Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd seriously like to understand the end game to all of this "dismantle the government" ideology that started in earnest with Reagan in the post-Nixon years and has now reached it's logical zenith under Trump.

What will happen when tax revenues are fraction of what we need to maintain the military, infrastructure, and the Boomers begin dying in poverty in mass due to the dismantling of Social Security & Medicare?

I'd love to understand what Republicans want our country to look like once they enact all these policies. What is your vision? Is the point to weaken our country to the point that Constitutional changes are rammed through that fundamentally end "one person, one vote" electoral politics? Perhaps the installation of some sort of hereditary-based political structure?

Will we be able to defend ourselves from foreign invaders with a society that is physically unhealthy/aging, in prison, and with crumbling infrastructure?

I feel like a lot of my Republican friends and Trump can say what they want to do to dismantle government....but have they contemplated what will exist in the aftermath?

1. Anyone who already works in government knows that at least 50% of your colleagues are deadwood. Maybe you are deadwood yourself. So not "dismantle government" but get rid of deadwood. Improve efficiency. Justify your existence. (Like with the DOE.) Scary, right, I know?

Except these deadwoods pay taxes, buy products, pay for local schools and in general help the economy. You cut them in such high numbers there will be a deep recession.

Also, if you have time to post on a mom's forum you are very much a dead wood too(Yes you have a job, not a SAHM). If you work in private sector then that means you are a deadwood for your company.

2. Trump wants a trillion dollar infrastructure project. But maybe to pay for it, he wants to get rid of your do-nothing job. Too bad, so sad.

You can't pay for $1trillion in infrastructure by saving money from paying deadwoods because you only get about half of it effectively after accounting for various tax loss.

3. Social Security and Medicare won't be dismantled. But it has to be fixed. Democrats haven't offered a viable plan. Waiting 21 years until the surplus is used up is stupid. So reform will get done, but liberals won't have a seat at the table. Too bad again.

republicans talk about SS and medicare for decades but when in power they will increase debt even more by spending on military waste and giving tax cuts to the rich.

4. Tax revenues won't go down, they'll go up as the economy expands, perhaps at a somewhat slower pace, perhaps not. Another ridiculous leftist straw man. But hopefully the taxes will be used a little more wisely. It doesn't even have to be used vastly more wisely. 5% more efficient use of tax revenues, overall, would be a huge benefit to the economy.

US economy is well developed and won't grow like china no matter who becomes president because there are structural headwinds with boomers retiring in droves and not enough talent to replace them

5. Republicans don't want "the country" to look like anything. They want you to have the freedom to live your life the way you see fit within very wide parameters. But of course, liberals don't like that, because it means they have to leave other people alone to choose how to live their own lives, too. Only leftists have a grand socialist organizing agenda for how the "country" should "look." (Like Seattle, I guess. Or maybe Austin.)

Yeah who is stopping you from living how you want? it is the republicans who want to enforce how to use bathroom, what to do with women's body, who should marry, who should get subsidies and who shouldn't etc.[/b]

6. Hereditary based political structure?

You mean like Papa Bush, Son bush, grandson bush etc.

7. One person, one vote? You mean you're OK with a conservative Supreme Court that doesn't constantly overrule legislation approved by the majority of the population because they think they know best?

How about we value your vote as only 1/3 of CA voter and effectively disenfranchising you. I am sure you would be perfect with it.

8. Now you're worried about foreign invaders? But not about Islamic terrorism? Not about illegal immigration?

How many have died of Islamic terrorism FROM OUTSIDE post 9/11? These are American muslim radicals. Infact according to FBI stats, the white racist terrorists have killed and committed the most hate crimes and terrorism since then .

9. Crumbling infrastructure...well Trump's got that covered, if the liberals don't block him. A trillion dollars should be enough to get the ball rolling.

And who pays for it? $1 trillion here, increased military spending while simultaneously cutting taxes on the wealthy. This movie was played before and it ended in deep recession in 2008.

10. Getting rid of useless government employees who perform no useful function--and there are lots of them--isn't dismantling government. It's making government better. Sorry if you're one of those employees honey.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd seriously like to understand the end game to all of this "dismantle the government" ideology that started in earnest with Reagan in the post-Nixon years and has now reached it's logical zenith under Trump.

What will happen when tax revenues are fraction of what we need to maintain the military, infrastructure, and the Boomers begin dying in poverty in mass due to the dismantling of Social Security & Medicare?

I'd love to understand what Republicans want our country to look like once they enact all these policies. What is your vision? Is the point to weaken our country to the point that Constitutional changes are rammed through that fundamentally end "one person, one vote" electoral politics? Perhaps the installation of some sort of hereditary-based political structure?

Will we be able to defend ourselves from foreign invaders with a society that is physically unhealthy/aging, in prison, and with crumbling infrastructure?

I feel like a lot of my Republican friends and Trump can say what they want to do to dismantle government....but have they contemplated what will exist in the aftermath?

Ryan's plan caters to the wealthiest and will deeply hurt the poor and working classes - what's left of them. Poor states will be poverty ridden - the benefit of a federal safety net is it lifts all boats, so to speak. It's hard to fathom why the GOP wants to destroy the middle class ... why they want to turn the most vulnerable away from basic support. I'm a fiscal conservative but cannot for the life of me understand the motivation behind this hateful, greedy party and it's platform. It's not just Trump; it's spineless Ryan and McConnell and a whole host of others. This is getting scary.

First I'm ignoring the whole people are going to starve/die crap that's fear mongering

Fed government will do what the constitution actually says mainly Defense/National Security type stuff

Rest of the money will go to the states and each state will decide what they want to do... That's the end game

Read some of the stuff Paul Ryan has put out it's all out there

See, I think you're willfully ignoring a HUGE outcome of Ryan's policies. What will happen to Americans in old age if you dismantle Social Security and Medicare? You can't ignore that elephant in the room....way too big and affects all of us. Again, you have not articulated an end game. You've told us what you want to do, but what does Tomorrow look like?

For crying out loud, tt's not going to be wholly dismantled. The age limit is going to increase one maybe two years the wage caps will increase and there might be some means testing

Again quit with the fear mongering

Um, Ryan wants to replace Medicare with a fixed annual voucher. How do you think elderly are going to pay for their medical care once they've spent the pitifully low voucher? What happens if they have a "bad year"? People will be dying...or they will flood hospitals and not pay, thus leaving the rest of us with massive bills.

Again, there's no vision of an end game here. I'd like to hear how a voucher solves the issues at hand.

Anonymous wrote:

PaleoConPrep wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

PaleoConPrep wrote:I'm not a typical modern Republican, so my answer may be a bit different. At this point, the end game for me would be a scaling back of the federal government, and much more power to the states. The Feds should be responsible for national defense and nothing else. Every other power should be given to the states. Georgia and Texas may ban abortion and gay marriage, and have no welfare programs. However, if people in California and NY want a more socialistic economy with welfare programs, they can pay for it with state taxes. So the type of society would depend on which state you live in. 3 cheers for STATES RIGHTS!

Ok so you realize that most of the welfare in this country goes to the red states, right?

Beyond that, how do you propose working standards be handled? What happens if there is discrimination? What specific programs should be cut? You want to cut the EPA? Fine, so you are ok with living in Flint then without the benefit of bottled water? How about fracking next door to where you live. You ok with that? You ok with lack of food testing at meat packing facilities? That might be cat you re eating, not beef. You ok with that?

PaleoCon here
All civil rights laws would be repealed. A private company has a right to decide who they will and will not hire. The government should not have the power to interfere with that right. States would handle environmental matters.

To reproduce in the states all the functions of the federal government in matters like environmental protection, civil rights, etc, would be very expensive. You'd have massive duplication of effort. And it would be really tough on low population states. They'd have to put a much larger fraction of their income into government just to cover the basics.

Anonymous wrote:So I think the answer to OP is yes, a dystopic society where the top 1% live in luxury while the rest live in poverty and cater to their needs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd seriously like to understand the end game to all of this "dismantle the government" ideology that started in earnest with Reagan in the post-Nixon years and has now reached it's logical zenith under Trump.

What will happen when tax revenues are fraction of what we need to maintain the military, infrastructure, and the Boomers begin dying in poverty in mass due to the dismantling of Social Security & Medicare?

I'd love to understand what Republicans want our country to look like once they enact all these policies. What is your vision? Is the point to weaken our country to the point that Constitutional changes are rammed through that fundamentally end "one person, one vote" electoral politics? Perhaps the installation of some sort of hereditary-based political structure?

Will we be able to defend ourselves from foreign invaders with a society that is physically unhealthy/aging, in prison, and with crumbling infrastructure?

I feel like a lot of my Republican friends and Trump can say what they want to do to dismantle government....but have they contemplated what will exist in the aftermath?

Ryan's plan caters to the wealthiest and will deeply hurt the poor and working classes - what's left of them. Poor states will be poverty ridden - the benefit of a federal safety net is it lifts all boats, so to speak. It's hard to fathom why the GOP wants to destroy the middle class ... why they want to turn the most vulnerable away from basic support. I'm a fiscal conservative but cannot for the life of me understand the motivation behind this hateful, greedy party and it's platform. It's not just Trump; it's spineless Ryan and McConnell and a whole host of others. This is getting scary.

First I'm ignoring the whole people are going to starve/die crap that's fear mongering

Fed government will do what the constitution actually says mainly Defense/National Security type stuff

Rest of the money will go to the states and each state will decide what they want to do... That's the end game

Read some of the stuff Paul Ryan has put out it's all out there

See, I think you're willfully ignoring a HUGE outcome of Ryan's policies. What will happen to Americans in old age if you dismantle Social Security and Medicare? You can't ignore that elephant in the room....way too big and affects all of us. Again, you have not articulated an end game. You've told us what you want to do, but what does Tomorrow look like?

For crying out loud, tt's not going to be wholly dismantled. The age limit is going to increase one maybe two years the wage caps will increase and there might be some means testing

Again quit with the fear mongering

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd seriously like to understand the end game to all of this "dismantle the government" ideology that started in earnest with Reagan in the post-Nixon years and has now reached it's logical zenith under Trump.

What will happen when tax revenues are fraction of what we need to maintain the military, infrastructure, and the Boomers begin dying in poverty in mass due to the dismantling of Social Security & Medicare?

I'd love to understand what Republicans want our country to look like once they enact all these policies. What is your vision? Is the point to weaken our country to the point that Constitutional changes are rammed through that fundamentally end "one person, one vote" electoral politics? Perhaps the installation of some sort of hereditary-based political structure?

Will we be able to defend ourselves from foreign invaders with a society that is physically unhealthy/aging, in prison, and with crumbling infrastructure?

I feel like a lot of my Republican friends and Trump can say what they want to do to dismantle government....but have they contemplated what will exist in the aftermath?

Ryan's plan caters to the wealthiest and will deeply hurt the poor and working classes - what's left of them. Poor states will be poverty ridden - the benefit of a federal safety net is it lifts all boats, so to speak. It's hard to fathom why the GOP wants to destroy the middle class ... why they want to turn the most vulnerable away from basic support. I'm a fiscal conservative but cannot for the life of me understand the motivation behind this hateful, greedy party and it's platform. It's not just Trump; it's spineless Ryan and McConnell and a whole host of others. This is getting scary.

First I'm ignoring the whole people are going to starve/die crap that's fear mongering

Fed government will do what the constitution actually says mainly Defense/National Security type stuff

Rest of the money will go to the states and each state will decide what they want to do... That's the end game

Read some of the stuff Paul Ryan has put out it's all out there

See, I think you're willfully ignoring a HUGE outcome of Ryan's policies. What will happen to Americans in old age if you dismantle Social Security and Medicare? You can't ignore that elephant in the room....way too big and affects all of us. Again, you have not articulated an end game. You've told us what you want to do, but what does Tomorrow look like?

PaleoConPrep wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

PaleoConPrep wrote:I'm not a typical modern Republican, so my answer may be a bit different. At this point, the end game for me would be a scaling back of the federal government, and much more power to the states. The Feds should be responsible for national defense and nothing else. Every other power should be given to the states. Georgia and Texas may ban abortion and gay marriage, and have no welfare programs. However, if people in California and NY want a more socialistic economy with welfare programs, they can pay for it with state taxes. So the type of society would depend on which state you live in. 3 cheers for STATES RIGHTS!

Ok so you realize that most of the welfare in this country goes to the red states, right?

Beyond that, how do you propose working standards be handled? What happens if there is discrimination? What specific programs should be cut? You want to cut the EPA? Fine, so you are ok with living in Flint then without the benefit of bottled water? How about fracking next door to where you live. You ok with that? You ok with lack of food testing at meat packing facilities? That might be cat you re eating, not beef. You ok with that?

PaleoCon here
All civil rights laws would be repealed. A private company has a right to decide who they will and will not hire. The government should not have the power to interfere with that right. States would handle environmental matters.

PaleoConPrep wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

PaleoConPrep wrote:I'm not a typical modern Republican, so my answer may be a bit different. At this point, the end game for me would be a scaling back of the federal government, and much more power to the states. The Feds should be responsible for national defense and nothing else. Every other power should be given to the states. Georgia and Texas may ban abortion and gay marriage, and have no welfare programs. However, if people in California and NY want a more socialistic economy with welfare programs, they can pay for it with state taxes. So the type of society would depend on which state you live in. 3 cheers for STATES RIGHTS!

Ok so you realize that most of the welfare in this country goes to the red states, right?

Beyond that, how do you propose working standards be handled? What happens if there is discrimination? What specific programs should be cut? You want to cut the EPA? Fine, so you are ok with living in Flint then without the benefit of bottled water? How about fracking next door to where you live. You ok with that? You ok with lack of food testing at meat packing facilities? That might be cat you re eating, not beef. You ok with that?

PaleoCon here
All civil rights laws would be repealed. A private company has a right to decide who they will and will not hire. The government should not have the power to interfere with that right. States would handle environmental matters.

Anonymous wrote:

PaleoConPrep wrote:I'm not a typical modern Republican, so my answer may be a bit different. At this point, the end game for me would be a scaling back of the federal government, and much more power to the states. The Feds should be responsible for national defense and nothing else. Every other power should be given to the states. Georgia and Texas may ban abortion and gay marriage, and have no welfare programs. However, if people in California and NY want a more socialistic economy with welfare programs, they can pay for it with state taxes. So the type of society would depend on which state you live in. 3 cheers for STATES RIGHTS!

Ok so you realize that most of the welfare in this country goes to the red states, right?

Beyond that, how do you propose working standards be handled? What happens if there is discrimination? What specific programs should be cut? You want to cut the EPA? Fine, so you are ok with living in Flint then without the benefit of bottled water? How about fracking next door to where you live. You ok with that? You ok with lack of food testing at meat packing facilities? That might be cat you re eating, not beef. You ok with that?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Liberals are terrified that Trump will actually be successful in cutting down the government jobs and programs which accomplish nothing except that's where they get their paychecks.

Most of them can be replaced by robots anyway.

Non-functioning robots will do the trick.

What government jobs and programs would you cut? Be specific.

It is a great slogan in a vacuum, but when push comes to shove, most of these federal jobs, the DOD and military jobs are in the red states. I am fine with a lot of cuts, my taxes will go down and I don't use welfare or other subsidies other than gas and highways. But I think most Americans, if exposed to the value of our Federal Government would like see that for the most part, it is a pretty good bargain.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd seriously like to understand the end game to all of this "dismantle the government" ideology that started in earnest with Reagan in the post-Nixon years and has now reached it's logical zenith under Trump.

What will happen when tax revenues are fraction of what we need to maintain the military, infrastructure, and the Boomers begin dying in poverty in mass due to the dismantling of Social Security & Medicare?

I'd love to understand what Republicans want our country to look like once they enact all these policies. What is your vision? Is the point to weaken our country to the point that Constitutional changes are rammed through that fundamentally end "one person, one vote" electoral politics? Perhaps the installation of some sort of hereditary-based political structure?

Will we be able to defend ourselves from foreign invaders with a society that is physically unhealthy/aging, in prison, and with crumbling infrastructure?

I feel like a lot of my Republican friends and Trump can say what they want to do to dismantle government....but have they contemplated what will exist in the aftermath?

Ryan's plan caters to the wealthiest and will deeply hurt the poor and working classes - what's left of them. Poor states will be poverty ridden - the benefit of a federal safety net is it lifts all boats, so to speak. It's hard to fathom why the GOP wants to destroy the middle class ... why they want to turn the most vulnerable away from basic support. I'm a fiscal conservative but cannot for the life of me understand the motivation behind this hateful, greedy party and it's platform. It's not just Trump; it's spineless Ryan and McConnell and a whole host of others. This is getting scary.

First I'm ignoring the whole people are going to starve/die crap that's fear mongering

Fed government will do what the constitution actually says mainly Defense/National Security type stuff

Rest of the money will go to the states and each state will decide what they want to do... That's the end game

Read some of the stuff Paul Ryan has put out it's all out there

See, I think you're willfully ignoring a HUGE outcome of Ryan's policies. What will happen to Americans in old age if you dismantle Social Security and Medicare? You can't ignore that elephant in the room....way too big and affects all of us. Again, you have not articulated an end game. You've told us what you want to do, but what does Tomorrow look like?

Anonymous wrote:The end game is more prosperity and freedom for everyone, rich and poor.

Anonymous wrote:Liberals are terrified that Trump will actually be successful in cutting down the government jobs and programs which accomplish nothing except that's where they get their paychecks.

Most of them can be replaced by robots anyway.

Non-functioning robots will do the trick.

Anonymous wrote:Liberals are terrified that Trump will actually be successful in cutting down the government jobs and programs which accomplish nothing except that's where they get their paychecks.

Most of them can be replaced by robots anyway.

Non-functioning robots will do the trick.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So I think the answer to OP is yes, a dystopic society where the top 1% live in luxury while the rest live in poverty and cater to their needs.

That already exists. It's called the wealthiest suburbs.