Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm an atheist. I'll happily grant that God made the universe if that keeps folks from going nuts over the something from nothing problem. But that gives absolutely no reason to think that the being that created quarks and galaxies is concerned with what I do on Sundays or who I marry.

Exactly. It always gives me a chuckle when people jump straight from "there is a Universe, therefore there was a creator," to "and He loves us so much He gave us his only begotten son".

Talk about your leaps of logic...

It's not a leap of logic. It is a consistent progression through the history of time and all of mankind, God's reaching out to us. A LOT happened between the creation of the universe and the coming of Jesus Christ.

are you ^^ that atheist who comes around here trying to make Christians look dumb? Not all believers in Jesus Christ are so naive and narrow-minded as the Christian depicted above. Some simply find comfort in the concept of a loving god who is with us on earth. These people don't demand that everyone share their beliefs and some of them are very sophisticated and well educated and don't deny science. They wouldn't use terminology like "tired, bitter atheist" to describe someone who doesn't share their concept of god.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:An interesting piece from the Post that makes the case that--aside from early church marketing materials--there's no evidence of an "historic Christ"...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2...ional-evidence-doesnt-hold-up/

link doesn't work

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That doesn't really make sense though. If you need God to exist to create the inverse out of nothing, what created God?

I grew up catholic too, even married someone else who grew up catholic, baptized our kids, but we are actually agnostic. Religion seems like a belief system created out of fear and certainty, because people didn't really understand science or the laws of physics or astronomy at the time. And people will always look for something to add meaning and deep dad to their lives. But it just seems like a lot of very wishful thinking when the simplest, most logical answer is that the universe (not some mysterious superpower) created itself, and that dead people are just dead and don't go to a special sky farm with angels and clouds.

God (at least the God of Christianity) always was and always will be. That cannot be understood but has to be accepted. That's what makes Him God.

Part of your problem, OP, is that you are trying to understand this with the limitations of the human mind in place. That is why I find Christianity so appealing. It is literally God coming to earth, with historical evidence that it happened. He came to us, in a form that we can understand.

Why can't the universe "always was and always will be"? Hiding behind our feeble human brains and saying that you simply have to have faith is not a good enough reason to believe in god.

OP, I don't believe simply because there is zero evidence to support his existence. And there's actually quite a lot of evidence to support the theory that man created god for a various good and bad reasons.

Because we know that it was not. Big Bang Theory or however it got here, science knows that the universe was "formed."

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm an atheist. I'll happily grant that God made the universe if that keeps folks from going nuts over the something from nothing problem. But that gives absolutely no reason to think that the being that created quarks and galaxies is concerned with what I do on Sundays or who I marry.

Exactly. It always gives me a chuckle when people jump straight from "there is a Universe, therefore there was a creator," to "and He loves us so much He gave us his only begotten son".

Talk about your leaps of logic...

It's not a leap of logic. It is a consistent progression through the history of time and all of mankind, God's reaching out to us. A LOT happened between the creation of the universe and the coming of Jesus Christ.

are you ^^ that atheist who comes around here trying to make Christians look dumb? Not all believers in Jesus Christ are so naive and narrow-minded as the Christian depicted above. Some simply find comfort in the concept of a loving god who is with us on earth. These people don't demand that everyone share their beliefs and some of them are very sophisticated and well educated and don't deny science. They wouldn't use terminology like "tired, bitter atheist" to describe someone who doesn't share their concept of god.

Anonymous wrote:An interesting piece from the Post that makes the case that--aside from early church marketing materials--there's no evidence of an "historic Christ"...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2...ional-evidence-doesnt-hold-up/

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm an atheist. I'll happily grant that God made the universe if that keeps folks from going nuts over the something from nothing problem. But that gives absolutely no reason to think that the being that created quarks and galaxies is concerned with what I do on Sundays or who I marry.

Exactly. It always gives me a chuckle when people jump straight from "there is a Universe, therefore there was a creator," to "and He loves us so much He gave us his only begotten son".

Talk about your leaps of logic...

It's not a leap of logic. It is a consistent progression through the history of time and all of mankind, God's reaching out to us. A LOT happened between the creation of the universe and the coming of Jesus Christ.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm an atheist. I'll happily grant that God made the universe if that keeps folks from going nuts over the something from nothing problem. But that gives absolutely no reason to think that the being that created quarks and galaxies is concerned with what I do on Sundays or who I marry.

Exactly. It always gives me a chuckle when people jump straight from "there is a Universe, therefore there was a creator," to "and He loves us so much He gave us his only begotten son".

Talk about your leaps of logic...

Anonymous wrote:I'm an atheist. I'll happily grant that God made the universe if that keeps folks from going nuts over the something from nothing problem. But that gives absolutely no reason to think that the being that created quarks and galaxies is concerned with what I do on Sundays or who I marry.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That doesn't really make sense though. If you need God to exist to create the inverse out of nothing, what created God?

I grew up catholic too, even married someone else who grew up catholic, baptized our kids, but we are actually agnostic. Religion seems like a belief system created out of fear and certainty, because people didn't really understand science or the laws of physics or astronomy at the time. And people will always look for something to add meaning and deep dad to their lives. But it just seems like a lot of very wishful thinking when the simplest, most logical answer is that the universe (not some mysterious superpower) created itself, and that dead people are just dead and don't go to a special sky farm with angels and clouds.

God (at least the God of Christianity) always was and always will be. That cannot be understood but has to be accepted. That's what makes Him God.

Part of your problem, OP, is that you are trying to understand this with the limitations of the human mind in place. That is why I find Christianity so appealing. It is literally God coming to earth, with historical evidence that it happened. He came to us, in a form that we can understand.

An interesting piece from the Post that makes the case that--aside from early church marketing materials--there's no evidence of an "historic Christ"...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/12/18/did-historical-jesus-exist-the-traditional-evidence-doesnt-hold-up/

How do you square that with the knowledge that there are billions and billions of stars and planets and surely other life on planets? When I became aware of that, it really made me think that our ideas of religion are very "me-centric" or "earth-centric" -- which just seems too convenient given the vastness of space and time. What are the chances that God just happened to come to THIS planet a few short years ago (short in the history of time)? And came here to save US! -- how lucky are we? Or maybe it's all just something we made up to make ourselves feel better along the way.... which seems more likely.

Religion seems so comforting and personal -- it naturally is going to arise in a population. But, given the science, I just can't go with the "we're special" ideas anymore.

And how do you know that God/ Jesus did not visit other planets, assuming that there is life there?

The evidence is pretty compelling that God / Jesus did visit other planets. Or at least as compelling as the evidence he / they visited the Earth.

Well, okay, no evidence.

There is much evidence that God did come to earth in the person of Jesus Christ.

I'm going to stop there, because I have a strong sense that this is the same tired, bitter atheist who makes his/ her way to this topic every time it appears on DCUM. We've heard from you before, we know your views and that you are not interested in changing them. Until you open your mind, you really should find a new hobby.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That doesn't really make sense though. If you need God to exist to create the inverse out of nothing, what created God?

I grew up catholic too, even married someone else who grew up catholic, baptized our kids, but we are actually agnostic. Religion seems like a belief system created out of fear and certainty, because people didn't really understand science or the laws of physics or astronomy at the time. And people will always look for something to add meaning and deep dad to their lives. But it just seems like a lot of very wishful thinking when the simplest, most logical answer is that the universe (not some mysterious superpower) created itself, and that dead people are just dead and don't go to a special sky farm with angels and clouds.

God (at least the God of Christianity) always was and always will be. That cannot be understood but has to be accepted. That's what makes Him God.

Part of your problem, OP, is that you are trying to understand this with the limitations of the human mind in place. That is why I find Christianity so appealing. It is literally God coming to earth, with historical evidence that it happened. He came to us, in a form that we can understand.

How do you square that with the knowledge that there are billions and billions of stars and planets and surely other life on planets? When I became aware of that, it really made me think that our ideas of religion are very "me-centric" or "earth-centric" -- which just seems too convenient given the vastness of space and time. What are the chances that God just happened to come to THIS planet a few short years ago (short in the history of time)? And came here to save US! -- how lucky are we? Or maybe it's all just something we made up to make ourselves feel better along the way.... which seems more likely.

Religion seems so comforting and personal -- it naturally is going to arise in a population. But, given the science, I just can't go with the "we're special" ideas anymore.

And how do you know that God/ Jesus did not visit other planets, assuming that there is life there?

The evidence is pretty compelling that God / Jesus did visit other planets. Or at least as compelling as the evidence he / they visited the Earth.

Well, okay, no evidence.

There is much evidence that God did come to earth in the person of Jesus Christ.

I'm going to stop there, because I have a strong sense that this is the same tired, bitter atheist who makes his/ her way to this topic every time it appears on DCUM. We've heard from you before, we know your views and that you are not interested in changing them. Until you open your mind, you really should find a new hobby.