OP you are right. Freeloader is wrong.

Good luck with your parent.

Your adult relative will be better cared for in an assisted living center if he still meets the criteria to be served there. It sounds as it he needs more companionship now and should be be left on his own so much, but family members do need to work. If he has the funds, they should be used for his care before any thought of giving any money to any adult child, shiftless or otherwise. Also, once he is settled with the right supports in place, he will probably really enjoy the company of other seniors.

A month ago yesterday, my Dad came in from his one morning out of golfing to find my Mom had fallen and injured her other hip. This was the pivotal event that we all knew had to happen before they would be ready to see that they needed a lifecare setting where she could get the personal care, therapy and companion services that she now needs. They were super fortunate to have all 7 siblings happen to be in the area as we were there to celebrate her 92 birthday. It was their very good fortune that there was 2-bedroom apartment opening in a lovely three tiered community within 10 minutes of two of the five siblings who live in the metro Boston area. It was still very hard dealing with several siblings who were not quite there yet on the kinds of services that Mom would need, but none argued about the cost. In terms of competency, while my Dad is still very competent generally at age 92.5 and did a good shop at food shopping and cooking these last few years as my Mom's short term memory declined, he was not competent in being able to see the care she needed before and even after the second hip was injured. (She's won't have a limp or need a walker or cane.....) A month later, they are settled in the apartment with all new furnishings, lovely wrap around porch. She had to have had an assessment done on services and a private agency is proving the care as they are in an Independent Living unit which is quite suitable for him with one meal of their choice a day. For the first time in years she will be bathed appropriately and her clothes washed. She will have the therapy she needs and a companion whenever he will out - really regularly set hours. The hassle of the last month is well worth it to see she had her hair done on Friday and they had their first meal in the dining room last night with one of my siblings and spouse. After 28 years of "his retirement routine" of Boston to Florida, my Mother will get her chance to be near her children (5 in area and 2 of us can visit a lot easier there) and 20 grandchildren - just being able to drop by.

Aging is one thing which can't necessarily be planned in life, and it is often crisis driven. I would definitely research a couple of assisted living places in your area to see what opening there are, take your FIL or Father to see maybe two. Get the pricing on any upfront cost to come in and what the basic monthly fee covers. Then get a clear understanding of the additional levels of care as it sounds like he would need Medication Management, Personal Care and the bathroom assistance, which is probably a higher level to start with. Then if there is a difference in pricing or unit size etc., it can be presented and he can still participate in the decision-making.

There will need to be clear health care directives in place or the places may not even want to talk to you all that much as you can't just drop a person off even with full payment.
But it does not sound like your FIL or DAD is up to making this kind of decision for himself and what a family can provide in terms of direct care does need to be considered. I can tell you in the DC area any hour of agency care is probably $20/hour so you are correct that an assisted living center is much more cost effective.

OP - I can also tell how a close friend who has done an excellent job of caring for her two parents first trying it in Florida and then driving them literally up to an assisted living center in our community 7 years ago with her husband has been sued continuously by a shiftless, mentally ill brother who while the apple of his parents' eyes was definitely not to ever be in charge of their care. It matters little that she is their legal guardian and has a conservatorship reporting every dollar spent on their care to a trust officer etc. nor that it is the estate's money being used up in these frivolous law suits which he has never one once. So if I were the two local siblings with this 3rd "loose cannon" sibling, I would also see a lawyer about how being sure to have the correct legal instruments in place at least on health care decision-making and then how best to structure payment for services so there could be a clear reporting done to a 3rd party, if requested now or in the future.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just tell the all siblings collectively that the fact is simply that full time care is now needed and it will cost $x. Everyone votes either to approve outside care or to provide it themselves in exchange for that money - basically contracting themselves. All votes must be in by a certain day. If no one steps up, there's the result. If someone does step up, they will be compensated.

No. Just no. We're not talking about who's going to take care of the family dog, this is a human being who is still competent to make decisions regarding his own care.

Then why is it even a question? Tell him to make a decision and everyone shuts up. Done.

Make sure the POA has an incapacity clause.

Anonymous wrote:I don't even think this is a "voting" situation. Siblings don't get an equal vote--it's up to your dad and the sibling who is currently providing care.

Your dad deserves to be as comfortable and cared for as he can afford and as you are able/willing to provide. If you do this right, he gets to be in an assisted living facility that he ends up loving, and enjoys enough years/months of comfort that he dies peacefully when that last month's payment empties his bank account. No one should be counting in his money.

$3500/month is a steal for good assisted living. Are you sure it's good? Does it really provide 24/7 toileting help? My mom is in assisted living but she has to be able to toilet herself unless she is short term recovering from a brief illness. I'd check to be sure of exactly the help that comes without extra fees.

If it's possible to get a POA for your dad, do it now. I don't trust your sibling to have his best interests at heart. Good luck.

+1000 Excellent advice. BTDT.

Anonymous wrote:Just tell the all siblings collectively that the fact is simply that full time care is now needed and it will cost $x. Everyone votes either to approve outside care or to provide it themselves in exchange for that money - basically contracting themselves. All votes must be in by a certain day. If no one steps up, there's the result. If someone does step up, they will be compensated.

No. Just no. We're not talking about who's going to take care of the family dog, this is a human being who is still competent to make decisions regarding his own care.

I don't even think this is a "voting" situation. Siblings don't get an equal vote--it's up to your dad and the sibling who is currently providing care.

Your dad deserves to be as comfortable and cared for as he can afford and as you are able/willing to provide. If you do this right, he gets to be in an assisted living facility that he ends up loving, and enjoys enough years/months of comfort that he dies peacefully when that last month's payment empties his bank account. No one should be counting in his money.

$3500/month is a steal for good assisted living. Are you sure it's good? Does it really provide 24/7 toileting help? My mom is in assisted living but she has to be able to toilet herself unless she is short term recovering from a brief illness. I'd check to be sure of exactly the help that comes without extra fees.

If it's possible to get a POA for your dad, do it now. I don't trust your sibling to have his best interests at heart. Good luck.

Just tell the all siblings collectively that the fact is simply that full time care is now needed and it will cost $x. Everyone votes either to approve outside care or to provide it themselves in exchange for that money - basically contracting themselves. All votes must be in by a certain day. If no one steps up, there's the result. If someone does step up, they will be compensated.

You need to do what your mom needs. Just do it and tell the sibling far away afterward. If that sibling wants to provide the service, let him or her move here to provide it. I totally get the bathroom need. My mom had a stroke and we hired a live in worker 24/7 weekdays, but my dad had to help my mom in the middle of the night for toileting. It was too much on him. The aid was not a good cook and my dad did not cook either.

It ended up my mom was happier in assisted living. She may not have been estatic, but at least her needs were taken care of. It is still a lot of work to have a parent in assisted living. You need to buy clothes, keep up with health care appointments, shopping for what she wants.

Your sibling just wants to inherit money and does not care about your parents.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In a similar situation my grandfather was the one who opposed assisted living. He left a very promising career and moved his family back to his small town. My GM also had to downshift and ultimately take care of ILs. The other two siblings visit rarely, but no one was mad at them - it was my GF who made the choice and took the responsibility for his parents.

Suggest this scenario to your sibling. Let him move to DC and arrange the care.

PP, your GM was a saint. Unless she was from the same small town, she sacrificed a LOT.

She totally was! Thank you, PP. It would be her birthday today.

We had a similar situation in our family. Two siblings saw the need for care, two did not. The two who saw it were the care givers. One of the other two finally spend a couple weeks with the elderly family member and realized how much help she needs. The family is now 3 siblings to 1 in favor of outside assistance. Encourage your distant relative to provide care for a few weeks and see if this changes his mind.

Your dad made this problem when he was unfair and left that sibling more. Blame him,

The 2 siblings need to level with the 3rd one now and explain that assisted living or not - the bulk of the estate is going to be drained away on caretakers in the next few years. 3rd sibling simply can not depend on the estate and if and when he gets the money from the estate he needs to consider a bonus.

Whether you hire help in or move to assisted living, it's going to cost a lot of money.

Anonymous wrote:I feel bad for you, OP, that your sibling is being such a selfish ass. If sibling does not live anywhere near here and has no responsibility for the care of Dad, he does not get a vote.

My in-laws put up a fuss initially when they had to move from their house where they had lived for 50+ yrs to assisted living but now my mil says she wishes they had moved sooner. Do what's best for your father and ignore the greedy pest.

My gram was the same way. And similarly my mom's youngest sibling was opposed at first- my grandma totally recognized it and made a comment one day "oh he just wants my money." At that point she was still getting around ok but once her mobility really decreased I think even my opposing uncle saw the benefit of her being in a place where she could get the help she needed.