Well said, Jeff. RIP Mayor Barry.

Let me give a few of my own thoughts on the passing of Marion Barry. When I was a student at Georgetown University, Barry introduced Ronald Reagan who had come to the University to launch its bicentennial celebration. It was a beautiful day with lots of sun and a moderate temperature. Noting the weather, Barry asked, "will you give me credit for the sun? I know you all blame me for the snow." That was in reference to DC being buried under nearly 2 ft. of snow while Barry was in southern California attending the Super Bowl.

Barry was correct that his critics often focused on the negative while seeing the positive as natural or inevitable. He was quickly blamed for anything that went wrong, but credit for successes was frequently placed elsewhere. At the same time, to both Barry and his defenders, his successes were of such a magnitude that they excused any failures. Barry knew that those in the crowd at Georgetown did not blame him for the snow. We blamed him for his administration's failure to remove the snow. We saw Barry as a source of incompetence and corruption. Politics, especially local politics, is very much a situation of "what have you done for me lately?" and, lately, Barry hadn't done much good for us at all.

But, for others, Barry had done a lot. He had done life-changing things. However, there was no way that someone like me -- a young university student in only my second year of living in DC -- could understand the importance of those things. Frankly, I didn't even know about them. I would learn later that Barry had started a summer job program for youth. In the environment in which I grew up, youth had no problem finding summer employment. I couldn't understand why such a program was important. Then, I would start hearing a phrase that would become almost synonymous with "native Washingtonian" and that was "Marion Barry got me my first job". I think it is very important -- especially after decades of black people being associated with welfare -- that Barry was a proponent of work. He didn't ask for handouts, he asked for -- demanded, in fact -- jobs. Barry didn't create Washington, DC's middle class. But, he sure as hell helped create it and his efforts were -- as I said -- life-changing for many people. When someone has changed your life for the better, it is natural and understandable that you will forgive them their faults. Not surprisingly, therefore, there is another phrase I've heard frequently over the past few years, "That's our Barry". Warts and all, Barry made the kind of positive impact on others of which few can ever dream.

A lot more can be said about Barry, both good and bad. But, on this day, I am glad that I came to understand that a first job and a better lot in life is a much more important than a few days of snowed-in streets. So, on this day, Mr. Mayor, I am giving you credit for the sun.

Anonymous wrote:Like others, I was unexpectedly sad to hear the news. One does not have to be blind to his flaws to have an emotional feeling of loss.

This thread is like our DCUM funeral for him, and I agree with Jeff that those who mourn deserve, at least in this one thread, to have our moment to look back without vilification.

His faults are part of the story, and Jeff has not demanded a whitewash, just a tone that recognizes that a giant, albeit a very imperfect one, has passed out of our lives.

And another +1

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those big buildings you see lining Pennsylvania Ave are attributable to Marion Barry. In many ways, there could not have been an Anthony Williams had there not first been a Marion Barry.

It has always been sad to me that the second half of his life will overshadow the first. A cautionary tale about the dangers of believing your own press and surrounding yourself with yes men.

Very well said. We have to look at the man in the whole. Unfortunately I only became political aware during the time period of MB's cocaine escapades so that sits stronger in my head than his prior work. But its important we look at the whole. Frankly the drug issues and the the conceit of power of those later years must be remembered with the good the man did. We must always be aware of the potential for abuse that comes with power. When we do not, when we censure debate, we end up with college kids wearing Che Guevara T-shrits wholly unaware the man was responsible for the rape and murder of thousands.

I in no way am comparing the Mayor to Che… They Mayor had personal demons but I believe was a good man. I just wanted to further the cautionary tale point; it not only applies to those in power but to political forums which decide what is to be discussed and what is not.

(That said all discourse should be provided in respectable and decent manner, slinging expletives and insults should not be tolerated, not tolerated towards fellow debaters or the subjects of this forum)

Rest in Peace Mr. Mayor.

I'm not sure how many times posters and the moderator need to reiterate that discussion is not being censored but curtailed temporarily in respect for the mayor AND those who are mourning for him NOW. Additionally, numerous posters have mentioned the Mayor's shortcomings but also acknowledged his past successes.

No one disputes Barry's personal difficulties and freedom of speech is one of America's proudest attributes, but why anyone would even need to say to allow those mourning Barry a short respite (even for a few hours) is beyond me.

+1. There's a time and a place.

Like others, I was unexpectedly sad to hear the news. One does not have to be blind to his flaws to have an emotional feeling of loss.

This thread is like our DCUM funeral for him, and I agree with Jeff that those who mourn deserve, at least in this one thread, to have our moment to look back without vilification.

His faults are part of the story, and Jeff has not demanded a whitewash, just a tone that recognizes that a giant, albeit a very imperfect one, has passed out of our lives.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those big buildings you see lining Pennsylvania Ave are attributable to Marion Barry. In many ways, there could not have been an Anthony Williams had there not first been a Marion Barry.

It has always been sad to me that the second half of his life will overshadow the first. A cautionary tale about the dangers of believing your own press and surrounding yourself with yes men.

Very well said. We have to look at the man in the whole. Unfortunately I only became political aware during the time period of MB's cocaine escapades so that sits stronger in my head than his prior work. But its important we look at the whole. Frankly the drug issues and the the conceit of power of those later years must be remembered with the good the man did. We must always be aware of the potential for abuse that comes with power. When we do not, when we censure debate, we end up with college kids wearing Che Guevara T-shrits wholly unaware the man was responsible for the rape and murder of thousands.

I in no way am comparing the Mayor to Che… They Mayor had personal demons but I believe was a good man. I just wanted to further the cautionary tale point; it not only applies to those in power but to political forums which decide what is to be discussed and what is not.

(That said all discourse should be provided in respectable and decent manner, slinging expletives and insults should not be tolerated, not tolerated towards fellow debaters or the subjects of this forum)

Rest in Peace Mr. Mayor.

I'm not sure how many times posters and the moderator need to reiterate that discussion is not being censored but curtailed temporarily in respect for the mayor AND those who are mourning for him NOW. Additionally, numerous posters have mentioned the Mayor's shortcomings but also acknowledged his past successes.

No one disputes Barry's personal difficulties and freedom of speech is one of America's proudest attributes, but why anyone would even need to say to allow those mourning Barry a short respite (even for a few hours) is beyond me.

RIP, Mr. Barry.

Anonymous wrote:Those big buildings you see lining Pennsylvania Ave are attributable to Marion Barry. In many ways, there could not have been an Anthony Williams had there not first been a Marion Barry.

It has always been sad to me that the second half of his life will overshadow the first. A cautionary tale about the dangers of believing your own press and surrounding yourself with yes men.

Very well said. We have to look at the man in the whole. Unfortunately I only became political aware during the time period of MB's cocaine escapades so that sits stronger in my head than his prior work. But its important we look at the whole. Frankly the drug issues and the the conceit of power of those later years must be remembered with the good the man did. We must always be aware of the potential for abuse that comes with power. When we do not, when we censure debate, we end up with college kids wearing Che Guevara T-shrits wholly unaware the man was responsible for the rape and murder of thousands.

I in no way am comparing the Mayor to Che… They Mayor had personal demons but I believe was a good man. I just wanted to further the cautionary tale point; it not only applies to those in power but to political forums which decide what is to be discussed and what is not.

(That said all discourse should be provided in respectable and decent manner, slinging expletives and insults should not be tolerated, not tolerated towards fellow debaters or the subjects of this forum)

Rest in Peace Mr. Mayor.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you going to censor me again Jeff?

You did not censor people who said horrible things here when Margaret Thatcher died. And only I chided those who seem to be attached to the disreputable among us (not my exact words but i said nothing foul of offensive). For at the end of the day Marion Barry was a public figure and and deserves public scrutiny. Yet during his life time to offer scrutiny was to risk being libeled a racist by many who post here. And now in death you won't even allow the discussion. I won't play the hagiography game but if you censor this its far worse than hagiography you are playing at. This is the Political Discussion Forum Jeff, please allow the discourse.

I just read the Margaret Thatcher thread. I fail to see anything "horrible" in it. http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/299723.page This, despite the fact that she is a foreign political figure, not American much less DC's former mayor.

Maybe you could point out what you think is worthy of deletion for being "horrible". I don't think you are showing much perspective here.

That an entire thread is a debate about her politics and whether it was good or bad for the UK and the world. Plenty of negative comments about her. If Jeff is deleting anything negative about Barry in this, he's showing a double standard.

This is not the UK and the world. This is DC, and many of its people are grieving.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you going to censor me again Jeff?

You did not censor people who said horrible things here when Margaret Thatcher died. And only I chided those who seem to be attached to the disreputable among us (not my exact words but i said nothing foul of offensive). For at the end of the day Marion Barry was a public figure and and deserves public scrutiny. Yet during his life time to offer scrutiny was to risk being libeled a racist by many who post here. And now in death you won't even allow the discussion. I won't play the hagiography game but if you censor this its far worse than hagiography you are playing at. This is the Political Discussion Forum Jeff, please allow the discourse.

I just read the Margaret Thatcher thread. I fail to see anything "horrible" in it. http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/299723.page This, despite the fact that she is a foreign political figure, not American much less DC's former mayor.

Maybe you could point out what you think is worthy of deletion for being "horrible". I don't think you are showing much perspective here.

That an entire thread is a debate about her politics and whether it was good or bad for the UK and the world. Plenty of negative comments about her. If Jeff is deleting anything negative about Barry in this, he's showing a double standard.

^^you must have meant "PP here", not "OP here."
- OP.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you going to censor me again Jeff?

You did not censor people who said horrible things here when Margaret Thatcher died. And only I chided those who seem to be attached to the disreputable among us (not my exact words but i said nothing foul of offensive). For at the end of the day Marion Barry was a public figure and and deserves public scrutiny. Yet during his life time to offer scrutiny was to risk being libeled a racist by many who post here. And now in death you won't even allow the discussion. I won't play the hagiography game but if you censor this its far worse than hagiography you are playing at. This is the Political Discussion Forum Jeff, please allow the discourse.

I agree wholeheartedly with Jeff. You will eventually have your 15-minutes for vehemence but this is a day of mourning for the people who did care about Barry and your desire to vilify him at this moment says more about your character than Barry's.

OP here; the problem is, I didn't offer any 'vehemence' nor vilification, I just refused to applaud.

No one asked you to applaud but everyone asked you to refrain from your desire to negatively scrutinize on this day of Barry's death. The moderator was, right fully so, correct to stop your attempt to pursue negative discourse on this day of all days.

And I agree. You will get your day in the sun but this isn't that day or the time.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you going to censor me again Jeff?

You did not censor people who said horrible things here when Margaret Thatcher died. And only I chided those who seem to be attached to the disreputable among us (not my exact words but i said nothing foul of offensive). For at the end of the day Marion Barry was a public figure and and deserves public scrutiny. Yet during his life time to offer scrutiny was to risk being libeled a racist by many who post here. And now in death you won't even allow the discussion. I won't play the hagiography game but if you censor this its far worse than hagiography you are playing at. This is the Political Discussion Forum Jeff, please allow the discourse.

I agree wholeheartedly with Jeff. You will eventually have your 15-minutes for vehemence but this is a day of mourning for the people who did care about Barry and your desire to vilify him at this moment says more about your character than Barry's.

OP here; the problem is, I didn't offer any 'vehemence' nor vilification, I just refused to applaud.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The censorship is unfortunate but probably necessary.

It doesnt seem Barry operated for personal gain - he was basically bankrupt. Did he enrage others? Probanly. But his legacy is pretty amazing. Last of the biggest city bosses to go. Now we get hacks like Gray, diblasio, etc.

The city will move on, and maybe faster than it otherwise w/o have. But it may lose some of the unique character Barry nurtured.

Being from Chicago and home of one of the biggest, baddest late bosses, Richard J Daley (1955-1976), I can appreciate your statement.

Daley, like Barry, was never in it for personal gain and both had dubious moments. I remember my grandfather saying he never really liked or trusted Daley but always voted for him "because my trash gets picked up, the street lights are on, and the precinct captain always checks in to make sure everything is alright."

Sounds like bosses Daley and Barry had much in common.

Correction: personal financial gain.

Anonymous wrote:The censorship is unfortunate but probably necessary.

It doesnt seem Barry operated for personal gain - he was basically bankrupt. Did he enrage others? Probanly. But his legacy is pretty amazing. Last of the biggest city bosses to go. Now we get hacks like Gray, diblasio, etc.

The city will move on, and maybe faster than it otherwise w/o have. But it may lose some of the unique character Barry nurtured.

Being from Chicago and home of one of the biggest, baddest late bosses, Richard J Daley (1955-1976), I can appreciate your statement.

Daley, like Barry, was never in it for personal gain and both had dubious moments. I remember my grandfather saying he never really liked or trusted Daley but always voted for him "because my trash gets picked up, the street lights are on, and the precinct captain always checks in to make sure everything is alright."

Sounds like bosses Daley and Barry had much in common.