Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 17:51     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
I don't believe OP's story. Her first post is about fearing for her kid's safety from blizzard driving. Now, the ex kills in order to avoid child support and she was once in fear of of him killing here upon learning she was pregnant.

Yet, he apparently has unsupervised visits with his kid.

It just doesn't add up.
Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 16:28     Subject: Re:Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:This post can't be real. If so, seek therapy IMMEDIATELY. Do not pass GO. Do NOT collect $200!


Or child support.

I can't believe someone would even ask this! What the hell would he be paying support for if the child is no longer there to support?


Look I was just looking for away to minimize his incentive to hurt our child.
There are plenty of stories of men who have killed their kids, the pregnant mother etc... to avoid support. Ray Curreth and Scott Peterson come to mind...


If you truly believe he is capable of hurting your child then you need to go back to court and fight for supervised visitation.

Trying to write in a clause where he pays support even in the event that the child dies is ridiculous and just makes you seem incredibly petty. Fight for the safety of your child if that's your concern.

Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 15:47     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:I understand your concern, OP and I sympathize with you. But one questions keeps coming up for me. Did you have a child with him AFTER his other child died? If so, there must have been a time that you didn't think the drowning was his fault. What has changed since that time.

Every once in a while, I worry that my ex will kill me to avoid paying alimony. I think that my son is safe with him, though (child support ends in a couple of years). I have told my family that if I die, they should definitely be suspicious. LOL


No. My kid was here first. Although for a brief moment when we first learned I was pregnant and the timing wasn't right I thought he might kill me. But that was a brief moment. I must say I have never dated anyone else that scared me.
Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 15:44     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:OP, I really don't understand what relief / remedy you are trying to seek by asking this on this board.

If you are truly concerned, the only people you should be directing this to (and likely already should have directed to already) is the police, your lawyer, And any family court appointed aides you are in contact with.

If this is such a VALID concern as you maintain, you have the right to explain your side of things and request supervised visits. Or no shared custody.

I'm not sure why you're more worried about financial benefit vs. your child's life. If I was that worried, I'd be sure that ex would be charged with criminal negligence or worse if something happened, not just about the dollars he may gain.

So talk to the authorities if there is any truth to this.

And maybe get some help for yourself otherwise. You sound like your priorities are a little mixed up.


Of course if something happens I would try to make sure he went to jail. Here I am trying to discourage anything from happening. What of my posts makes you think it would be one or the other?
Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 12:11     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
OP, I really don't understand what relief / remedy you are trying to seek by asking this on this board.

If you are truly concerned, the only people you should be directing this to (and likely already should have directed to already) is the police, your lawyer, And any family court appointed aides you are in contact with.

If this is such a VALID concern as you maintain, you have the right to explain your side of things and request supervised visits. Or no shared custody.

I'm not sure why you're more worried about financial benefit vs. your child's life. If I was that worried, I'd be sure that ex would be charged with criminal negligence or worse if something happened, not just about the dollars he may gain.

So talk to the authorities if there is any truth to this.

And maybe get some help for yourself otherwise. You sound like your priorities are a little mixed up.
Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 11:01     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:As with the snow driving ex my ex makes questionable safety decisions with our child. Think definite blizzard driving or placing toddler in recalled recreational vehicle only 2 examples - there is more. I am powerless to stop this but is there anything I can put in our agreement that if our child is injury or killed in his care he would still have to pay support? I would have it go to a non-profit for child abuse or a legal pro se help office etc... Not to me
But I want him on notice that it is no financial benefit to him if our child is hurt.


Run, do not walk, to the closest psychiatrist. You need professional help and fast. This qualifies as the nuttiest question ever asked on DCUM and that's saying something.
Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 10:39     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
I understand your concern, OP and I sympathize with you. But one questions keeps coming up for me. Did you have a child with him AFTER his other child died? If so, there must have been a time that you didn't think the drowning was his fault. What has changed since that time.

Every once in a while, I worry that my ex will kill me to avoid paying alimony. I think that my son is safe with him, though (child support ends in a couple of years). I have told my family that if I die, they should definitely be suspicious. LOL
Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 10:02     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Agree with another poster, if you are truly concerned about your child's life being in danger, offer to give up all child support for reduced and supervised visitation.


That's not the way it works. He's not being ordered to pay to see his child.

If he doesn't want to care for the child, why is he asking for shared custody? How old is your child?


It of spite. And/or to be mean to our kid to hurt me.
Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 10:01     Subject: Re:Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:This post can't be real. If so, seek therapy IMMEDIATELY. Do not pass GO. Do NOT collect $200!


Or child support.

I can't believe someone would even ask this! What the hell would he be paying support for if the child is no longer there to support?


Look I was just looking for away to minimize his incentive to hurt our child.
There are plenty of stories of men who have killed their kids, the pregnant mother etc... to avoid support. Ray Curreth and Scott Peterson come to mind...
Anonymous
Post 01/25/2015 10:01     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:Agree with another poster, if you are truly concerned about your child's life being in danger, offer to give up all child support for reduced and supervised visitation.


That's not the way it works. He's not being ordered to pay to see his child.

If he doesn't want to care for the child, why is he asking for shared custody? How old is your child?
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2015 23:40     Subject: Re:Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:This post can't be real. If so, seek therapy IMMEDIATELY. Do not pass GO. Do NOT collect $200!


Or child support.

I can't believe someone would even ask this! What the hell would he be paying support for if the child is no longer there to support?
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2015 23:08     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Agree with another poster, if you are truly concerned about your child's life being in danger, offer to give up all child support for reduced and supervised visitation.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2015 12:35     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
If he'll respond to potential ramifications, then use that leverage for all it's worth. My strong recommendation: consult with a professional who has expertise in mediating family issues when one of the parents is (apparently) exhibiting some antisocial tendencies. You might be able to pinpoint additional leverage you're not currently seeing. Whatever it takes to protect your child. Best of luck to you.
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2015 09:42     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:As with the snow driving ex my ex makes questionable safety decisions with our child. Think definite blizzard driving or placing toddler in recalled recreational vehicle only 2 examples - there is more. I am powerless to stop this but is there anything I can put in our agreement that if our child is injury or killed in his care he would still have to pay support? I would have it go to a non-profit for child abuse or a legal pro se help office etc... Not to me
But I want him on notice that it is no financial benefit to him if our child is hurt.


OP, seriously, you need to see a therapist. No, there is no way to write this language into your support agreement. If he is negligent and your child is killed, he could face criminal negligence charges.

If you have examples of serious risk of endangerment, you can call Child Protective Services or petition the court to allow him to have only supervised visitation. But the two examples you cite are not at all at the level of risk that an agency will entertain.


There are more examples. He's already had 1 child. Accidentally die. So again I ask anything?


Do you think he killed the child so he wouldn't have to pay child support? Was he sad that the child died?

Otherwise, I don't see how your reasoning will work. I understand that it must be scary to send your child off for visitation with someone you don't trust, but what you're implying here goes beyond "careless".


Yes. No to the second question. Ambivalent at the death. Still is. But bought a new car not soon after.


NP here. Wait a sec. To be clear, you think he killed the child to avoid paying child support? Because elsewhere you said he didn't even notice the child left the house. That is certainly careless, maybe even reckless depending on the circumstances, but if you're suggesting he intentionally allowed a child to walk into a swimming pool and drown, with the goal of avoiding child support payments, that is a different ballgame. It's a different UNIVERSE. So which is it?


Yes. His reckless behavior lead to the death. But he wasn't too concerned. Because it was a burden he no longer had. So not criminally responsible but I am not focused on putting him in jail. I just don't want our child to be next. He got away with an accident once.


You're still saying inconsistent things. In your opinion, was it an accident or was it intentional? Those are opposites, and mutually exclusive. It can't be both.


I think the OP is being consistent and clear. OP: your best option seems to be giving up support in exchange for full custody. Is that possible? That's what I'd do. Your ex doesn't sound well. If I were you, I'd be worried, too.



Thank you. I don't think that is possible in our jurisdiction. It sounds like there is no language to put him on notice. I think my family and I can impress upon him the potential ramifications if this child is in anyway injured. I just wish there was away to put it to paper because I think that would scare him off entirely.
Everybody believes the other woman is crazy . After seeing him in action if she is crazy he made her that way.
Thank you all for your input
Anonymous
Post 01/24/2015 09:37     Subject: Risking kids life custody agreement language.
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:As with the snow driving ex my ex makes questionable safety decisions with our child. Think definite blizzard driving or placing toddler in recalled recreational vehicle only 2 examples - there is more. I am powerless to stop this but is there anything I can put in our agreement that if our child is injury or killed in his care he would still have to pay support? I would have it go to a non-profit for child abuse or a legal pro se help office etc... Not to me
But I want him on notice that it is no financial benefit to him if our child is hurt.


OP, seriously, you need to see a therapist. No, there is no way to write this language into your support agreement. If he is negligent and your child is killed, he could face criminal negligence charges.

If you have examples of serious risk of endangerment, you can call Child Protective Services or petition the court to allow him to have only supervised visitation. But the two examples you cite are not at all at the level of risk that an agency will entertain.


There are more examples. He's already had 1 child. Accidentally die. So again I ask anything?


Thank you. I don't think that is possible in our jurisdiction. It sounds like there is no language to put him on notice. I think my family and I can impress upon him the potential ramifications if this child is in anyway injured. I just wish there was away to put it to paper because I think that would scare him off entirely.
Everybody believes the other woman is crazy . After seeing him in action if she is crazy he made her that way.
Thank you all for your input.

Do you think he killed the child so he wouldn't have to pay child support? Was he sad that the child died?

Otherwise, I don't see how your reasoning will work. I understand that it must be scary to send your child off for visitation with someone you don't trust, but what you're implying here goes beyond "careless".


Yes. No to the second question. Ambivalent at the death. Still is. But bought a new car not soon after.


NP here. Wait a sec. To be clear, you think he killed the child to avoid paying child support? Because elsewhere you said he didn't even notice the child left the house. That is certainly careless, maybe even reckless depending on the circumstances, but if you're suggesting he intentionally allowed a child to walk into a swimming pool and drown, with the goal of avoiding child support payments, that is a different ballgame. It's a different UNIVERSE. So which is it?


Yes. His reckless behavior lead to the death. But he wasn't too concerned. Because it was a burden he no longer had. So not criminally responsible but I am not focused on putting him in jail. I just don't want our child to be next. He got away with an accident once.


You're still saying inconsistent things. In your opinion, was it an accident or was it intentional? Those are opposites, and mutually exclusive. It can't be both.


I think the OP is being consistent and clear. OP: your best option seems to be giving up support in exchange for full custody. Is that possible? That's what I'd do. Your ex doesn't sound well. If I were you, I'd be worried, too.