Anonymous wrote: Attempts at open dialogue are great. Sometimes that means listening to criticism. However, Persecution of or hatred toward any group based on religion is not cool.

Yes. If you are admittedly "anti" something, you aren't a sceptic.

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:That's a pure fabrication (nicer word). Now as far as the topic of this thread I think people have a tendency to criticize things they don't understand much or feel threatened by

Probably a more common reason is educated people who do understand but tire of those continuing to evangelize a 2000 year old philosophy full of many disproved beliefs.

+1

Because your beliefs do not get you an exemption from criticism everywhere in this country. If being anti-Christian were "not okay" here (and elsewhere in this country), you guys wouldn't be able to deny the "American Taliban" meme anymore.

Anonymous wrote:Matthew 10:22
New International Version

"You will be hated by everyone because of Me, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved."

Because some so-called Christians can't help themselves from spewing quotes from the bible like this and because some try to impose their extreme Christian views on society through the political and legal process. This extremism is the major cause for the increasing political divide. It is too bad because it is wholly inconsistent with what our founding fathers envisioned. Read Jefferson - he was pretty clear. I'm not anti Christian, I'm anti "the bible says so, therefore ....".

I feel comfortable expressing my distaste for Christianity and specifically Catholicism because I was raised as a die-hard Catholic for the first 20 years of my life. It feels kind of like the women who escape cults and live to tell the world the truth.

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Christianity is the dominant religion in this country. Even given that, there are many aspects to Christianity (particularly certain strains of Christianity) that are objectionable to many people. Christian activist organizations spend a lot of time and money attempting to influence politics, and even many Christians would prefer to have secular laws.

Not saying that's the only reason, but it's certainly one reason. I personally criticize religious anti-choice groups' attempt to impose their religious beliefs on other people, and overwhelmingly, those are Christian groups, not Buddhist or Muslim or Pastafarian ones.

You do realize that Muslims are very anti-choice with regard to abortion right? Some sharia courts will allow it under circumstances that they deem appropriate, but it's not the woman's choice.

They are also extremely anti-gay and view gays with disgust. This is all according to their scriptures.

As far as being against groups that attempt to impose their religious beliefs on others, Islam is right up there with Christianity. Politics and affecting politics is very much intertwined in religious gatherings at mosques and religious conventions, just as it is at churches. They take it a step farther though when they start wanting to be able to have their own sharia courts.

Islam is pro-choice historically. Just like Judiasm. It's only the modern and misguided Salafism that is anti-choice.

It has always been haram to have an abortion, with the exception of if the mother's life is in danger. For this the lesser of the two evils is acknowledged as saving the mother. That's not exactly pro-choice.

There are no judgements against birth control and pregnancy prevention though, so there's a plus. Except, that they are encouraged at their mosques and through their religious leaders to have numerous children (the more the propagate, the sooner they are the majority and able make right in the world with Islam). Thus the wishes of the religious leaders and the husbands often end up trumping the wishes of the woman if she doesn't want anymore.

Thanks for the chuckle, that was funny to read lol

That's a pure fabrication (nicer word). Now as far as the topic of this thread I think people have a tendency to criticize things they don't understand much or feel threatened by

Not necessarily. I actually know quite a lot about world religions, and I am very critical of organized religion in general. I think the real issue is that religious people take great offense when their religion is criticized. Religion or more broadly, faith or a belief system, is just someone's opinion about the world. An opinion, not a fact.

Muslima wrote:Did you even read what you copied/pasted? Your post said that Muslim women are told in mosques and by their husbands that they should reproduce. "Thus the wishes of the religious leaders and the husbands often end up trumping the wishes of the woman if she doesn't want anymore children"

And I repeat, it is a fabrication. In what Mosques are Women who don't want to reproduce being forced to reproduce to increase the Ummah? You copied and pasted someone's response to teh question :"

I noticed that people are of two types: those who encourage us to have few children and those who encourage us to have a lot of children. Is there is evidence to support either of these two opinions?.

Does Islam encourage us to have children? Yes, we see children as a blessing but to make the leap from there and say that Muslim Women are trumping their wishes to satisfy their religious leaders and husbands is a pure fabrication. Muslim Women all over the world use birth control, the only thing that is forbidden in Islam is abortion, unless it is done for medical reasons. Your comments again follow the same narrative that somehow Millions of educated Muslim women who are active within their societies are not able to think for themselves or study their religion independent of male influence. This is highly misogynistic and portray all Muslim women as complacent and voiceless individuals and that is simply not true.

Okay well let's all think of all the Muslim families we know. How many kids do they have? I've known over 10 families and not one has 2 or less children. The average is 4-6 kids per family and that is the average worldwide.

There is a reason for a lot of tension in Europe right now. The population of Muslims is set to increase in ten years, this is mostly a projection from records of live births while immigration or conversion also have some impact. Now think what it will be in 20 years, 50 years. There are similar expected increases in Canada and India.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_population_growth

"According to the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, the World Christian Database as of 2007 estimated the six fastest-growing religions of the world to be Islam (1.84%), the Bahá'í Faith (1.7%), Sikhism (1.62%), Jainism (1.57%), Hinduism (1.52%), and Christianity (1.32%). High birth rates were cited as the reason for the growth.[25]''

Now we all remember when Catholics were the ones seen as having lots of children, that was/is due to their disbelief in birth control methods, yet this is not the reason in Islam since birth control is acceptable.

I see absolutely nothing wrong for wanting to have a large family, but when it is very concentrated to particular groups, one has to question it. Islam is a very peaceful religion, until it starts to become a larger percentage of a population. Then slowly more demands are placed on the host country- wanting sharia courts, wanting to be able to be veiled even when security is an issue, demanding women only pool hours, demanding schools to adjust calendars as per their holidays, etc. It goes from being a personal religion, to a change in the greater community, culture, and government. One only needs to study current events and historical evidence of this.

We don't see it here much in the U.S...yet. But you see how it starts in other parts of the world and then the tensions start to arise, tensions lead to conflict, etc, etc.

I'm not saying there are no peaceful followers of Islam. Of course there are and it obvious that you are and I completely respect your belief in your faith and how you believe and live by your faith. However putting blinders on towards the parts that are not so becoming doesn't make them less there.

Anonymous wrote:Then someone please explain ISIS to me. Because I just cannot comprehend the inhumanity and the lack of media coverage - it's simply SICK what these people are doing to Christians and others.

The proto-ISIS group, Tawhid al-Jihad (TJ) arose during the Iraq war, as a group amongst a coalition of resistance fighters against Iraqi occupation. It changed its name a few times: under Ayad Zawahiri, becoming the ‘The organisation of the base of Jihad in the land of the two rivers'; then the ‘Islamic State of Iraq’ (ISI) in 2006 from a coalition of multiple resistance movements; and in 2013 it branched into Syria, and appended the title ‘The Islamic State of Iraq and Syria’ (ISIS). They have now become a terrorist group that ended the lives of hundreds of different muslims, minorities and now also persecute Christians. They have comitted severe crimes throughout the middle east. We as muslims do NOT support ISIS, we do not recognize ISIS to be modeling Islam nor do they represent musims around the World.

Attempts at open dialogue are great. Sometimes that means listening to criticism. However, Persecution of or hatred toward any group based on religion is not cool.

Then someone please explain ISIS to me. Because I just cannot comprehend the inhumanity and the lack of media coverage - it's simply SICK what these people are doing to Christians and others.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Personally, I am anti-religion. I feel the same about Christianity as I do Islam.

Perhaps a religion forum is the wrong place for you.

heavens, no -- skeptics welcome here.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Matthew 10:22
New International Version

"You will be hated by everyone because of Me, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved."

Yes!!

you want to be hated by everyone?

Anonymous wrote:Matthew 10:22
New International Version

"You will be hated by everyone because of Me, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved."

Yes!!

Anonymous wrote:Personally, I am anti-religion. I feel the same about Christianity as I do Islam.

Perhaps a religion forum is the wrong place for you.