Anonymous
Post 01/16/2016 19:20     Subject: Re:Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:Algebra 2 in 8th grade is actually not that advanced. A student who takes Algebra 2 in 8th grade is above average, but not necessarily college material.


Okay, no. This has to be the poster in the college forum insisting that you need 8th grade Algebra II have have any chance at a college degree. It is very advanced. Because many 7th graders and most 6th graders to not have the necessary brain development to really understand abstract math, like Algebra. Nothing to do with smart. Everything to with cognitive development. If your kid isn't ready, forcing the issue means they will never get the foundational concepts to apply to higher math, no matter how much you push and tutor. And this is the type of sh*t that ends with 1/3 of TJ's incoming class needing math remediation.

That said, I would agree that you can force your kid to do a lot of things until they burn out or fail. Which is where a lot of kids whose parents are so hyper competitive that they push advanced math too early are headed. I'm sure some are prodigies. But many more have pushy parents forcing summer school geometrY. In which case, they can watch all the kids who were "behind" and took Algebra in 7th and 8th, when it was developmentally appropriate for them, go on and succeed at the math they can't do, because they never fully grasped the basics.

Besides, 8th grade Algebra II is 1th grade Multivariable Calc and 12th grade differential equations at GMU. How many people actually need differential equations? I asked my engineer husband, and he listed 3-4 types of engineers, some types of physicists, and of course mathematicians. And radiologists (something to do with ionizing radiation). I wouldn't know, because I managed to, against all odds, become a successful professional and never go beyond BC Calculus (which I have not used since my final exam).
Anonymous
Post 01/16/2016 18:53     Subject: Re:Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Algebra 2 in 8th grade is actually not that advanced. A student who takes Algebra 2 in 8th grade is above average, but not necessarily college material.
Anonymous
Post 12/24/2015 15:52     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Frost sends kids next door to Woodson


Not anymore. They have enough to fill a class AT Frost.


This was not the case last year. My current 9th grader took Algebra 2 at Woodson as an 8th grader.


If your child does not go to TJ, what is the plan for math during your DC's senior year?


Multivariable Calculus, Matrix algebra ... many other classes to choose from.

The point is to take AP Physics in junior year, which requires you to have a AP Calculus in 10th grade.

What I want to know is how parents get the school's approval to take two math classes in 7th grade (algebra and geometry)? We asked and the school said no, so we didn't bother. But some kids did get the approval. I wish the school would be more open and transparent about requirements to take two math classes at 7th grade.


Some issues here... before you try to force your poor kid into taking honors algebra and geometry together, the first year of middle school. Multi variable calculus & linear algebra are the two semesters of math after AP BC Calculus-- so you would take these in 11th if you took Calculus in 10th. You would then need to come up with an additional year of math after that for 12th grade. Also, in most places, AP Calculus BC is a co-requisite of AP physics, not a pre-requisite. So, you do not need to take Algebra II in 8th to take Physics your junior year. Also-- FCPS is very transparent-- they answer is no. They do not sign off on taking Algebra and Geometry concurrently in 7th. Some kids take Algebra early in 6th. Most take ruin the summer between 7th and 8th. Teachers at our MS Center very strongly discourage this because a good foundation in geometry is necessary for more advanced math, but are not able to stop parents from enrolling their kids in summer school.

Parents like the PP think this is what their kid needs to establish their TJ street cred. But, DC1's ES said at back to school night that TJ is pushing back against the trend to hyper accelerate math. They are getting too many kids who need remediation because they did geometry summer school, or started Algebra before they were ready. Kids who are interested in TJ should get a solid grounding in math fundamentals and Algebra I concepts, and this is much more important than Algebra II, or even Geometry. Interestingly, we also got the same message from DC2's TJ info session this year at Carson.

Apparently, the kids at Carson who were in Algebra II did not have better admissions chances than the Geometry students last year. It will be interesting to see if that holds this year. It maKe sense, since the TJ test is Algebra I and a little bit of Geometry only. It would be great to see TJ hold the line on this.


How can you take Calculus in 10th without talking Algebra II in 8th?

8th: algebra II
9th: pre-cal
10th: AP Calculus AB
11th: AP Calculus BC
12th: multi varable ...

I do know kids taking both in 7th grade. I guess if you can present a compelling case, it is allowed. I was just interested in learning what.

Anonymous
Post 12/23/2015 23:14     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:You actually can be accelerated at math and play competitive sports - so you can let that one die.

As to advanced/accelerating math - sometime a student actually is interested and motivated. However, every ES and MS school is allowed to have different policies related to this. Kind of like how AAP isn't the same across the county, neither is access to acceleration.


+1
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2015 20:53     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
You actually can be accelerated at math and play competitive sports - so you can let that one die.

As to advanced/accelerating math - sometime a student actually is interested and motivated. However, every ES and MS school is allowed to have different policies related to this. Kind of like how AAP isn't the same across the county, neither is access to acceleration.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2015 19:36     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:How can a kid take Algebra 1 in 6th grade? My DD is in 5th grade AAP and in advance math group.


In our ES, a combo of 1-2 pushy parents a year and an administration that does not stand up to them. The parents prep the kids to death and insist that the administration to let them do the Iowa and 7th grade SOL in 5th, which the school will not administer normally. It does not appear to have anything to do with exceptional talent in math. In both of my kids' classes, the couple of kids who did this had really overbearing hyper intense parents who drove them to the MS for first period,waited, and then drove them to the ES. I know the school's policy was to actively discourage this. FWIW, these were often not the strongest math kids in the class. In DS's case, neither of the kids I know who did this were accepted to TJ, although they were both finalists (and his ES sent at least a handful of kids to TJ). We'll see what happens w/ DD's class this year.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2015 18:45     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:How can a kid take Algebra 1 in 6th grade? My DD is in 5th grade AAP and in advance math group.


Some of the ES, send a small group to the MS to take it. It is a very small group of students compared the total AP popuation.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2015 17:57     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
How can a kid take Algebra 1 in 6th grade? My DD is in 5th grade AAP and in advance math group.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2015 17:52     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Frost sends kids next door to Woodson


Not anymore. They have enough to fill a class AT Frost.


This was not the case last year. My current 9th grader took Algebra 2 at Woodson as an 8th grader.


If your child does not go to TJ, what is the plan for math during your DC's senior year?


Multivariable Calculus, Matrix algebra ... many other classes to choose from.

The point is to take AP Physics in junior year, which requires you to have a AP Calculus in 10th grade.

What I want to know is how parents get the school's approval to take two math classes in 7th grade (algebra and geometry)? We asked and the school said no, so we didn't bother. But some kids did get the approval. I wish the school would be more open and transparent about requirements to take two math classes at 7th grade.


Some issues here... before you try to force your poor kid into taking honors algebra and geometry together, the first year of middle school. Multi variable calculus & linear algebra are the two semesters of math after AP BC Calculus-- so you would take these in 11th if you took Calculus in 10th. You would then need to come up with an additional year of math after that for 12th grade. Also, in most places, AP Calculus BC is a co-requisite of AP physics, not a pre-requisite. So, you do not need to take Algebra II in 8th to take Physics your junior year. Also-- FCPS is very transparent-- they answer is no. They do not sign off on taking Algebra and Geometry concurrently in 7th. Some kids take Algebra early in 6th. Most take ruin the summer between 7th and 8th. Teachers at our MS Center very strongly discourage this because a good foundation in geometry is necessary for more advanced math, but are not able to stop parents from enrolling their kids in summer school.

Parents like the PP think this is what their kid needs to establish their TJ street cred. But, DC1's ES said at back to school night that TJ is pushing back against the trend to hyper accelerate math. They are getting too many kids who need remediation because they did geometry summer school, or started Algebra before they were ready. Kids who are interested in TJ should get a solid grounding in math fundamentals and Algebra I concepts, and this is much more important than Algebra II, or even Geometry. Interestingly, we also got the same message from DC2's TJ info session this year at Carson.

Apparently, the kids at Carson who were in Algebra II did not have better admissions chances than the Geometry students last year. It will be interesting to see if that holds this year. It maKe sense, since the TJ test is Algebra I and a little bit of Geometry only. It would be great to see TJ hold the line on this.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2015 17:49     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Frost sends kids next door to Woodson


Not anymore. They have enough to fill a class AT Frost.


This was not the case last year. My current 9th grader took Algebra 2 at Woodson as an 8th grader.


If your child does not go to TJ, what is the plan for math during your DC's senior year?


Multivariable Calculus, Matrix algebra ... many other classes to choose from.

The point is to take AP Physics in junior year, which requires you to have a AP Calculus in 10th grade.

What I want to know is how parents get the school's approval to take two math classes in 7th grade (algebra and geometry)? We asked and the school said no, so we didn't bother. But some kids did get the approval. I wish the school would be more open and transparent about requirements to take two math classes at 7th grade.


If you take Algebra Honors in 7th grade, you can get to Multivar and Matrix in your senior year. If you take it in 6th grade, you could take it junior year. Which leaves senior year with no math class an thus the question. You can't take AP Physics C until senior year, as you need Honors physics or AP Physics I junior year. Physics is not available prior to junior year. You can take AP Physics C and BC Calc at the same time. My DC did that just last year. Kids take Geometry in the summer to get in an additional math class (which costs a fair bit of change). I know of no school that allows both during Algebra and Geometry to be taken concurrently.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2015 14:57     Subject: Re:Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Most kids I know in Algebra 2 in 8th grade either took Algebra 1 as 6th graders or took Geometry during the summer between 7th and 8th.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2015 14:30     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Frost sends kids next door to Woodson


Not anymore. They have enough to fill a class AT Frost.


This was not the case last year. My current 9th grader took Algebra 2 at Woodson as an 8th grader.


If your child does not go to TJ, what is the plan for math during your DC's senior year?


Multivariable Calculus, Matrix algebra ... many other classes to choose from.

The point is to take AP Physics in junior year, which requires you to have a AP Calculus in 10th grade.

What I want to know is how parents get the school's approval to take two math classes in 7th grade (algebra and geometry)? We asked and the school said no, so we didn't bother. But some kids did get the approval. I wish the school would be more open and transparent about requirements to take two math classes at 7th grade.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2015 15:15     Subject: Re:Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Our child is advanced in math because he was ready and needed something more than was offered. She doesn't take math class anywhere except school. We have no interest in TJ but did want her to be learning something in class instead of just sitting there. Why is that so hard to understand?


I am asking this sincerely - I hope you don't take it as snark.
But a generation ago (ie, when we were in middle school), there were plenty of brilliant math people. I went to a very small very rigorous school. We had one student who took Algebra I in 8th grade. She went to MIT and is truly an off-the-charts kind of person. Another group of us took Algebra I in 8th grade.
I don't remember ever "just sitting there" in school, and I don't remember there being an epidemic of kids who were just SO advanced that they simply needed algebra in 6th grade.
So what changed?


The parents are more competitive.
Anonymous
Post 12/22/2015 14:26     Subject: Re:Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:Our child is advanced in math because he was ready and needed something more than was offered. She doesn't take math class anywhere except school. We have no interest in TJ but did want her to be learning something in class instead of just sitting there. Why is that so hard to understand?


I am asking this sincerely - I hope you don't take it as snark.
But a generation ago (ie, when we were in middle school), there were plenty of brilliant math people. I went to a very small very rigorous school. We had one student who took Algebra I in 8th grade. She went to MIT and is truly an off-the-charts kind of person. Another group of us took Algebra I in 8th grade.
I don't remember ever "just sitting there" in school, and I don't remember there being an epidemic of kids who were just SO advanced that they simply needed algebra in 6th grade.
So what changed?
Anonymous
Post 12/20/2015 11:39     Subject: Algebra 2 in 8th Grade
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Frost sends kids next door to Woodson


So they can get a taste of the pressure-cooker environment a year early. Super!


+100. Exploding chem labs. Suicide clusters. Not where I would want my MS student.