Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the PPs are talking past each other. I did 6 rounds of IVF. The actual IVF procedure was largely no big deal (although started feeling like a bigger deal towards the end -- but certainly the first cycle was no big deal). All the failures, though, were heartbreaking.

So, yeah, it does kind of irk me when someone who gets a baby from ONE round of IVF says IVF was no big deal. But I can see how that perspective is helpful to people who are new to the process and fearful of an IVF cycle.

This was my point. Besides all women should take it one cycle at a time and one day at a time. Also it seems like the women who are fearful are fearful of even just one cycle. They are terrified of the meds or the side effects or who knows what. My point is that I didn't find one cycle of IVF a big deal at all and I wouldn't let it keep you from possibly having a child.

Yes. We ALL know this is how you feel. You have repeated it ad nauseam on thread after thread. And when other people point out that those women who have reservations about the meds or the process have a right to those legitimate feelings, you shame or bully us and them. Telling people they're just being whiners and to just get over it is pretty crap advice.

Telling other people what they can post is even crappier.

No one is telling her what she can post. They're telling her she's rude.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the PPs are talking past each other. I did 6 rounds of IVF. The actual IVF procedure was largely no big deal (although started feeling like a bigger deal towards the end -- but certainly the first cycle was no big deal). All the failures, though, were heartbreaking.

So, yeah, it does kind of irk me when someone who gets a baby from ONE round of IVF says IVF was no big deal. But I can see how that perspective is helpful to people who are new to the process and fearful of an IVF cycle.

This was my point. Besides all women should take it one cycle at a time and one day at a time. Also it seems like the women who are fearful are fearful of even just one cycle. They are terrified of the meds or the side effects or who knows what. My point is that I didn't find one cycle of IVF a big deal at all and I wouldn't let it keep you from possibly having a child.

But there are people for whom the meds are a big deal. That's the part you seem to be missing. There are people who don't react well to the meds. And when you assume just because YOU didn't have a problem with the meds that all women should give it a try is condescending and ignorant. Some women have a horrible time with regular birth control. Some women don't respond will to overstimulation of the ovaries. They are legitimate concerns. And your experience is your experience. To say you think all women should give it a try when some women have legitimate reasons for not wanting to is ridiculous.

It's just like women who say pregnancy is no big deal. Well, it may be for them, but some women have a different experience. It doesn't actually help convince them to overcome those concerns when you just dismiss them or make them feel like not only are they dealing with infertility but it's their own fault they don't have a child because of their silly concerns about IVF.

I would add that some women also have moral issues with IVF. You may not agree with those issues, but for some, that is a stumbling block. And writing a thread on a forum where the women visiting are struggling with infertility and just telling them their concerns are silly is, frankly, insensitive. You can't see that, though, because your journey is over and it ended in a baby and it all worked out. For some, even if they "just get over" their fears and do what you say, they still won't end up with a baby. Or they may end up with a baby but have a really rough physical ride along the way.

I'm not making this up. I know women who had a difficult time with the IVF meds. It wasn't easy -- and that is aside from the fact that it wasn't successful. It took a physical toll.

The same is true of miscarriages. For some women, the physical experience of a miscarriage isn't much more than a period. For some, the physical experience involves a lot of pain, sometimes sudden and excessive blood loss. It's fine for someone to say their experience of a miscarriage wasn't really a big deal, but for them to say that means it probably isn't a big deal for everyone else is kind of ridiculous.

Why is this kind of thing so hard for people to understand?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the PPs are talking past each other. I did 6 rounds of IVF. The actual IVF procedure was largely no big deal (although started feeling like a bigger deal towards the end -- but certainly the first cycle was no big deal). All the failures, though, were heartbreaking.

So, yeah, it does kind of irk me when someone who gets a baby from ONE round of IVF says IVF was no big deal. But I can see how that perspective is helpful to people who are new to the process and fearful of an IVF cycle.

This was my point. Besides all women should take it one cycle at a time and one day at a time. Also it seems like the women who are fearful are fearful of even just one cycle. They are terrified of the meds or the side effects or who knows what. My point is that I didn't find one cycle of IVF a big deal at all and I wouldn't let it keep you from possibly having a child.

Yes. We ALL know this is how you feel. You have repeated it ad nauseam on thread after thread. And when other people point out that those women who have reservations about the meds or the process have a right to those legitimate feelings, you shame or bully us and them. Telling people they're just being whiners and to just get over it is pretty crap advice.

Telling other people what they can post is even crappier.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the PPs are talking past each other. I did 6 rounds of IVF. The actual IVF procedure was largely no big deal (although started feeling like a bigger deal towards the end -- but certainly the first cycle was no big deal). All the failures, though, were heartbreaking.

So, yeah, it does kind of irk me when someone who gets a baby from ONE round of IVF says IVF was no big deal. But I can see how that perspective is helpful to people who are new to the process and fearful of an IVF cycle.

This was my point. Besides all women should take it one cycle at a time and one day at a time. Also it seems like the women who are fearful are fearful of even just one cycle. They are terrified of the meds or the side effects or who knows what. My point is that I didn't find one cycle of IVF a big deal at all and I wouldn't let it keep you from possibly having a child.

Yes. We ALL know this is how you feel. You have repeated it ad nauseam on thread after thread. And when other people point out that those women who have reservations about the meds or the process have a right to those legitimate feelings, you shame or bully us and them. Telling people they're just being whiners and to just get over it is pretty crap advice.

I've never said this and never will. Instead I've encouraged women to give IVF a shot. I'm so glad I did.

Seriously reread what I wrote above. There's nothing wrong with what I shared. You're trying to make it sound negative and I don't understand why.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the PPs are talking past each other. I did 6 rounds of IVF. The actual IVF procedure was largely no big deal (although started feeling like a bigger deal towards the end -- but certainly the first cycle was no big deal). All the failures, though, were heartbreaking.

So, yeah, it does kind of irk me when someone who gets a baby from ONE round of IVF says IVF was no big deal. But I can see how that perspective is helpful to people who are new to the process and fearful of an IVF cycle.

This was my point. Besides all women should take it one cycle at a time and one day at a time. Also it seems like the women who are fearful are fearful of even just one cycle. They are terrified of the meds or the side effects or who knows what. My point is that I didn't find one cycle of IVF a big deal at all and I wouldn't let it keep you from possibly having a child.

Yes. We ALL know this is how you feel. You have repeated it ad nauseam on thread after thread. And when other people point out that those women who have reservations about the meds or the process have a right to those legitimate feelings, you shame or bully us and them. Telling people they're just being whiners and to just get over it is pretty crap advice.

Anonymous wrote:I think the PPs are talking past each other. I did 6 rounds of IVF. The actual IVF procedure was largely no big deal (although started feeling like a bigger deal towards the end -- but certainly the first cycle was no big deal). All the failures, though, were heartbreaking.

So, yeah, it does kind of irk me when someone who gets a baby from ONE round of IVF says IVF was no big deal. But I can see how that perspective is helpful to people who are new to the process and fearful of an IVF cycle.

This was my point. Besides all women should take it one cycle at a time and one day at a time. Also it seems like the women who are fearful are fearful of even just one cycle. They are terrified of the meds or the side effects or who knows what. My point is that I didn't find one cycle of IVF a big deal at all and I wouldn't let it keep you from possibly having a child.

I think the PPs are talking past each other. I did 6 rounds of IVF. The actual IVF procedure was largely no big deal (although started feeling like a bigger deal towards the end -- but certainly the first cycle was no big deal). All the failures, though, were heartbreaking.

So, yeah, it does kind of irk me when someone who gets a baby from ONE round of IVF says IVF was no big deal. But I can see how that perspective is helpful to people who are new to the process and fearful of an IVF cycle.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmmm, perhaps I'm heartless, but "breaks my heart" seems a bit strong. I'm sorry some women are too scared/intimidated/something of IVF to do it, but my broken heart is reserved more for women who can't afford it or who try it and fail.

I think it's incredibly sad when women turn down IVF when it's really not that awful. It's what...9-10 days of shots, one appointment where you're out under and another one that's similar to an annual visit. Being so scared of the medication and procedures that you choose not to have kids is sad.

You people are ridiculously heartless and lack empathy. Perhaps IVF wasn't so bad for you, but I know women for whom it was a horrible experience. Why do you assume your experience is the only experience? And worse, there are some women who went through multiple rounds of IVF, had negative physical consequences, and still never ended up pregnant.

Not to mention, some people have moral or religious objections to IVF. Anyone on here who is against abortion but mocks women who have a moral objection to IVF is a hypocrite.

And then there are some for whom IVF wouldn't solve the problem anyhow (i.e., they don't have a problem getting pregnant). Not everyone can afford donor eggs, by the way -- especially on top of costs associated with IVF and then all of the daycare costs once the baby arrives.

I find it incredibly sad when women talk about empathy and then in the same post show a complete lack of empathy by judging other women who make different choices in the face of heartbreaking circumstances.

And you know what? This thread shouldn't be in infertility support because it seems to assume that everyone on the infertility forum eventually ends up with a baby. That's not the reality.

I am not this pp but I agree completely and even made similar comments on another thread. I got trashed too, pp. Not sure what that's about. I guess we're in good company though.

Thank you. I'm the PP you are responding to. People don't like that someone is disagreeing with their condescending narrative. I have a close relative who went through 3 rounds of IVF. No success. They went into debt, the IVF was actually difficult for her, and it was hard on her marriage. And they never ended up with a baby. She regrets doing IVF and feels that her doctors were not honest with her about her chances of success (complicated story).

PP here. I know. I have friends who have been through multiple cycles of IVF, IVF + DE, and DE+surrogacy only to wind up with nothing. They also feel duped. Strongly. We have other friends who decided treatment just wasn't for them, even when they were ostensibly good candidates. They decided acceptance was the better path. We had failed transfer after failed transfer after failed transfer... for years and years. Surrogacy finally worked, but I would not wish what we went through on anyone. It's certainly NOT something I would put in the category of "no big deal," and I don't understand why this poster - pretty sure it's the same one or two - has such a hard time with folks who express perfectly legitimate reservations about starting down this road. Chalk it up to inexperience, I guess.

My own experience was "no big deal." IVF worked for me. and looking back, the 9-10 days of meds and two procedures were truly no big deal. Leading up to IVF I was a nervous wreck and thought it would be horrible. It wasn't. I could definitely tolerate a few rounds of IVF. That being said - I realize IVF doesn't work for everyone. I'm simply talking about my own experience. For you it was a big deal. For me, it was not and I'm glad I did it so i could get pregnant.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmmm, perhaps I'm heartless, but "breaks my heart" seems a bit strong. I'm sorry some women are too scared/intimidated/something of IVF to do it, but my broken heart is reserved more for women who can't afford it or who try it and fail.

I think it's incredibly sad when women turn down IVF when it's really not that awful. It's what...9-10 days of shots, one appointment where you're out under and another one that's similar to an annual visit. Being so scared of the medication and procedures that you choose not to have kids is sad.

You people are ridiculously heartless and lack empathy. Perhaps IVF wasn't so bad for you, but I know women for whom it was a horrible experience. Why do you assume your experience is the only experience? And worse, there are some women who went through multiple rounds of IVF, had negative physical consequences, and still never ended up pregnant.

Not to mention, some people have moral or religious objections to IVF. Anyone on here who is against abortion but mocks women who have a moral objection to IVF is a hypocrite.

And then there are some for whom IVF wouldn't solve the problem anyhow (i.e., they don't have a problem getting pregnant). Not everyone can afford donor eggs, by the way -- especially on top of costs associated with IVF and then all of the daycare costs once the baby arrives.

I find it incredibly sad when women talk about empathy and then in the same post show a complete lack of empathy by judging other women who make different choices in the face of heartbreaking circumstances.

And you know what? This thread shouldn't be in infertility support because it seems to assume that everyone on the infertility forum eventually ends up with a baby. That's not the reality.

I am not this pp but I agree completely and even made similar comments on another thread. I got trashed too, pp. Not sure what that's about. I guess we're in good company though.

Thank you. I'm the PP you are responding to. People don't like that someone is disagreeing with their condescending narrative. I have a close relative who went through 3 rounds of IVF. No success. They went into debt, the IVF was actually difficult for her, and it was hard on her marriage. And they never ended up with a baby. She regrets doing IVF and feels that her doctors were not honest with her about her chances of success (complicated story).

PP here. I know. I have friends who have been through multiple cycles of IVF, IVF + DE, and DE+surrogacy only to wind up with nothing. They also feel duped. Strongly. We have other friends who decided treatment just wasn't for them, even when they were ostensibly good candidates. They decided acceptance was the better path. We had failed transfer after failed transfer after failed transfer... for years and years. Surrogacy finally worked, but I would not wish what we went through on anyone. It's certainly NOT something I would put in the category of "no big deal," and I don't understand why this poster - pretty sure it's the same one or two - has such a hard time with folks who express perfectly legitimate reservations about starting down this road. Chalk it up to inexperience, I guess.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmmm, perhaps I'm heartless, but "breaks my heart" seems a bit strong. I'm sorry some women are too scared/intimidated/something of IVF to do it, but my broken heart is reserved more for women who can't afford it or who try it and fail.

I think it's incredibly sad when women turn down IVF when it's really not that awful. It's what...9-10 days of shots, one appointment where you're out under and another one that's similar to an annual visit. Being so scared of the medication and procedures that you choose not to have kids is sad.

You people are ridiculously heartless and lack empathy. Perhaps IVF wasn't so bad for you, but I know women for whom it was a horrible experience. Why do you assume your experience is the only experience? And worse, there are some women who went through multiple rounds of IVF, had negative physical consequences, and still never ended up pregnant.

Not to mention, some people have moral or religious objections to IVF. Anyone on here who is against abortion but mocks women who have a moral objection to IVF is a hypocrite.

And then there are some for whom IVF wouldn't solve the problem anyhow (i.e., they don't have a problem getting pregnant). Not everyone can afford donor eggs, by the way -- especially on top of costs associated with IVF and then all of the daycare costs once the baby arrives.

I find it incredibly sad when women talk about empathy and then in the same post show a complete lack of empathy by judging other women who make different choices in the face of heartbreaking circumstances.

And you know what? This thread shouldn't be in infertility support because it seems to assume that everyone on the infertility forum eventually ends up with a baby. That's not the reality.

I am not this pp but I agree completely and even made similar comments on another thread. I got trashed too, pp. Not sure what that's about. I guess we're in good company though.

Thank you. I'm the PP you are responding to. People don't like that someone is disagreeing with their condescending narrative. I have a close relative who went through 3 rounds of IVF. No success. They went into debt, the IVF was actually difficult for her, and it was hard on her marriage. And they never ended up with a baby. She regrets doing IVF and feels that her doctors were not honest with her about her chances of success (complicated story).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmmm, perhaps I'm heartless, but "breaks my heart" seems a bit strong. I'm sorry some women are too scared/intimidated/something of IVF to do it, but my broken heart is reserved more for women who can't afford it or who try it and fail.

I think it's incredibly sad when women turn down IVF when it's really not that awful. It's what...9-10 days of shots, one appointment where you're out under and another one that's similar to an annual visit. Being so scared of the medication and procedures that you choose not to have kids is sad.

You people are ridiculously heartless and lack empathy. Perhaps IVF wasn't so bad for you, but I know women for whom it was a horrible experience. Why do you assume your experience is the only experience? And worse, there are some women who went through multiple rounds of IVF, had negative physical consequences, and still never ended up pregnant.

Not to mention, some people have moral or religious objections to IVF. Anyone on here who is against abortion but mocks women who have a moral objection to IVF is a hypocrite.

And then there are some for whom IVF wouldn't solve the problem anyhow (i.e., they don't have a problem getting pregnant). Not everyone can afford donor eggs, by the way -- especially on top of costs associated with IVF and then all of the daycare costs once the baby arrives.

I find it incredibly sad when women talk about empathy and then in the same post show a complete lack of empathy by judging other women who make different choices in the face of heartbreaking circumstances.

And you know what? This thread shouldn't be in infertility support because it seems to assume that everyone on the infertility forum eventually ends up with a baby. That's not the reality.

I am not this pp but I agree completely and even made similar comments on another thread. I got trashed too, pp. Not sure what that's about. I guess we're in good company though.

I have mixed feeling about these posts. I have a number of IF friends who never got pregnant even after IVF worked for a number of us. Adoption is crazy expensive. Fostering and then adopting is cheaper. There is surrogacy. And there are relatives children--god children, nieces, nephews. People find a way to be a parent even if it isn't the way they planned and that is okay too. I recommend you read Alice Dolmar's "Conquering Infertility", and I recommend lots of therapy!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmmm, perhaps I'm heartless, but "breaks my heart" seems a bit strong. I'm sorry some women are too scared/intimidated/something of IVF to do it, but my broken heart is reserved more for women who can't afford it or who try it and fail.

I think it's incredibly sad when women turn down IVF when it's really not that awful. It's what...9-10 days of shots, one appointment where you're out under and another one that's similar to an annual visit. Being so scared of the medication and procedures that you choose not to have kids is sad.

You people are ridiculously heartless and lack empathy. Perhaps IVF wasn't so bad for you, but I know women for whom it was a horrible experience. Why do you assume your experience is the only experience? And worse, there are some women who went through multiple rounds of IVF, had negative physical consequences, and still never ended up pregnant.

Not to mention, some people have moral or religious objections to IVF. Anyone on here who is against abortion but mocks women who have a moral objection to IVF is a hypocrite.

And then there are some for whom IVF wouldn't solve the problem anyhow (i.e., they don't have a problem getting pregnant). Not everyone can afford donor eggs, by the way -- especially on top of costs associated with IVF and then all of the daycare costs once the baby arrives.

I find it incredibly sad when women talk about empathy and then in the same post show a complete lack of empathy by judging other women who make different choices in the face of heartbreaking circumstances.

And you know what? This thread shouldn't be in infertility support because it seems to assume that everyone on the infertility forum eventually ends up with a baby. That's not the reality.

I am not this pp but I agree completely and even made similar comments on another thread. I got trashed too, pp. Not sure what that's about. I guess we're in good company though.

I worried that having a larger gap than intended would be a problem. It really hasn't been.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmmm, perhaps I'm heartless, but "breaks my heart" seems a bit strong. I'm sorry some women are too scared/intimidated/something of IVF to do it, but my broken heart is reserved more for women who can't afford it or who try it and fail.

I think it's incredibly sad when women turn down IVF when it's really not that awful. It's what...9-10 days of shots, one appointment where you're out under and another one that's similar to an annual visit. Being so scared of the medication and procedures that you choose not to have kids is sad.

You people are ridiculously heartless and lack empathy. Perhaps IVF wasn't so bad for you, but I know women for whom it was a horrible experience. Why do you assume your experience is the only experience? And worse, there are some women who went through multiple rounds of IVF, had negative physical consequences, and still never ended up pregnant.

Not to mention, some people have moral or religious objections to IVF. Anyone on here who is against abortion but mocks women who have a moral objection to IVF is a hypocrite.

And then there are some for whom IVF wouldn't solve the problem anyhow (i.e., they don't have a problem getting pregnant). Not everyone can afford donor eggs, by the way -- especially on top of costs associated with IVF and then all of the daycare costs once the baby arrives.

I find it incredibly sad when women talk about empathy and then in the same post show a complete lack of empathy by judging other women who make different choices in the face of heartbreaking circumstances.

And you know what? This thread shouldn't be in infertility support because it seems to assume that everyone on the infertility forum eventually ends up with a baby. That's not the reality.

You seem to have all kinds of issues.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmmm, perhaps I'm heartless, but "breaks my heart" seems a bit strong. I'm sorry some women are too scared/intimidated/something of IVF to do it, but my broken heart is reserved more for women who can't afford it or who try it and fail.

I think it's incredibly sad when women turn down IVF when it's really not that awful. It's what...9-10 days of shots, one appointment where you're out under and another one that's similar to an annual visit. Being so scared of the medication and procedures that you choose not to have kids is sad.

You people are ridiculously heartless and lack empathy. Perhaps IVF wasn't so bad for you, but I know women for whom it was a horrible experience. Why do you assume your experience is the only experience? And worse, there are some women who went through multiple rounds of IVF, had negative physical consequences, and still never ended up pregnant.

Not to mention, some people have moral or religious objections to IVF. Anyone on here who is against abortion but mocks women who have a moral objection to IVF is a hypocrite.

And then there are some for whom IVF wouldn't solve the problem anyhow (i.e., they don't have a problem getting pregnant). Not everyone can afford donor eggs, by the way -- especially on top of costs associated with IVF and then all of the daycare costs once the baby arrives.

I find it incredibly sad when women talk about empathy and then in the same post show a complete lack of empathy by judging other women who make different choices in the face of heartbreaking circumstances.

And you know what? This thread shouldn't be in infertility support because it seems to assume that everyone on the infertility forum eventually ends up with a baby. That's not the reality.

Perhaps there shouldn't be an infertility support board at all because there are many others who process things differently than you. But, best of luck on your journey all the same, hope it ends where you would like it to.