Anonymous
Post 10/17/2016 13:45     Subject: Re:my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP here. Responding to the prior poster, I don't see any shame in her needing help. That's why I posted! Before I take the step to hire a tutor, I was hoping that we could find some good instruction/groundwork rules from a website and/or book. I do try to help but she gets very upset quickly when I step in. (I also didn't say that her W cluster elem school was wonderful - in fact my implication was quite the opposite if she received ESs in writing but still can't write.)

This is what I don't get, how did she get to grade 6 and NO KNOW YOUR KID CANNOT WRITE?
How did you not ever look at assignments , go over homework , look at tests and not know your child had problems with writing??
How is that ?
I saw my kid's homework and saw where he was weak or not .
The only thing I did not like about 2.0 in writing was not always grading for each element of writing, content, grammar etc. at the same time .
So while the teacher may not of been grading assignments and grammar it was a requirement in my household that much I'll have to check his homework copy edit for grammar and everything else before turning something .
So I'm still amazed how regardless of what it said on the report card how you could not have firsthand knowledge of what your child can I cannot do.

Any advice in there or just judgment?


Not sure, but there's definitely bad grammar...

Plenty of it, because this is not a graded school assignment, it's me typing on my phone on an internet board.
Get the difference?
Anonymous
Post 10/17/2016 13:43     Subject: Re:my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP here. Responding to the prior poster, I don't see any shame in her needing help. That's why I posted! Before I take the step to hire a tutor, I was hoping that we could find some good instruction/groundwork rules from a website and/or book. I do try to help but she gets very upset quickly when I step in. (I also didn't say that her W cluster elem school was wonderful - in fact my implication was quite the opposite if she received ESs in writing but still can't write.)

This is what I don't get, how did she get to grade 6 and NO KNOW YOUR KID CANNOT WRITE?
How did you not ever look at assignments , go over homework , look at tests and not know your child had problems with writing??
How is that ?
I saw my kid's homework and saw where he was weak or not .
The only thing I did not like about 2.0 in writing was not always grading for each element of writing, content, grammar etc. at the same time .
So while the teacher may not of been grading assignments and grammar it was a requirement in my household that much I'll have to check his homework copy edit for grammar and everything else before turning something .
So I'm still amazed how regardless of what it said on the report card how you could not have firsthand knowledge of what your child can I cannot do.

Any advice in there or just judgment?

OP was judging the curriculum was she not? And we are not allowed to question whether her real isssue is a crappy curriculum or that perhaps OP was not keeping a close eye on her own kid's work and therefore able to discern if the issue is the curriculum or if her kid just has difficulty in that area??
Anonymous
Post 10/17/2016 13:37     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Don't rely on a school system (any system) to teach your kid 100% of what they need to learn. read things online and research. You don't have to be a teacher to teach them things that you know will help them in the future.

Anonymous
Post 10/17/2016 11:00     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:MCPS doesn't seem to teach writing very well, so I supplemented the kids' education in that area because I wasn't satisfied with the standards they were meeting.

I'm not sure it'd work for you at this point, but we used the Writing With Ease & Writing With Skill books from first through 7th grade. We also used resources from The Write Foundation and the University of Maryland Writing Center.

I think the most important thing is to just teach an easily repeatable method for how to organize essays -- you can do this without any specialized curriculum just by sitting with her and helping her prewrite, outline, & draft her next assignment.


Not the OP, but thank you for this suggestion. My DD is in 3rd grade and isn't the best writer. FTR, we never get homework sent home, so it's tough to know how your kid is writing other than for homework.

Have thought about getting a tutor, but will check out your suggestions.


I'm in the same boat with a third grader. Tell me more pp. Do I start with level 1 workbook in addition to the main text? I'm not finding much info on which level to begin with for a third grader.
Anonymous
Post 10/17/2016 01:10     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
OK, 23:58 coming back.

I've just confirmed with my 6th grader - he has 0 essays to write, which is concerning. He's at the North Bethesda middle school.

Would you mind giving me a little detail on the type of essays your child has to write? And which school, if you are prepared to share the name? I want to compare the standards here, and maybe prepare some hard questions for the teachers


I bet the teacher's will love such useless questions.
1. Essays aren't the only good way to learn.
2. All your kid needs from middle school is good grades -- as long as he's doing well on the stuff he is assigned he'll be fine and no further involvement is needed.


Useless, perhaps, because they're not going to implement anything they don't want to implement. However, I will have made my point.

I completely refute the philosophy behind your other points.
Essays are essential to developing writing. At a certain point, they are the ONLY way to move forward with writing.
The only thing my child needs from school is good grades????? Oh hell no. The only thing my child needs from school is a good education, and I'll worry about the grades later. If he does well now because the teachers are not preparing him adequately for what's to come, it will rebound on him, not the teachers or me. Further involvement is needed if only to register parental displeasure at the current low standards and low expectations. It therefore helps if I can quote OP and what they do at her child's school. This is what I allowed my friend to do - my son's elementary had a great writing program, and she went to her child's school to ask if they could have the same one. This is how parents implement change, PP.


16:56 Very well put.
PP: Perhaps you haven't heard that colleges are concerned about how poorly prepared their "A" students are?

Middle school is only a required steppingstone to high school, which, again, is necessary primarily in order to get into a good college and hopefully with scholarships. Why burn bridges with the school district by making waves about things that aren't actually problems, or purposefully make more work for both the teacher and the students?
Anonymous
Post 10/17/2016 01:07     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
OK, 23:58 coming back.

I've just confirmed with my 6th grader - he has 0 essays to write, which is concerning. He's at the North Bethesda middle school.

Would you mind giving me a little detail on the type of essays your child has to write? And which school, if you are prepared to share the name? I want to compare the standards here, and maybe prepare some hard questions for the teachers


I bet the teacher's will love such useless questions.
1. Essays aren't the only good way to learn.
2. All your kid needs from middle school is good grades -- as long as he's doing well on the stuff he is assigned he'll be fine and no further involvement is needed.


Yes, and it's attitudes like pps which explain why the US educational system lags behind much of Europe's and Asia's.
Anonymous
Post 10/17/2016 01:03     Subject: Re:my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:There will always be students how fall through any system be it for low intelligence, unstable home environment, poor specific peer group, learning disabilities or even a personality/mental disorder. If your child is falling through the cracks, I would focus on the root cause on why they are deficient and not try to shift blame to the school system that works for so many. Deflecting blame will just delay proper diagnosis of your child problems.


Or be it for 29 kids in the classroom, teachers who've given up their break room for classroom space, etc.
Anonymous
Post 10/17/2016 01:00     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:First of all, where are you seeing all these writing assignments?

Second, might this be school-dependent?

My son went to a Bethesda-area elementary which implemented the Lucy Calkin (sp?) writing program and had a LOT of essay writing in 4th and 5th, which was great practice. But now in middle school as a 6th grader, I haven't seen any piece of writing come home, and the only writing I see him preparing are completely inane "literature profile" questions which seem very basic. And that's in the supposedly Advanced English class!

Very weird.

To answer your question, OP, I think you might want to coach her yourself for while. Explain the basics of doing a little list or diagram (depending on whether she's more text or pict-oriented) while brainstorming ideas, checking the rubric to hit all the points, and then writing each paragraph with the thematic sentence first and simply stated. Lastly, crafting the intro and conclusion - although she could do a simple chronological order, but kids often find the intro and conclusion to be a little challenging.
Lastly she needs to practice doing it with a time constraint. You set a timer and she needs to write something in 15-20 minutes on a set question.

Basically there's a recipe she needs to follow. What I impressed on my son is that it's not necessarily good writing, but it's what MCPS wants to see. BIG difference. Until he understood that, he was forever getting poor grades... you really need to dumb it down in this public school system, and not be too creative at all.


The last paragraph should be mailed to our new superintendent, who seems to think every kid whose parents are college-educated will be fine.
Anonymous
Post 10/17/2016 00:57     Subject: Re:my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP here. Responding to the prior poster, I don't see any shame in her needing help. That's why I posted! Before I take the step to hire a tutor, I was hoping that we could find some good instruction/groundwork rules from a website and/or book. I do try to help but she gets very upset quickly when I step in. (I also didn't say that her W cluster elem school was wonderful - in fact my implication was quite the opposite if she received ESs in writing but still can't write.)

This is what I don't get, how did she get to grade 6 and NO KNOW YOUR KID CANNOT WRITE?
How did you not ever look at assignments , go over homework , look at tests and not know your child had problems with writing??
How is that ?
I saw my kid's homework and saw where he was weak or not .
The only thing I did not like about 2.0 in writing was not always grading for each element of writing, content, grammar etc. at the same time .
So while the teacher may not of been grading assignments and grammar it was a requirement in my household that much I'll have to check his homework copy edit for grammar and everything else before turning something .
So I'm still amazed how regardless of what it said on the report card how you could not have firsthand knowledge of what your child can I cannot do.


Pp, are you a troll? Seriously, you are lecturing about grammar when it "may not of been?"

Writing instruction in MCPS sucks. Our kid was top of the class, also in a so-called "great" school but we knew he couldn't write. Trust your guts, parents. When we had him take the HSPT (Catholic school entrance exam), all of a sudden this 99% student in MCPS was in the 39th% for English.
OP, if you can swing it, it sounds like a tutor really would help your daughter not only with the mechanics but also with rebuilding her confidence as she masters the material. Good luck!
Anonymous
Post 10/16/2016 17:12     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
OK, 23:58 coming back.

I've just confirmed with my 6th grader - he has 0 essays to write, which is concerning. He's at the North Bethesda middle school.

Would you mind giving me a little detail on the type of essays your child has to write? And which school, if you are prepared to share the name? I want to compare the standards here, and maybe prepare some hard questions for the teachers


I bet the teacher's will love such useless questions.
1. Essays aren't the only good way to learn.
2. All your kid needs from middle school is good grades -- as long as he's doing well on the stuff he is assigned he'll be fine and no further involvement is needed.


Useless, perhaps, because they're not going to implement anything they don't want to implement. However, I will have made my point.

I completely refute the philosophy behind your other points.
Essays are essential to developing writing. At a certain point, they are the ONLY way to move forward with writing.
The only thing my child needs from school is good grades????? Oh hell no. The only thing my child needs from school is a good education, and I'll worry about the grades later. If he does well now because the teachers are not preparing him adequately for what's to come, it will rebound on him, not the teachers or me. Further involvement is needed if only to register parental displeasure at the current low standards and low expectations. It therefore helps if I can quote OP and what they do at her child's school. This is what I allowed my friend to do - my son's elementary had a great writing program, and she went to her child's school to ask if they could have the same one. This is how parents implement change, PP.


Middle school is only a required steppingstone to high school, which, again, is necessary primarily in order to get into a good college and hopefully with scholarships. Why burn bridges with the school district by making waves about things that aren't actually problems, or purposefully make more work for both the teacher and the students?


Again, I completely refute your point of view. These childhood years are not meant to be waited out to get somewhere. They are meant to be spent improving critical thinking skills and oral as well as written expression. More work is not something to be afraid of, as long as it's intelligent work that makes students think deeper and gain knowledge or skill. I don't think I am so important as to make waves I will ask whether there is any plan to introduce essay writing this year, and if not why? And point out that my children's elementary school has a very successful Lucy Calkin writing program and that other MCPS middle school students write essays regularly (if OP can confirm this, it would be great). That it is high time students were developing these skills, and what could the school do about this? Obviously, I will not make a difference just by myself. But if enough parents ask the same question, this might get somewhere.
Anonymous
Post 10/16/2016 17:01     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
OK, 23:58 coming back.

I've just confirmed with my 6th grader - he has 0 essays to write, which is concerning. He's at the North Bethesda middle school.

Would you mind giving me a little detail on the type of essays your child has to write? And which school, if you are prepared to share the name? I want to compare the standards here, and maybe prepare some hard questions for the teachers


I bet the teacher's will love such useless questions.
1. Essays aren't the only good way to learn.
2. All your kid needs from middle school is good grades -- as long as he's doing well on the stuff he is assigned he'll be fine and no further involvement is needed.


Useless, perhaps, because they're not going to implement anything they don't want to implement. However, I will have made my point.

I completely refute the philosophy behind your other points.
Essays are essential to developing writing. At a certain point, they are the ONLY way to move forward with writing.
The only thing my child needs from school is good grades????? Oh hell no. The only thing my child needs from school is a good education, and I'll worry about the grades later. If he does well now because the teachers are not preparing him adequately for what's to come, it will rebound on him, not the teachers or me. Further involvement is needed if only to register parental displeasure at the current low standards and low expectations. It therefore helps if I can quote OP and what they do at her child's school. This is what I allowed my friend to do - my son's elementary had a great writing program, and she went to her child's school to ask if they could have the same one. This is how parents implement change, PP.


Middle school is only a required steppingstone to high school, which, again, is necessary primarily in order to get into a good college and hopefully with scholarships. Why burn bridges with the school district by making waves about things that aren't actually problems, or purposefully make more work for both the teacher and the students?
Anonymous
Post 10/16/2016 16:56     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
OK, 23:58 coming back.

I've just confirmed with my 6th grader - he has 0 essays to write, which is concerning. He's at the North Bethesda middle school.

Would you mind giving me a little detail on the type of essays your child has to write? And which school, if you are prepared to share the name? I want to compare the standards here, and maybe prepare some hard questions for the teachers


I bet the teacher's will love such useless questions.
1. Essays aren't the only good way to learn.
2. All your kid needs from middle school is good grades -- as long as he's doing well on the stuff he is assigned he'll be fine and no further involvement is needed.


Useless, perhaps, because they're not going to implement anything they don't want to implement. However, I will have made my point.

I completely refute the philosophy behind your other points.
Essays are essential to developing writing. At a certain point, they are the ONLY way to move forward with writing.
The only thing my child needs from school is good grades????? Oh hell no. The only thing my child needs from school is a good education, and I'll worry about the grades later. If he does well now because the teachers are not preparing him adequately for what's to come, it will rebound on him, not the teachers or me. Further involvement is needed if only to register parental displeasure at the current low standards and low expectations. It therefore helps if I can quote OP and what they do at her child's school. This is what I allowed my friend to do - my son's elementary had a great writing program, and she went to her child's school to ask if they could have the same one. This is how parents implement change, PP.
Anonymous
Post 10/16/2016 16:48     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
Anonymous wrote:
OK, 23:58 coming back.

I've just confirmed with my 6th grader - he has 0 essays to write, which is concerning. He's at the North Bethesda middle school.

Would you mind giving me a little detail on the type of essays your child has to write? And which school, if you are prepared to share the name? I want to compare the standards here, and maybe prepare some hard questions for the teachers


I bet the teacher's will love such useless questions.
1. Essays aren't the only good way to learn.
2. All your kid needs from middle school is good grades -- as long as he's doing well on the stuff he is assigned he'll be fine and no further involvement is needed.
Anonymous
Post 10/16/2016 16:36     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS

OK, 23:58 coming back.

I've just confirmed with my 6th grader - he has 0 essays to write, which is concerning. He's at the North Bethesda middle school.

Would you mind giving me a little detail on the type of essays your child has to write? And which school, if you are prepared to share the name? I want to compare the standards here, and maybe prepare some hard questions for the teachers
Anonymous
Post 10/16/2016 14:32     Subject: my sixth grader has not learned to write in MCPS
I think it's great you are trying to help your kid learn to write. It is very hard to write well, even for adults, and I agree that MCPS in general is not good about teaching writing skills, and few teachers seem to give detailed feedback. For writing books, you could try Step Up to Writing, which I know an excellent private school uses. But I think writing is very hard for a parent to teach, even if the parent herself knows how to write. For myself, I know that I both criticize too much, not knowing what is age appropriate, and also don't know how to actually teach the technique needed to fix the problem. So I would recommend a writing tutor for the actual writing. Grammar/vocabulary/spelling, on the other hand, I think is teachable. I just googled free internet worksheets for grammar stuff when I wanted that. You could use various test prep books for vocabulary lists/spelling lists. I think schools should be giving kids vocab lists, the private ones do, so if the public one isn't, I think it is time to supplement. Also, I can get my kid to do a worksheet on grammar/vocab much easier than I could get him to write a paragraph for me, so that is where I would put my personal focus.