Anonymous wrote:NP here. For the most part, I agree with most of the others here saying that OP should essentially be content with her healthy embryos and leave it at that (though I do also see the other side). But for those you of you talking about the ethical slippery slope and the repercussions in countries with infanticide problems like China and India -- do you really think enabling those parents to choose the sex of their children is ethically worse than those who ultimately kill or abandon their baby girls?

No not the same. But the point is opening the door to gender selection is opening the door to gender selection for those without infertility---which does happen--- http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2601563/I-love-girls-Joe-Francis-girlfriend-IVF-pick-sex-twins.html. So once you open that door, you end up on the slippery slope of gender selection for vanity...which could easily become used in place of infanticide. And then what else do people select for?

Without denying OP's right to do this--I've posted many times above to say I am not saying OP should not, or that I might not---we have to admit these are tough ethical questions and we hope doctors proceed carefully here. And I don't think there is anything inconsistent with having infertility--a medical condition--and wanting AFT to remain medically focused.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I'm not sure what having male versus female infertility has anything to do with it.

You clearly want what you want. However, you chose to use a clinic and they get to make choices too about their ethical path.

You aren't a very sympathetic character I'm afraid and I doubt you're going to get much support here for what comes across as whining.

I don't think she was looking for support. She was looking for names of clinics that do the procedure she is interested in.

Ok. Valid point.

NP here. For the most part, I agree with most of the others here saying that OP should essentially be content with her healthy embryos and leave it at that (though I do also see the other side). But for those you of you talking about the ethical slippery slope and the repercussions in countries with infanticide problems like China and India -- do you really think enabling those parents to choose the sex of their children is ethically worse than those who ultimately kill or abandon their baby girls?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes this brave new world scares the crap out of me. You have 9 potential people on ice, and you want a scientist to tell you which one will be the most likely to turn out to be your perfect kid. I know OP is only talking about choosing the embryo with no obvious chromosomal defects and a specific gender, but what if all her embryos meet that test? Then does she test for other attributes (when that's possible)? Blonde hair, blue eyes, no cancer markers, no gay gene?

OP, I get that you'd like your second child to be a certain gender. But truly, can't you live with the odds like the rest of us?

It takes a lot of nerve to say that on an infertility forum.

Holy crap, I had the same reaction. As if this isn't a group of people who have landed so squarely on the shitty side of the odds already. Piss off.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I was able to choose sex at GW. I have posted this experience before. I had multiple miscarriages and did PGS testing to attempt to have a second child. As a side benefit, I was given the opportunity to choose the sex when I had normal embryos of both sexes. No one acted like it was a big deal and I didn't think it was a big deal at the time. I have zero regret or guilt over doing this and I have not wasted one second worrying about the ethics of the matter. I went through hell and back to have my kids and this was one very small cherry on top of a massive shit pie. I don't feel bad about it in the least given my circumstances.

Good luck OP.

I should have been clear that GW did not do this just so that I could choose sex. They just did not withhold the information once the testing was completed. I don't know their position on doing PGS just to know the sex.

That's great to hear. Thank you. Of course, this wouldn't be just for the sex. This would be for a full karyotype, including gender. Did you test fresh or frozen? If frozen, did they all survive the defrost/biopsy/refreeze/defrost?

I tested fresh 5-day embryos and then the embryos were frozen, results came in, I did a frozen cycle to transfer 1. BFP.

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes this brave new world scares the crap out of me. You have 9 potential people on ice, and you want a scientist to tell you which one will be the most likely to turn out to be your perfect kid. I know OP is only talking about choosing the embryo with no obvious chromosomal defects and a specific gender, but what if all her embryos meet that test? Then does she test for other attributes (when that's possible)? Blonde hair, blue eyes, no cancer markers, no gay gene?

OP, I get that you'd like your second child to be a certain gender. But truly, can't you live with the odds like the rest of us?

OP here. This would be the third, not second child. And the answer to your question is that if more than one embryos turn out to be chromosomally normal and of the wanted sex, then one needs to remember that this in no way guarantees either implantation or successful pregnancy carried to term. Then we would just go through the preferred sex first, and if none works, go to the other ones.

The idea of nine potential people on ice scares me too. Sometimes I wish we just had two or three, and then none of that hand-wringing (and a big fat PGS check!) would have been necessary.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I was able to choose sex at GW. I have posted this experience before. I had multiple miscarriages and did PGS testing to attempt to have a second child. As a side benefit, I was given the opportunity to choose the sex when I had normal embryos of both sexes. No one acted like it was a big deal and I didn't think it was a big deal at the time. I have zero regret or guilt over doing this and I have not wasted one second worrying about the ethics of the matter. I went through hell and back to have my kids and this was one very small cherry on top of a massive shit pie. I don't feel bad about it in the least given my circumstances.

Good luck OP.

I should have been clear that GW did not do this just so that I could choose sex. They just did not withhold the information once the testing was completed. I don't know their position on doing PGS just to know the sex.

That's great to hear. Thank you. Of course, this wouldn't be just for the sex. This would be for a full karyotype, including gender. Did you test fresh or frozen? If frozen, did they all survive the defrost/biopsy/refreeze/defrost?

I'm the one who did the thaw/biopsy/refreeze/thaw at an out-of-state clinic. They told me to expect 1-2% loss on the first thaw. They expected the loss to be less on the second thaw, because those embryos were presumably heartier. I don't know the final numbers, though.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I was able to choose sex at GW. I have posted this experience before. I had multiple miscarriages and did PGS testing to attempt to have a second child. As a side benefit, I was given the opportunity to choose the sex when I had normal embryos of both sexes. No one acted like it was a big deal and I didn't think it was a big deal at the time. I have zero regret or guilt over doing this and I have not wasted one second worrying about the ethics of the matter. I went through hell and back to have my kids and this was one very small cherry on top of a massive shit pie. I don't feel bad about it in the least given my circumstances.

Good luck OP.

I should have been clear that GW did not do this just so that I could choose sex. They just did not withhold the information once the testing was completed. I don't know their position on doing PGS just to know the sex.

That's great to hear. Thank you. Of course, this wouldn't be just for the sex. This would be for a full karyotype, including gender. Did you test fresh or frozen? If frozen, did they all survive the defrost/biopsy/refreeze/defrost?

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes this brave new world scares the crap out of me. You have 9 potential people on ice, and you want a scientist to tell you which one will be the most likely to turn out to be your perfect kid. I know OP is only talking about choosing the embryo with no obvious chromosomal defects and a specific gender, but what if all her embryos meet that test? Then does she test for other attributes (when that's possible)? Blonde hair, blue eyes, no cancer markers, no gay gene?

OP, I get that you'd like your second child to be a certain gender. But truly, can't you live with the odds like the rest of us?

It takes a lot of nerve to say that on an infertility forum.

Anonymous wrote:OP, I was able to choose sex at GW. I have posted this experience before. I had multiple miscarriages and did PGS testing to attempt to have a second child. As a side benefit, I was given the opportunity to choose the sex when I had normal embryos of both sexes. No one acted like it was a big deal and I didn't think it was a big deal at the time. I have zero regret or guilt over doing this and I have not wasted one second worrying about the ethics of the matter. I went through hell and back to have my kids and this was one very small cherry on top of a massive shit pie. I don't feel bad about it in the least given my circumstances.

Good luck OP.

I should have been clear that GW did not do this just so that I could choose sex. They just did not withhold the information once the testing was completed. I don't know their position on doing PGS just to know the sex.

OP, I was able to choose sex at GW. I have posted this experience before. I had multiple miscarriages and did PGS testing to attempt to have a second child. As a side benefit, I was given the opportunity to choose the sex when I had normal embryos of both sexes. No one acted like it was a big deal and I didn't think it was a big deal at the time. I have zero regret or guilt over doing this and I have not wasted one second worrying about the ethics of the matter. I went through hell and back to have my kids and this was one very small cherry on top of a massive shit pie. I don't feel bad about it in the least given my circumstances.

Good luck OP.

Sometimes this brave new world scares the crap out of me. You have 9 potential people on ice, and you want a scientist to tell you which one will be the most likely to turn out to be your perfect kid. I know OP is only talking about choosing the embryo with no obvious chromosomal defects and a specific gender, but what if all her embryos meet that test? Then does she test for other attributes (when that's possible)? Blonde hair, blue eyes, no cancer markers, no gay gene?

OP, I get that you'd like your second child to be a certain gender. But truly, can't you live with the odds like the rest of us?

Anonymous wrote:OP, I'm not sure what having male versus female infertility has anything to do with it.

You clearly want what you want. However, you chose to use a clinic and they get to make choices too about their ethical path.

You aren't a very sympathetic character I'm afraid and I doubt you're going to get much support here for what comes across as whining.

I don't think she was looking for support. She was looking for names of clinics that do the procedure she is interested in.

OP, I'm not sure what having male versus female infertility has anything to do with it.

You clearly want what you want. However, you chose to use a clinic and they get to make choices too about their ethical path.

You aren't a very sympathetic character I'm afraid and I doubt you're going to get much support here for what comes across as whining.

Anonymous wrote:

OP here. I understand that you are looking at this from your own angle, but things are different for us. If we use these embryos at all (it's not a given), we'd use only one out of nine. Why shouldn't we be allowed to decide which one, out of the healthy ones, we choose, assuming there are several? One of them will get chosen based on certain conditions, it's not a random pick. So why shouldn't we be allowed to pick one based on conditions that are important to us?

OP. Part of typical allele screening including figuring out the gender. The reports from the labs include whether it's an XX or XY as some abnormalities link to the Y chromosomes, only. So when it's all said and done, let's say you have 9 genetically normal embryos that are recommended for transfer, then you can say which ones you want. But you likely cannot just ask for gender screening/testing.

OP here. Yes. I understand that. We would want to do a full-on genetic testing on all nine to identify the ones that are chromosomally normal. Assuming there are more than one (and I believe there WILL be more than one), we would want to choose the gender of the chromosomally normal embryo to transfer.

Look, I understand the sensitivities around this. The pain of infertility is real. But you have to remember that infertility comes in many variations; it isn't always up to the woman. My DH has multiple sclerosis and cannot, so to speak, deliver the payload. With me being 40, we thought IVF was our only option. We were very surprised when we ended up with a ton of eggs and ton of embryos on our first try. We implanted two best-looking ones without any testing, and one took, and turned out to be chromosomally normal. We had no idea that so many of them will survive to day 6 and be good enough to freeze. So the fact of the matter is that we already have (or will have shortly, knock on wood) two children, one of each gender, and if we go for a third, I'd like to have a hand in deciding which one of the nine will have a shot. If we had only two or three embryos on the shelf, this wouldn't occur to me, then it would be "what happens, happens". But we have nine. Only one will have a shot, and we will have to pick it, because no one else is entitled to this decision. Now I understand that being chromosomally normal is in no way a guarantee of implantation or successful pregnancy. That's a given. But all things being equal, all I'm saying is we want to decide who gets the chance first, so to speak. And I wish the clinics wouldn't make it so difficult for people in our situation.