I agree with you 22:14, I also read the report that way.

Anonymous wrote:

NP here. I find it problematic because the implication is that race should be considered for admissions in the magnet program. It seems that this is the only way to close the achievement gap, because nothing else seems to be working. Any genuine attempt to actually make the kids who are lagging behind, catch up academically and become academically high performing and competitive is not being attempted here. Why not suggest intensive coaching, tutoring, mentoring to these kids from the early years?

The report actually does recommend that. Did you read the report? Here is the executive summary: http://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/uploadedFiles/info/choice/ExecutiveSummary-FindingsUpdated.pdf

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Makes me angry that they would even remotely consider getting rid of these programs or changing them to admit a less qualified but more racially diverse set of students.

There seems to be an implication that the current system is racist. So if I support the current system I am racist.

There are many reasons these programs are not racially diverse. Nothing will be solved by gutting these programs. Kids that truly need these programs and are thriving in them will be the ones hurt in the process.

Who in MCPS is saying anything about getting rid of the programs or admitting less-qualified students? Nobody. Not in the consultants' report, not in the Washington Post article. What the consultants are saying is that participation in the application magnets is unequal in terms of race. That is nothing to dispute; it is a fact.

So then the questions are

a. is this a problem?
b. if so, should somebody do something about it?
c. if so, what?

The consultants are saying: yes, this is a problem; yes, MCPS should do something about it; what MCPS should do about it is increase the numbers of black, Hispanic, and poor students who apply to the application magnets and the numbers of black, Hispanic, and poor students who are qualified to be there.

Do you find this problematic?

NP here. I find it problematic because the implication is that race should be considered for admissions in the magnet program. It seems that this is the only way to close the achievement gap, because nothing else seems to be working. Any genuine attempt to actually make the kids who are lagging behind, catch up academically and become academically high performing and competitive is not being attempted here. Why not suggest intensive coaching, tutoring, mentoring to these kids from the early years?

Nobody is implying this. You are inferring it. Why? How did you get from "We'd like more black/poor/Hispanic kids to apply" to "We're going to admit unqualified black/poor/Hispanic kids because they're black/poor/Hispanic"?

How about make magnet schools for separate races? Has anyone thought about that? In such schools you can make the standards as high or as low as needed by the racial population it serves.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Makes me angry that they would even remotely consider getting rid of these programs or changing them to admit a less qualified but more racially diverse set of students.

There seems to be an implication that the current system is racist. So if I support the current system I am racist.

There are many reasons these programs are not racially diverse. Nothing will be solved by gutting these programs. Kids that truly need these programs and are thriving in them will be the ones hurt in the process.

Who in MCPS is saying anything about getting rid of the programs or admitting less-qualified students? Nobody. Not in the consultants' report, not in the Washington Post article. What the consultants are saying is that participation in the application magnets is unequal in terms of race. That is nothing to dispute; it is a fact.

So then the questions are

a. is this a problem?
b. if so, should somebody do something about it?
c. if so, what?

The consultants are saying: yes, this is a problem; yes, MCPS should do something about it; what MCPS should do about it is increase the numbers of black, Hispanic, and poor students who apply to the application magnets and the numbers of black, Hispanic, and poor students who are qualified to be there.

Do you find this problematic?

NP here. I find it problematic because the implication is that race should be considered for admissions in the magnet program. It seems that this is the only way to close the achievement gap, because nothing else seems to be working. Any genuine attempt to actually make the kids who are lagging behind, catch up academically and become academically high performing and competitive is not being attempted here. Why not suggest intensive coaching, tutoring, mentoring to these kids from the early years?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCPS: We want to hire more Hispanic teachers.
DCUM: OMG! MCPS is going to hire unqualified teachers just because they're Hispanic!

MCPS: We want to get more Hispanic and black kids to apply to the magnet programs.
DCUM: OMG! MCPS is going to let unqualified Hispanic and black kids into the magnet programs just because they're black or Hispanic!

What is the common factor here? DCUM's assumption that black/Hispanic = unqualified.

Pretty much. I wish I knew how my family became so powerful and scary to white people in MCPS.

?? What?

Anonymous wrote:The issue is systemic. There is gap in education attainment between groups of population. Minority groups have limited access to preschool resources, and when they start school African American and Hispanics already lagging behind. Minority groups also less likely to engage in the summer programs. So, the possible solution may be within the reach. Why not use the existing resources like extended year program? Also, offering free preschool program to minorities may help close the gap. Free preschool is a long shot, but extended school year can be promissing. Once performance in the whole population group is lifted up, the magnet population is going to be more represenative as well. How fixing/adjusting magnet selection would help the more fundamental problem of persistent gap in education attainment? Magnet program is not a problem, the general education program is.

You are exactly right. How much time and how much resources have we spent to close the achievement gap?

Anonymous wrote:MCPS: We want to hire more Hispanic teachers.
DCUM: OMG! MCPS is going to hire unqualified teachers just because they're Hispanic!

MCPS: We want to get more Hispanic and black kids to apply to the magnet programs.
DCUM: OMG! MCPS is going to let unqualified Hispanic and black kids into the magnet programs just because they're black or Hispanic!

What is the common factor here? DCUM's assumption that black/Hispanic = unqualified.

Pretty much. I wish I knew how my family became so powerful and scary to white people in MCPS.

The issue is systemic. There is gap in education attainment between groups of population. Minority groups have limited access to preschool resources, and when they start school African American and Hispanics already lagging behind. Minority groups also less likely to engage in the summer programs. So, the possible solution may be within the reach. Why not use the existing resources like extended year program? Also, offering free preschool program to minorities may help close the gap. Free preschool is a long shot, but extended school year can be promissing. Once performance in the whole population group is lifted up, the magnet population is going to be more represenative as well. How fixing/adjusting magnet selection would help the more fundamental problem of persistent gap in education attainment? Magnet program is not a problem, the general education program is.

No wonder Trump is so popular.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/maryland-school-district-examines-racial-disparities-in-its-gifted-programs/2016/03/21/1caacdf6-eb88-11e5-b0fd-073d5930a7b7_story.html

How is it that people don't know about these programs? I got something in the mail and ConnectEd multiple calls / emails.

I had a child at an HGC several years back. I would have heard about the process through ConnectEd, etc, but the real reason we applied was we knew a neighbor who's kid had attended. Similarly I know people who've applied since in no small part because they spoke with us. The process is bizarre and it's hard to navigate without some first hand experience for encouragement. ConnectEd is over used and half of it sounds like spam, it's not surprising that families don't change the course of their kid's education based on a robo call. I don't have any suggestions for improving the system, but I have no trouble believing there's inertia that keeps the same groups of people applying/not applying.

We were new to mcps the year my DC was in 2nd grade. The school sent home a flyer about HGC in 3rd. As I recall, the flyer has information in several different languages. And I agree with PP, we get robocalls from mcps all the time about choice programs, magnet, etc...

If the parents don't bother listening to the message, or reading the things that come home, including in the mail, then what else can the school do?

If they look at "holistic", then yes, it would mean some of the students may not be able to keep up with the rest of the kids, and the fear is that they have to dumb down the curriculum to accommodate the kids that may not be on the same level as the rest of the kids.

If the intent is to really push for screening and notification of programs to certain schools without changing the admittance criteria, I have no problem with that.

MCPS: We want to hire more Hispanic teachers.
DCUM: OMG! MCPS is going to hire unqualified teachers just because they're Hispanic!

MCPS: We want to get more Hispanic and black kids to apply to the magnet programs.
DCUM: OMG! MCPS is going to let unqualified Hispanic and black kids into the magnet programs just because they're black or Hispanic!

What is the common factor here? DCUM's assumption that black/Hispanic = unqualified.

This reminds me of MCPS trying to hire more minority teachers.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

No, I don't think so. Colleges use it all the time.

Colleges are different from public school districts.

Well, only if colleges are private.

No, not only if colleges are private.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
So you think the guy is just making it up about lots of families not knowing the programs exist?

Not the PP but I think the problem goes deeper and sending out more emails or calls will not fix it.

OK, if more e-mails and calls won't fix the problem of families that don't know the programs exist, what will fix the problem? What can MCPS do to make sure that everybody knows about these programs and understands whether and how to apply to them?