Anonymous
01/01/2015 11:37
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:
sad, I know
I have a good friend in that area and another friend who sent her child to the private school.
I can't see how this move would benefit any of the stakeholders. Alternative Programs educates some challenging kids who need space and quite a few resources to assist them academically and emotionally. The building itself isn't set up to house potentially hundreds of kids (currently there are about 120 enrolled) in middle and high school.
Furthermore, while we don't like using NIMBY, this move will indeed affect property values. I certainly wouldn't want to live in an area near an alternative setting. These are students with severe emotional issues who either were asked to leave their traditional setting or who were PLACED there by the system itself. They arrive from all over the county. So imagine the number of buses pulling in and out each day. It's not as though those streets are wide enough to accommodate the buses.
I find it odd that the system spent hundreds of thousands renovating the Ewing building during Alt Program's redesign only to send the kids off to another setting that doesn't have the capacity to house the students and faculty. Something isn't quite right.
I hope the neighborhood can fight it.
If MCPS had "space" in Bethesda or Potomac, it certainly wouldn't be used to house Alternative Programs!
much luck to the community in fighting such a disastrous move
Your facts aren't right, in this case. The Washington Post article says that school officials said that the English Manor building would be renovated and expanded with $16.6 million in previously approved funding.
Also, this is school-owned property, currently being used as a school, which would continue to be used as a school. People might not want to live next to the alternative-education school, but you really shouldn't tell the school district that they can't use their own property for a school because you might get less money when you sell your house.
MCPS will obviously have to figure out a plan for getting the buses in and out, and if I were MCPS, I would certainly ask for neighborhood input on that.
(No, I don't live in Bethesda or Potomac. However, for what it's worth, MCPS was recently proposing to put a bus depot on MCPS property on Brickyard in Potomac. The Brickyard neighbors fought off the proposed soccer fields, which were the result of a shady process, but I don't have much sympathy for their idea that they get to tell MCPS what to do with MCPS property.)
Anonymous
01/01/2015 11:21
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Moving Alt Programs to Aspen Hill will kill that community on so many levels.
The county spent quite a bit renovating Ewing Center during Alt's redesign, only to move the school to what was once an elementary school in Aspen Hill.
bad move
Unfortunately the community associations (Aspen Hill Civic Association and the AH Homeowners Group) were NOT made aware of the plans until late in the process. There's a website currently discussing the issue: http://www.saveenglishmanor.org/
There is actually a charter school (School for Tomorrow - http://www.sftedu.org/our-school/) currently renting out that building and they were not made aware of the plans either.
sad, I know
I have a good friend in that area and another friend who sent her child to the private school.
I can't see how this move would benefit any of the stakeholders. Alternative Programs educates some challenging kids who need space and quite a few resources to assist them academically and emotionally. The building itself isn't set up to house potentially hundreds of kids (currently there are about 120 enrolled) in middle and high school.
Furthermore, while we don't like using NIMBY, this move will indeed affect property values. I certainly wouldn't want to live in an area near an alternative setting. These are students with severe emotional issues who either were asked to leave their traditional setting or who were PLACED there by the system itself. They arrive from all over the county. So imagine the number of buses pulling in and out each day. It's not as though those streets are wide enough to accommodate the buses.
I find it odd that the system spent hundreds of thousands renovating the Ewing building during Alt Program's redesign only to send the kids off to another setting that doesn't have the capacity to house the students and faculty. Something isn't quite right.
I hope the neighborhood can fight it.
If MCPS had "space" in Bethesda or Potomac, it certainly wouldn't be used to house Alternative Programs!
much luck to the community in fighting such a disastrous move
Anonymous
12/31/2014 14:38
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
I think the new development at Shady Grove is North of Redland so it will not be RM..Gaithersburg or Rockville I think.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 14:28
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
If you think that the criteria are bad, work to get the county to change them.
How do you recommend doing that?
It's easier said than done. It is very difficult to get things to change in a county as big as Montgomery County. The county isn't always going to do what's in the best interest of the kids. There are tons of other conflicting interests.
Find some like-minded people and form an organization -- or maybe there already is one, if you're lucky. Then, as a group, start going to public meetings, asking staff members questions about the process, writing e-mails, writing letters to the editor, passing out leaflets, meeting elected officials, recruiting new members, etc. Just like for any other cause you might advocate at the county level. Also, don't expect instant results. Change and advocacy take time and work.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 13:55
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Wasn't talking about something as grand as I-270 to Frederick. Just around the Shady Grove area that is already congested and is likely to be more so with this new development. Same for where to build. Does building in an area that is already congested help or hurt?
Also, getting back to the school issue, does it make sense to develop in an area where the schools are already way over capacity? Assume this would be in the Richard Montgomery Cluster but I could be mistaken.
The county does not allow building in an area where the schools are already way over capacity. If a high school cluster's projected enrollment at any level, five years in the future, exceeds 120% of school capacity, then the county puts a moratorium on new residential construction in that high school cluster.
http://www.montgomeryplanningboard.org/agenda/2014/documents/item8aFY2015AnnualSchoolTestResults_final22.pdf
But this is by cluster not individual schools. So an elementary school can be 120% or more of school capacity but as long as the cluster as a whole is under that threshold, then everything is OK. And if one little elementary school is over capacity, so what, right?
If you think that the criteria are bad, work to get the county to change them.
How do you recommend doing that?
It's easier said than done. It is very difficult to get things to change in a county as big as Montgomery County. The county isn't always going to do what's in the best interest of the kids. There are tons of other conflicting interests.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 13:42
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:What would be a better location for the bus depot?
Why couldn't they just leave it where it was?
Because the county has decided that it is better for the land right next to a Metro station to be used for housing and stores than for a school bus depot. And I agree with the county.
http://www.gazette.net/article/20140625/NEWS/140629599/a-total-of-2200-housing-units-library-school-planned-near-shady&template=gazette
You must be a conservative.
Are you also happy about the BOE destroying the 7 acres of Forest Conservation? (In addition to the 8 acre park already being paved over.)
Why would she be a conservative? It's a liberal idea to co-locate housing, jobs, and public transportation.
Because it's a conservation area. Conservatives have no interest in protecting the environment.
I'm talking about Shady Grove. Where MCPS places the bus depot is a whole other story.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 13:02
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Because it's a conservation area. Conservatives have no interest in protecting the environment.
Then the board of education and josh starr are conservatives. They are the ones cutting down 7 acres of trees.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 12:01
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Wasn't talking about something as grand as I-270 to Frederick. Just around the Shady Grove area that is already congested and is likely to be more so with this new development. Same for where to build. Does building in an area that is already congested help or hurt?
Also, getting back to the school issue, does it make sense to develop in an area where the schools are already way over capacity? Assume this would be in the Richard Montgomery Cluster but I could be mistaken.
The county does not allow building in an area where the schools are already way over capacity. If a high school cluster's projected enrollment at any level, five years in the future, exceeds 120% of school capacity, then the county puts a moratorium on new residential construction in that high school cluster.
http://www.montgomeryplanningboard.org/agenda/2014/documents/item8aFY2015AnnualSchoolTestResults_final22.pdf
But this is by cluster not individual schools. So an elementary school can be 120% or more of school capacity but as long as the cluster as a whole is under that threshold, then everything is OK. And if one little elementary school is over capacity, so what, right?
If you think that the criteria are bad, work to get the county to change them.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 11:52
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Wasn't talking about something as grand as I-270 to Frederick. Just around the Shady Grove area that is already congested and is likely to be more so with this new development. Same for where to build. Does building in an area that is already congested help or hurt?
Also, getting back to the school issue, does it make sense to develop in an area where the schools are already way over capacity? Assume this would be in the Richard Montgomery Cluster but I could be mistaken.
The county does not allow building in an area where the schools are already way over capacity. If a high school cluster's projected enrollment at any level, five years in the future, exceeds 120% of school capacity, then the county puts a moratorium on new residential construction in that high school cluster.
http://www.montgomeryplanningboard.org/agenda/2014/documents/item8aFY2015AnnualSchoolTestResults_final22.pdf
But this is by cluster not individual schools. So an elementary school can be 120% or more of school capacity but as long as the cluster as a whole is under that threshold, then everything is OK. And if one little elementary school is over capacity, so what, right?
Anonymous
12/31/2014 11:41
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Moving Alt Programs to Aspen Hill will kill that community on so many levels.
The county spent quite a bit renovating Ewing Center during Alt's redesign, only to move the school to what was once an elementary school in Aspen Hill.
bad move
Unfortunately the community associations (Aspen Hill Civic Association and the AH Homeowners Group) were NOT made aware of the plans until late in the process. There's a website currently discussing the issue: http://www.saveenglishmanor.org/
There is actually a charter school (School for Tomorrow - http://www.sftedu.org/our-school/) currently renting out that building and they were not made aware of the plans either.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 11:30
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Wasn't talking about something as grand as I-270 to Frederick. Just around the Shady Grove area that is already congested and is likely to be more so with this new development. Same for where to build. Does building in an area that is already congested help or hurt?
Also, getting back to the school issue, does it make sense to develop in an area where the schools are already way over capacity? Assume this would be in the Richard Montgomery Cluster but I could be mistaken.
The county does not allow building in an area where the schools are already way over capacity. If a high school cluster's projected enrollment at any level, five years in the future, exceeds 120% of school capacity, then the county puts a moratorium on new residential construction in that high school cluster.
http://www.montgomeryplanningboard.org/agenda/2014/documents/item8aFY2015AnnualSchoolTestResults_final22.pdf
Anonymous
12/31/2014 11:28
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:What would be a better location for the bus depot?
Why couldn't they just leave it where it was?
Because the county has decided that it is better for the land right next to a Metro station to be used for housing and stores than for a school bus depot. And I agree with the county.
http://www.gazette.net/article/20140625/NEWS/140629599/a-total-of-2200-housing-units-library-school-planned-near-shady&template=gazette
You must be a conservative.
Are you also happy about the BOE destroying the 7 acres of Forest Conservation? (In addition to the 8 acre park already being paved over.)
Why would she be a conservative? It's a liberal idea to co-locate housing, jobs, and public transportation.
Because it's a conservation area. Conservatives have no interest in protecting the environment.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 11:27
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Fair points. First, I wouldn't pay for anything, the developers should as part of the agreement to develop the land. As for your other point, yes, more people taking Metro means less congestion even if they do not use Metro all the time. However, developing high density housing brings more people into a crowded area. Since most or all of them will be driving at some point on the roads around Shady Grove it will likely cancel out any benefit of building so close to the Metro.
Either you build housing close to transit, or you build housing far from transit. Which contributes more to car traffic on the roads?
Also, which developers are going to pay $4 billion to widen I-270 to Frederick, and for which developments?
Wasn't talking about something as grand as I-270 to Frederick. Just around the Shady Grove area that is already congested and is likely to be more so with this new development. Same for where to build. Does building in an area that is already congested help or hurt?
Does building in an area that is not yet congested help? That's how we got into this mess in the first place. We built in uncongested area after uncongested area after uncongested area, all the way to Frederick and beyond, and now people are talking about $4 billion for widening I-270.
The point is to build in areas where people can get where they need to go without having to get into the car for every trip.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 11:27
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
That link mentions that they're adding a new school. Which HS would that feed into?
They're adding a new school SITE. Wait until construction of the school is actually funded before worrying about which high school it would feed into.
Well, don't they have to open a new school? Where would the kids who live be going to school? What's the difference between a school SITE and a school? Just that they'll leave the site open until the homes sell and then open a school?
No, MCPS does not have to open a new school. The kids who live there will go to existing schools, unless and until MCPS builds a new school. The difference between a school site and a school is that a school site is the location where MCPS might build a school in the future, if they decide to do so and have the money for it, and a school is a school.
So, if they don't build a school, where will the kids in this new development be going to school? Would that feed into College Gardens ES? Or is there another school in that area already.
Anonymous
12/31/2014 11:23
Subject: BOE to pave over $790,000 in Athletic Fields
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Fair points. First, I wouldn't pay for anything, the developers should as part of the agreement to develop the land. As for your other point, yes, more people taking Metro means less congestion even if they do not use Metro all the time. However, developing high density housing brings more people into a crowded area. Since most or all of them will be driving at some point on the roads around Shady Grove it will likely cancel out any benefit of building so close to the Metro.
Either you build housing close to transit, or you build housing far from transit. Which contributes more to car traffic on the roads?
Also, which developers are going to pay $4 billion to widen I-270 to Frederick, and for which developments?
Wasn't talking about something as grand as I-270 to Frederick. Just around the Shady Grove area that is already congested and is likely to be more so with this new development. Same for where to build. Does building in an area that is already congested help or hurt?
Also, getting back to the school issue, does it make sense to develop in an area where the schools are already way over capacity? Assume this would be in the Richard Montgomery Cluster but I could be mistaken.