Anonymous wrote:Didn't realize Einstein had anything to do with Creationism. He was a believer though, so point taken

Here is Einstein on his belief: "It seems to me that the idea of a personal God is an anthropological concept which I cannot take seriously. I feel also not able to imagine some will or goal outside the human sphere. My views are near those of Spinoza: admiration for the beauty of and belief in the logical simplicity of the order which we can grasp humbly and only imperfectly. I believe that we have to content ourselves with our imperfect knowledge and understanding and treat values and moral obligations as a purely human problem—the most important of all human problems."

Calling him a believer may not be totally wrong, but it is certainly misleading. He called himself an agnostic.

Note: This is from Wikipedia, but with a citation for the quote.

PS I don't mean to quote Einstein as an expert on religion. I think he was expressing a personal viewpoint, not intending to tell anyone else what to believe, although it happens to describe my beliefs with more eloquence than I could muster.

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Anonymous wrote:There are religions without a heaven attached, so obviously heaven isn't the only attraction of religion.

This. My religion does not have heaven or hell.

That said, I do think the belief in heaven is a necessitating motivation for the type of person that does better in their life when there are discouraging factors (hell) and rewarding factors (heaven). This is completely okay and should not be looked down upon.

There are different types of people and it is my belief that the abundance of different religions is a good thing so that people can gravitate towards what works for them to become better people. If someone needs to believe in heaven and hell to keep their moral compass in check, than that's better than not having that religion in their life at all.

So it's better to be controlled by lies than it is to learn how to self-manage?

fine as a temporary fix for a 5 yo but hardly acceptable for an adult

It's not a lie if you believe it

On a more serious note, you don't get to tell people what's the truth and what are the lies. It's as simple as that.

So it would be alright to assure a child that the Sun revolves around the Earth?

You can assure your child it's all relative, if you must LOL

And this is why we have Creationism.

Didn't realize Einstein had anything to do with Creationism. He was a believer though, so point taken

if you want to get into coordinate systems, then yes

but not with a 5 year old

Well, who brought the 5 y.o. into this conversation?

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Anonymous wrote:If heaven was not attached religion would still be attractive in the sense that the holy sprit still guides me and lives in my heart.

Do you think heaven exists?

NP. What heaven? Be specific.

eternal life after human death -- the soul living on forever, in some fashion.

In what fashion? That is the question. The science tells us something does not turn into nothing. So do various religions.

Whether the human personality with it's knowledge and memories remains intact to meet his or her loved ones in another realm, I don't know. I don't think so. But I see why people may have thought so in the past.

Yet, I believe a part of our self-awreness comes from elsewhere (not the human brain and its functions) when we're born and returns there when we die. People called it different things at different times depending on their changing perception of the world around them.

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Anonymous wrote:If heaven was not attached religion would still be attractive in the sense that the holy sprit still guides me and lives in my heart.

Do you think heaven exists?

NP. What heaven? Be specific.

eternal life after human death -- the soul living on forever, in some fashion.

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Anonymous wrote:There are religions without a heaven attached, so obviously heaven isn't the only attraction of religion.

This. My religion does not have heaven or hell.

That said, I do think the belief in heaven is a necessitating motivation for the type of person that does better in their life when there are discouraging factors (hell) and rewarding factors (heaven). This is completely okay and should not be looked down upon.

There are different types of people and it is my belief that the abundance of different religions is a good thing so that people can gravitate towards what works for them to become better people. If someone needs to believe in heaven and hell to keep their moral compass in check, than that's better than not having that religion in their life at all.

So it's better to be controlled by lies than it is to learn how to self-manage?

fine as a temporary fix for a 5 yo but hardly acceptable for an adult

It's not a lie if you believe it

On a more serious note, you don't get to tell people what's the truth and what are the lies. It's as simple as that.

So it would be alright to assure a child that the Sun revolves around the Earth?

You can assure your child it's all relative, if you must LOL

I'm LOLing too. These examples being offered by anti-religious poster are ridiculous.

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Anonymous wrote:There are religions without a heaven attached, so obviously heaven isn't the only attraction of religion.

This. My religion does not have heaven or hell.

That said, I do think the belief in heaven is a necessitating motivation for the type of person that does better in their life when there are discouraging factors (hell) and rewarding factors (heaven). This is completely okay and should not be looked down upon.

There are different types of people and it is my belief that the abundance of different religions is a good thing so that people can gravitate towards what works for them to become better people. If someone needs to believe in heaven and hell to keep their moral compass in check, than that's better than not having that religion in their life at all.

So it's better to be controlled by lies than it is to learn how to self-manage?

fine as a temporary fix for a 5 yo but hardly acceptable for an adult

It's not a lie if you believe it

On a more serious note, you don't get to tell people what's the truth and what are the lies. It's as simple as that.

So it would be alright to assure a child that the Sun revolves around the Earth?

You can assure your child it's all relative, if you must LOL

And this is why we have Creationism.

Didn't realize Einstein had anything to do with Creationism. He was a believer though, so point taken

if you want to get into coordinate systems, then yes

but not with a 5 year old

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are religions without a heaven attached, so obviously heaven isn't the only attraction of religion.

This. My religion does not have heaven or hell.

That said, I do think the belief in heaven is a necessitating motivation for the type of person that does better in their life when there are discouraging factors (hell) and rewarding factors (heaven). This is completely okay and should not be looked down upon.

There are different types of people and it is my belief that the abundance of different religions is a good thing so that people can gravitate towards what works for them to become better people. If someone needs to believe in heaven and hell to keep their moral compass in check, than that's better than not having that religion in their life at all.

So it's better to be controlled by lies than it is to learn how to self-manage?

fine as a temporary fix for a 5 yo but hardly acceptable for an adult

It's not a lie if you believe it

On a more serious note, you don't get to tell people what's the truth and what are the lies. It's as simple as that.

So it would be alright to assure a child that the Sun revolves around the Earth?

You can assure your child it's all relative, if you must LOL

And this is why we have Creationism.

Didn't realize Einstein had anything to do with Creationism. He was a believer though, so point taken

^^Okay, getting the quotes wrong. I'm the second poster of the quoted part of the post.^^

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Anonymous wrote:There are religions without a heaven attached, so obviously heaven isn't the only attraction of religion.

This. My religion does not have heaven or hell.

That said, I do think the belief in heaven is a necessitating motivation for the type of person that does better in their life when there are discouraging factors (hell) and rewarding factors (heaven). This is completely okay and should not be looked down upon.

There are different types of people and it is my belief that the abundance of different religions is a good thing so that people can gravitate towards what works for them to become better people. If someone needs to believe in heaven and hell to keep their moral compass in check, than that's better than not having that religion in their life at all.

So it's better to be controlled by lies than it is to learn how to self-manage?

fine as a temporary fix for a 5 yo but hardly acceptable for an adult

1st pp here. During the times when the religions with the beliefs in heaven and hell were formed, there were no "self-help" books to read or lectures to attend. Forming the religion around the idea of punishment and reward was basically the method of teaching how to self manage.

Yes, similar to a child but it still works for adults. We like being recognized and rewarded at work for our efforts, we also do not do some things because of fear of being fired. It's a method and it's effective.

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Anonymous wrote:I'm an Episcopalian and (currently) my religion helps me get through life day to day. The afterlife has never been a big motivator for me.

do you think there is an afterlife?

Maybe. But it's like what some atheists say; if there was no afterlife, does that mean I would stop doing the right things?

I do remember my 60 year old cousin in tears when his mother died because she would finally be with her son who died when he was five days old. That sticks with me.

are you hoping for an afterlife?

Sure. I have no confidence in what it would be like, though. So, I don't worry about it much.

I smell an atheist sock puppet.

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are religions without a heaven attached, so obviously heaven isn't the only attraction of religion.

This. My religion does not have heaven or hell.

That said, I do think the belief in heaven is a necessitating motivation for the type of person that does better in their life when there are discouraging factors (hell) and rewarding factors (heaven). This is completely okay and should not be looked down upon.

There are different types of people and it is my belief that the abundance of different religions is a good thing so that people can gravitate towards what works for them to become better people. If someone needs to believe in heaven and hell to keep their moral compass in check, than that's better than not having that religion in their life at all.

So it's better to be controlled by lies than it is to learn how to self-manage?

fine as a temporary fix for a 5 yo but hardly acceptable for an adult

It's not a lie if you believe it

On a more serious note, you don't get to tell people what's the truth and what are the lies. It's as simple as that.

So it would be alright to assure a child that the Sun revolves around the Earth?

You can assure your child it's all relative, if you must LOL

And this is why we have Creationism.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are religions without a heaven attached, so obviously heaven isn't the only attraction of religion.

This. My religion does not have heaven or hell.

That said, I do think the belief in heaven is a necessitating motivation for the type of person that does better in their life when there are discouraging factors (hell) and rewarding factors (heaven). This is completely okay and should not be looked down upon.

There are different types of people and it is my belief that the abundance of different religions is a good thing so that people can gravitate towards what works for them to become better people. If someone needs to believe in heaven and hell to keep their moral compass in check, than that's better than not having that religion in their life at all.

So it's better to be controlled by lies than it is to learn how to self-manage?

fine as a temporary fix for a 5 yo but hardly acceptable for an adult

It's not a lie if you believe it

On a more serious note, you don't get to tell people what's the truth and what are the lies. It's as simple as that.

So it would be alright to assure a child that the Sun revolves around the Earth?

You can assure your child it's all relative, if you must LOL

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are religions without a heaven attached, so obviously heaven isn't the only attraction of religion.

This. My religion does not have heaven or hell.

That said, I do think the belief in heaven is a necessitating motivation for the type of person that does better in their life when there are discouraging factors (hell) and rewarding factors (heaven). This is completely okay and should not be looked down upon.

There are different types of people and it is my belief that the abundance of different religions is a good thing so that people can gravitate towards what works for them to become better people. If someone needs to believe in heaven and hell to keep their moral compass in check, than that's better than not having that religion in their life at all.

So it's better to be controlled by lies than it is to learn how to self-manage?

fine as a temporary fix for a 5 yo but hardly acceptable for an adult

It's not a lie if you believe it

On a more serious note, you don't get to tell people what's the truth and what are the lies. It's as simple as that.

So it would be alright to assure a child that the Sun revolves around the Earth?

Just as good and less damaging as insisting being gay isn't a choice or that diversity leads to a better education.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are religions without a heaven attached, so obviously heaven isn't the only attraction of religion.

This. My religion does not have heaven or hell.

That said, I do think the belief in heaven is a necessitating motivation for the type of person that does better in their life when there are discouraging factors (hell) and rewarding factors (heaven). This is completely okay and should not be looked down upon.

There are different types of people and it is my belief that the abundance of different religions is a good thing so that people can gravitate towards what works for them to become better people. If someone needs to believe in heaven and hell to keep their moral compass in check, than that's better than not having that religion in their life at all.

So it's better to be controlled by lies than it is to learn how to self-manage?

fine as a temporary fix for a 5 yo but hardly acceptable for an adult

It's not a lie if you believe it

On a more serious note, you don't get to tell people what's the truth and what are the lies. It's as simple as that.

So it would be alright to assure a child that the Sun revolves around the Earth?