Wow, where do guys live? I don't see girls wearing shorts like this in our neighborhood. Short, yes but no butts showing.

Anonymous wrote:

Again, be the parent. Don't allow your middle schooler to shop in adult clothing stores. Have them walk out of a dressing room and say "no way, I won't buy that for you." There are plenty of stores that have normal and modest clothing for this age. Shorts that show your ass is not the only option. You literally sound like a teen trying to rationalize with their mom why they should dress this way.

My daughter's clothing choices are none of your business. (I'm not the PP you were responding to.) My son's aren't either, but somehow the annual spring clothing panic on DCUM is always only ever about girls.

Of all the things we dealt with in middle school, DD's shorts did not make the list. But I was thankful to the school admin for having dress code violators resort to wearing ill-fitting, unwashed PE clothes culled from the school's lost and found.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When the shorts available at stores are the short shorts, it's what the people buying them are going to wear. Perhaps you could petition clothing designers to make shorts with longer inseams. While you're at it, please alert clothing designers that girls and women would like to be able to purchase clothing that includes pockets.

In the meantime, my daughter will do her best to buy clothes that she finds comfortable and flattering. If they don't meet your standards, take it up with the clothing designers and the adults who are setting the examples our children are following.

Seriously??? You are blaming the clothing line manufacturers for your daughter wearing shorts that show her ass? What a lame cop out. Just say "I have no control over what my daughter buys or wears, nor do I care."

My daughter wears skater fashions, her ass doesn't show. She is a fringe kid, the majority of her friends do not wear skater fashions. And I just lucked out on this, my kid happened to latch onto a fashion that's modest, even if it's not pretty. She won't get dinged for showing her ass, she'll get dinged for dressing too messy/casual.

I completely understand why her friends wear short shorts. It's because it's what's at the store. It's what they see the stylish people they want to emulate wearing. They are what is to be found in stores. If adults do not want middle schoolers wearing revealing clothes, then don't design revealing clothes for middle schoolers, do not wear revealing clothes as the height of fashion, do not stock revealing clothes in stores. There are many many steps before we reach the "middle schooler picks out a pair of short shorts to purchase." Police those steps.

Shall we discuss how even in children's clothes - clothes designed for 4 and 5 year olds - the girls versions are cut to be much more body hugging and revealing than the boys versions? Shall we discuss how we reach the point where our 12 year olds think body hugging leggings are appropriate and fashionable coverage? Middle schoolers do not wake up one day and decide they like clothing with miniscule inseams and cleavage enhancing bras. They are trained into this from day one. How about we start there, where the problem lies - with the adults - rather than trying to shame middle schoolers who are doing their best to find clothing that is fashionable and attractive.

Again, be the parent. Don't allow your middle schooler to shop in adult clothing stores. Have them walk out of a dressing room and say "no way, I won't buy that for you." There are plenty of stores that have normal and modest clothing for this age. Shorts that show your ass is not the only option. You literally sound like a teen trying to rationalize with their mom why they should dress this way.

Anonymous wrote:
Honest question... could you please help me understand why those kinds of clothes are a problem? Thanks!

I get that certain places have rules, and while I disagree in some ways with most dress codes I can acknowledge that I think they should almost always be followed, but I don't actually understand why any sort of clothing is specifically bad.

I guess I'm rather clueless, or at least not mainstream in my views.

This is my understanding of why it's an issue. There are areas of the body that we consider private, personal. For boys and girls, the genitals and the buttocks, and for girls the chest. Adults expose or accentuate these areas when trying to attract other adults. They will wear revealing, close cut clothing. If a child wears clothing that mimics that sexual enhancement, we read it as "wrong" because we're reading it as a child doing something to sexually enhance themselves. Those of us who don't see this as a particular issue understand that a young child wearing a triangle-cut bikini is not sexually enhancing herself because there is nothing to sexually enhance - she is a child. Those who view it as a girl's/woman's responsibility to cater to the male gaze see the girl as doing something wrong because she's trying to sexually enhance herself.

Short shorts can make other people uncomfortable because they can reveal areas that we consider sexually important. The emphasis is placed on the girl to not make others feel uncomfortable, so that adults don't have to consider why they're viewing 11-13 year old children as sexual objects.

10:33 again...To clarify, I totally agree it's a problem that that sort of clothing is frequently nearly the ONLY option marketed to our girls... people who want to dress in a way less revealing of their body should definitely have an easier time finding decent options. The message shouldn't be that one's body needs to be emphasized in order to dress well as a female. But my specific question is, why the idea that the existence of that sort of clothing for people who like it is objectionable.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When the shorts available at stores are the short shorts, it's what the people buying them are going to wear. Perhaps you could petition clothing designers to make shorts with longer inseams. While you're at it, please alert clothing designers that girls and women would like to be able to purchase clothing that includes pockets.

In the meantime, my daughter will do her best to buy clothes that she finds comfortable and flattering. If they don't meet your standards, take it up with the clothing designers and the adults who are setting the examples our children are following.

Seriously??? You are blaming the clothing line manufacturers for your daughter wearing shorts that show her ass? What a lame cop out. Just say "I have no control over what my daughter buys or wears, nor do I care."

My daughter wears skater fashions, her ass doesn't show. She is a fringe kid, the majority of her friends do not wear skater fashions. And I just lucked out on this, my kid happened to latch onto a fashion that's modest, even if it's not pretty. She won't get dinged for showing her ass, she'll get dinged for dressing too messy/casual.

I completely understand why her friends wear short shorts. It's because it's what's at the store. It's what they see the stylish people they want to emulate wearing. They are what is to be found in stores. If adults do not want middle schoolers wearing revealing clothes, then don't design revealing clothes for middle schoolers, do not wear revealing clothes as the height of fashion, do not stock revealing clothes in stores. There are many many steps before we reach the "middle schooler picks out a pair of short shorts to purchase." Police those steps.

Shall we discuss how even in children's clothes - clothes designed for 4 and 5 year olds - the girls versions are cut to be much more body hugging and revealing than the boys versions? Shall we discuss how we reach the point where our 12 year olds think body hugging leggings are appropriate and fashionable coverage? Middle schoolers do not wake up one day and decide they like clothing with miniscule inseams and cleavage enhancing bras. They are trained into this from day one. How about we start there, where the problem lies - with the adults - rather than trying to shame middle schoolers who are doing their best to find clothing that is fashionable and attractive.

Honest question... could you please help me understand why those kinds of clothes are a problem? Thanks!

I get that certain places have rules, and while I disagree in some ways with most dress codes I can acknowledge that I think they should almost always be followed, but I don't actually understand why any sort of clothing is specifically bad.

I guess I'm rather clueless, or at least not mainstream in my views.

Anonymous wrote:When the shorts available at stores are the short shorts, it's what the people buying them are going to wear. Perhaps you could petition clothing designers to make shorts with longer inseams. While you're at it, please alert clothing designers that girls and women would like to be able to purchase clothing that includes pockets.

In the meantime, my daughter will do her best to buy clothes that she finds comfortable and flattering. If they don't meet your standards, take it up with the clothing designers and the adults who are setting the examples our children are following.

It's not that. "Short shorts" are allowed in most public schools, the one I work in included. It's really only a problem when the rear ends are hanging out. There are plenty of fashionable shorts with inseams long enough to cover up the rear, even by just a bit.

Why is anyone else's clothing relevant to you unless it's proclaiming a slur or offensive hurtful message?

There's nothing objectively wrong with more revealing clothing. If you disagree with that, could you please help me understand why? I don't get it. Literally the only thing clothes say about a person is what they felt comfortable and happy wearing at one specific moment in time. I don't see clothes as communicating anything about a person's character, unless the clothing has some sort of written or graphic message with which the wearer can be presumed to agree.

I guess I don't see people's bodies as inherently shameful, something to keep any more hidden or private than the person wants, specifically provocative, inherently sexual, or anything that makes sense to object to. They're just bodies, and I'm fine with almost any clothing choice anyone feels most comfortable in. I do acknowledge, however, and teach my children, that this viewpoint is in the minority and that most people consider clothing to be important, so some clothing choices will result in judgment and maybe not convey the impression one might want, so it's probably worth at least considering what others may think and deciding if it's relevant to the decision to wear something.

I personally tell my children that it's almost always most appropriate to follow non-harmful rules in life, and that school is an environment where people are generally expected to dress without being very revealing of their bodies, but I don't think there's objectively anything wrong with kids who dress otherwise.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When the shorts available at stores are the short shorts, it's what the people buying them are going to wear. Perhaps you could petition clothing designers to make shorts with longer inseams. While you're at it, please alert clothing designers that girls and women would like to be able to purchase clothing that includes pockets.

In the meantime, my daughter will do her best to buy clothes that she finds comfortable and flattering. If they don't meet your standards, take it up with the clothing designers and the adults who are setting the examples our children are following.

Seriously??? You are blaming the clothing line manufacturers for your daughter wearing shorts that show her ass? What a lame cop out. Just say "I have no control over what my daughter buys or wears, nor do I care."

My daughter wears skater fashions, her ass doesn't show. She is a fringe kid, the majority of her friends do not wear skater fashions. And I just lucked out on this, my kid happened to latch onto a fashion that's modest, even if it's not pretty. She won't get dinged for showing her ass, she'll get dinged for dressing too messy/casual.

I completely understand why her friends wear short shorts. It's because it's what's at the store. It's what they see the stylish people they want to emulate wearing. They are what is to be found in stores. If adults do not want middle schoolers wearing revealing clothes, then don't design revealing clothes for middle schoolers, do not wear revealing clothes as the height of fashion, do not stock revealing clothes in stores. There are many many steps before we reach the "middle schooler picks out a pair of short shorts to purchase." Police those steps.

Shall we discuss how even in children's clothes - clothes designed for 4 and 5 year olds - the girls versions are cut to be much more body hugging and revealing than the boys versions? Shall we discuss how we reach the point where our 12 year olds think body hugging leggings are appropriate and fashionable coverage? Middle schoolers do not wake up one day and decide they like clothing with miniscule inseams and cleavage enhancing bras. They are trained into this from day one. How about we start there, where the problem lies - with the adults - rather than trying to shame middle schoolers who are doing their best to find clothing that is fashionable and attractive.

Anonymous wrote:Oh, I see. It's time for the annual "girls these days wear scandalous clothes!" thread.

PP, yes, it is. These are trashy things to wear for a number of reasons.

Anonymous wrote:Starting in on the slut shaming there a wee early, don't you think, OP?

You sound like a pervert already.

I think it's fine to ask ALL middle school children to refrain from short shorts, or leggings, or.... I object to singling girls out for more clothing policing than boys.

Anonymous wrote:When the shorts available at stores are the short shorts, it's what the people buying them are going to wear. Perhaps you could petition clothing designers to make shorts with longer inseams. While you're at it, please alert clothing designers that girls and women would like to be able to purchase clothing that includes pockets.

In the meantime, my daughter will do her best to buy clothes that she finds comfortable and flattering. If they don't meet your standards, take it up with the clothing designers and the adults who are setting the examples our children are following.

Seriously??? You are blaming the clothing line manufacturers for your daughter wearing shorts that show her ass? What a lame cop out. Just say "I have no control over what my daughter buys or wears, nor do I care."

When the shorts available at stores are the short shorts, it's what the people buying them are going to wear. Perhaps you could petition clothing designers to make shorts with longer inseams. While you're at it, please alert clothing designers that girls and women would like to be able to purchase clothing that includes pockets.

In the meantime, my daughter will do her best to buy clothes that she finds comfortable and flattering. If they don't meet your standards, take it up with the clothing designers and the adults who are setting the examples our children are following.