people attribute attachment issues only to adopted children but that's not the case and there are plenty of children who remained with their biological family who have attachment issues.

Oh my goodness!! It's our mother, OP. Your highly imperfect mother who raised a highly imperfect child. Please accept yourself so you can accept others. In other words....GROW UP

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Huh. I don't understand all the nastiness toward OP.

OP, I am not like you at all (I am very quiet) but I also had a strained relationship with my parents. I felt guilty about it, too. When I finally got therapy for other issues we spent some time discussing my parents and my therapist told me it sounded like they weren't capable of more of a relationship and I was right to be self-protective. That surprised me, since I sort of thought therapists always would want you to work out stuff like that. A couple years later I was talking to my brother about it, and his therapist said the same thing. We actually laughed a long time during that conversation. There was also drinking.

Anyway, given the random nastiness I don't think you are going to get much useful feedback here. If it really bothers you, seek out a professional opinion.

Also, my dad died not that long ago. My mom has health problems. I have a lot of sadness about what our relationship was/is like, but no regrets because it wasn't up to me to change. Sometimes you win the family lottery, sometimes you don't.

It's okay. I posted to vent while buzzed and I get that people only know what was in a post. I am actually not in the least bit dramatic or immature and haven't discussed these feelings with anyone in my family. I wasn't an easy child / teen for sure and my parents were far from perfect, albeit well intended. There was a lot more in my childhood / adolescence that happened that isn't detailed here.

I did talk to a professional once about you and similar to your therapist, I was told to just have the safest, healthiest relationship that made sense to me. That I wasn't responsible for my mother's happiness (or lack thereof) with the relationship. Both my parents grew up in complicated families with their own issues and they didn't have healthy emotional relationships with their own parents giving them limited skills to form them with their own children. They had commonalities with my siblings that they bonded over that I didn't have.

I think the forming of adult relationships with our imperfect parents is interesting. Compared to many, I had a great childhood and family but the lack of connection and feeling of being different, not fitting in as part of the family has complicated our adult relationship. Superficially we have a great relationship, she just wants something more and I don't.

FWIW, from reading these posts and recognizing a lot of myself, my mother and family dynamics, I want to suggest you admit yourself that you didn't have a great childhood nor do you even superficially have a great relationship with your mother now. Superficially great is an oxymoron. So you were a rude teen? A bull in the china shop 5 year old? If you truly behaved as you said you're a child any parent should be proud to have.
She was the adult and you were the kid. The adult is responsible for forging relationships with their children and not the other way around. A mother's personality doesn't mesh with her child? Well she has to work extra hard to let the child know she loves them. It is inherent in her role as a mother.
Sure their are hungry children in Africa, and that doesn't invalidate your experience with a hurtful mother. You are right to protect yourself from her.

Its interesting you say that. I think I have done a lot of convincing that my childhood and growing up years were 'great'. When I talk about events from then to others, people have a very different reaction. The therapist I saw told me much of what I consider normal and write off as 'they did their best' or they were just unconventional wasn't healthy at all for me. I told a friend once about some events form my childhood and she responded by saying that she had a traumatic childhood too. I told her I didn't have anything traumatic in my childhood and she told me that most people would consider what I described as traumatic. I wasn't abused or neglected, didn't witness violence, had parents who loved me, had all my basic needs met (maybe other than emotional ones), and generally had a 'good' life.

I also in some ways value my childhood in that I feel it made me strong and independent.

You both sound crazy ?

Anonymous wrote:
And stop drinking . . . that's not the answer.

+1

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, do you have kids? I can say that I struggled very hard with my relationship with my mom. I was an honors student, many APs, highest service awards, etc. I was the neighborhood babysitter, everyone adored me... BUT I liked to go out to parties and I smoked pot on occasion. It drove my mother crazy. I said a lot of bad things to my mom. I regret them deeply.

Since then I have apologized to my mom profusely and we have tried to move forward together.

I'm the PP, I didn't finish this thought and then someone below me did. Having children opened my eyes to how neither of us were at fault in regards to our problems. When you love someone deeply, you are blinded by emotions and can make mistakes.

Not the OP or the person you are responding to but having kids opened my eyes to just how horrible my childhood was and how much more my mother was at fault than I used to believe. It totally changed our relationship.

+1

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Huh. I don't understand all the nastiness toward OP.

OP, I am not like you at all (I am very quiet) but I also had a strained relationship with my parents. I felt guilty about it, too. When I finally got therapy for other issues we spent some time discussing my parents and my therapist told me it sounded like they weren't capable of more of a relationship and I was right to be self-protective. That surprised me, since I sort of thought therapists always would want you to work out stuff like that. A couple years later I was talking to my brother about it, and his therapist said the same thing. We actually laughed a long time during that conversation. There was also drinking.

Anyway, given the random nastiness I don't think you are going to get much useful feedback here. If it really bothers you, seek out a professional opinion.

Also, my dad died not that long ago. My mom has health problems. I have a lot of sadness about what our relationship was/is like, but no regrets because it wasn't up to me to change. Sometimes you win the family lottery, sometimes you don't.

It's okay. I posted to vent while buzzed and I get that people only know what was in a post. I am actually not in the least bit dramatic or immature and haven't discussed these feelings with anyone in my family. I wasn't an easy child / teen for sure and my parents were far from perfect, albeit well intended. There was a lot more in my childhood / adolescence that happened that isn't detailed here.

I did talk to a professional once about you and similar to your therapist, I was told to just have the safest, healthiest relationship that made sense to me. That I wasn't responsible for my mother's happiness (or lack thereof) with the relationship. Both my parents grew up in complicated families with their own issues and they didn't have healthy emotional relationships with their own parents giving them limited skills to form them with their own children. They had commonalities with my siblings that they bonded over that I didn't have.

I think the forming of adult relationships with our imperfect parents is interesting. Compared to many, I had a great childhood and family but the lack of connection and feeling of being different, not fitting in as part of the family has complicated our adult relationship. Superficially we have a great relationship, she just wants something more and I don't.

FWIW, from reading these posts and recognizing a lot of myself, my mother and family dynamics, I want to suggest you admit yourself that you didn't have a great childhood nor do you even superficially have a great relationship with your mother now. Superficially great is an oxymoron. So you were a rude teen? A bull in the china shop 5 year old? If you truly behaved as you said you're a child any parent should be proud to have.
She was the adult and you were the kid. The adult is responsible for forging relationships with their children and not the other way around. A mother's personality doesn't mesh with her child? Well she has to work extra hard to let the child know she loves them. It is inherent in her role as a mother.
Sure their are hungry children in Africa, and that doesn't invalidate your experience with a hurtful mother. You are right to protect yourself from her.

I highly recommend the book - Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents. I think you'll connect with the part about Externalizers.

OP, as a veteran of difficult parents, what would you like to see for this relationship if you were reviewing it at the end of your life?

What outcome would you go for, solely from the perspective of things you yourself can learn or do or say or put out there, *not* from the perspective of getting the other person to act one way or another, or receive one way or another.

Anonymous wrote:I can empathize. I do best when I have really clear boundaries with my mother. She wants more, despite not being capable of providing the emotional support I needed as a kid/adult. I feel badly about not meeting her needs since I am now a parent myself, and I know she did the best she could despite not having the emotional capacity to parent me like I needed. I try to keep boundaries clear and be as warm and loving as I can without ever leaving my safe/secure/not-close-to-her-zone, if that makes sense. But I really don't give my mother all that she asks for...so I empathize with your situation. Also, all of the PPs who are judging you so harshly for your teen behavior -- who was the child and who was the parent? OP needed to grow up and did. Her mom wasn't able to parent her without judgment (labeling her "difficult" etc). Some of that baggage persists to this day. That's unfortunate but maybe water under the bridge. OP, I went to therapy with my mom when I was in my 40s. It was a mistake because my mom is not capable of emotionally processing what she would need to in order to make any changes (forgot stuff we'd worked through from one session to the next) but I am glad I gave it a shot. You might want to as well.

I'm pretty much the same way and agree with you - except I never went to therapy with my mother!