Anonymous
05/31/2014 12:42
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:We all know you are talking about Mundo Verde. Just say it.
Actually, when I read the line about wealthy parents recognized as pioneers, I thought Creative Minds. Their list of families with guaranteed acceptance seemed to grow year after year and that preference for donors is only the only explanation I can think of for their cloaked admissions.
Yeah you have a point. It's either Creative Minds (if it is - how ironic of a name!) or Mundo Verde.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 12:36
Subject: Re:Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
uh, don't say it.
a) because it's uncool
b) because what OP writes about is true OF EVERY SINGLE SCHOOL IN AMERICA. it has nothing to do with HRCS's. at every highly regarded DCPS and private school it's the exact same case.
a) because it's uncool
b) because what OP writes about is true OF EVERY SINGLE SCHOOL IN AMERICA. it has nothing to do with HRCS's. at every highly regarded DCPS and private school it's the exact same case.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 12:33
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
Anonymous wrote:We all know you are talking about Mundo Verde. Just say it.
Actually, when I read the line about wealthy parents recognized as pioneers, I thought Creative Minds. Their list of families with guaranteed acceptance seemed to grow year after year and that preference for donors is only the only explanation I can think of for their cloaked admissions.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 12:22
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
We all know you are talking about Mundo Verde. Just say it.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 12:19
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
OP, thank you for this perspective. I am at a HRCS and we are in the upper income bracket. Sometimes I forget that not everyone has been as lucky as we have been. I appreciate the perspective your OP has brought.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 12:14
Subject: Re:Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
Anonymous wrote:Stop whining, OP. Your perception is colored by your own paranoia and prejudice. Families have different backgrounds, incomes, and supports, and peering into their circumstances with envy and bitterness gets you and your DC nowhere. Just do the best that you can for your child, the same thing that good, loving parents do for their children no matter what their SES. Getting your child into a strong HRCS is a great start. If it is truly is a good school with good admin and teachers, then he or she should thrive with your love and support.
and I ask OP and others reading here to keep in mind that the poster above most likely has his/her own perceptions colored by personal paranoia and prejudice - and also likes to insult strangers online.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 12:01
Subject: Re:Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
Stop whining, OP. Your perception is colored by your own paranoia and prejudice. Families have different backgrounds, incomes, and supports, and peering into their circumstances with envy and bitterness gets you and your DC nowhere. Just do the best that you can for your child, the same thing that good, loving parents do for their children no matter what their SES. Getting your child into a strong HRCS is a great start. If it is truly is a good school with good admin and teachers, then he or she should thrive with your love and support.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 11:01
Subject: Re:Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
Anonymous wrote:Agreed and impressed on multiple fronts, but -- do you regret it? Is there a different/better option for your child? I am in a similar situation, just accepted into top charter school and thrilled about it, despite some serious doubts. Would my (or your) child be better off in the struggling neighborhood DCPS that is actually doing a good job of educating a wide range of kids with little fanfare or self-congratulation? Sincere question. I wonder if we are choosing right for our own child in this situation.
OP here, I know this is farther down in the thread, so I hope that the person will get to read my response to the questions asked earlier.
Do I regret enrolling my child in a high-demand charter school? Sometimes I think about what it would have been like. There is something to note about the stability of knowing that the principal will be the same next year, or that your school won't be closed due to politics or some other reason. I do wish I'd not been so naive about academic program implementation however. My best suggestion is to supplement as much as you possibly can with outside enrichment. In that way no matter which way it goes, your child has a better change of not being behind his or her peers. Even if the progress report says "Satisfactory" or "A" or "On Grade Level" I'd encourage every family to take the documents with a grain of salt, and supplement as much as you can.
To address the additional responses:
I do concur that EVERY high demand charter school may not present ALL of the challenges with economic marginalization that I mentioned, but this has been my experience and echoed by several friends who have been through the trenches. It is rare to find school administrators and boards that are truly committed to implementing pathways for every type of student, regardless of income. I remember hearing an administrator say once, "If a child can't learn to read here then we have not found enough ways to teach our children to read." He was adamant about public schools serving ALL of the public and not only SOME of the public. On either extreme. Many schools cater to the affluent and the most indigent, leaving the rest of the kids in the middle to sink or swim.
As stated earlier, I wish I could have read something like what I wrote a few years back. The barriers to accessing free, low, or moderately cost enrichment opportunities are real for so many working parents, yet beyond understanding for those who have never had to struggle to survive on either end of the spectrum. To over simplify and dismiss the concerns of those who struggle with these issues is the equivalent to saying "Let them Eat Cake", with an obliviousness to an sub-culture of separatism and inequity.
To that end, Thanks for reading.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 10:50
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
Anonymous wrote:
. . .
At high demand public charter schools, there is a clear understanding that the only families that have a real voice are the wealthy families. They can afford the $2,000-$10,000 donations that quietly roll in. The wealthy families are the ones that can afford the high priced auxiliary programs. The wealthy families are the ones that are not impacted by school being closed on odd days in the middle of the week, or consistently with week long breaks in instruction.
The donations and social leverage of these families ensure that their children are chosen for extra perks, special activities, and instruction. It also puts added pressure on the public teachers at the school to give their children high marks on subjective assessment scales. The children of working parents are relegated to being tracked in "meeting the standard" or "below standard", as it compares to their wealthy peers, who many times supplement instruction with private tutoring.
At a private school, the wealthy charter school children would be one of many with parents of status and influence. The majority of children would have access to private tutoring. The majority of children may summer in exotic locations and have elevated points of reference. Competition to shine would be high; they would actually have to work hard to stand out.
Alternatively, at the high demand public charter school, children of the wealthy and almost wealthy easily stand out in stark contrast to their lower class peers.
Wealthy parents are recognized as "pioneers", "friends of public education","school reformers", and "parent organization leaders". But many are really attention seekers using public education to save money and to generate their own personal relevance. Listservs are abundant at these schools coupled with a clear understanding that a large portion of the school's parents may not have regular internet or technology access.
. . .
Be advised that the poorer kids will be routed to the inexperienced teacher a lot quicker than the rich ones will.
High performing charter schools are under little to no scrutiny by outsiders; they ride off the testing performance of the rich kids as if the school is producing/instructing at a higher level. In turn, they are not required to ensure academic assistance pathways for students, unless the student is one to two grades below level or on FARMS.
Low income parent (45-65K), be wary. There is no guarantee that just because your child attends the high demand school that they are truly being taught by highly qualified and capable educators on a daily basis. At times, you will find that your concerns are responded to with arrogance and be tinged with an undercurrent of apathy.[u] You will definitely hear the phrases, "We are a school of choice." and "Well if you don't like what we are doing, go to your neighborhood school."
Do not make the mistake of believing that you just won the golden ticket because your child's name was chosen in the charter school lottery for a high demand charter school. A good school is one where your child can feel physically, socially, and emotionally safe to open themselves up for learning. A great school is one that can provide the environment of a good school, while simultaneously providing well thought out pathways that push every student to their highest potential, regardless of income.
OP, I had to go back and pull out the resonant points of your original, because your subsequent post was a little confusing. It's probably not fair to paint all high demand charters with the same brush - and perhaps not fair to name the school - but what you've depicted here pulled up an old gut feeling I've had about one charter in particular.
I think it's nearly impossible for some people to fathom that wealthier people are treated differently, but even kids can detect it. We're a higher SES family, but I see the assumptions that are made because we're AA. It's subtle, and certainly not consistent with everyone we encounter, but I didn't want to take a chance that my kid would have a different status in a school based on those assumptions.
I've had friends express shock that we wouldn't bother applying at this school, but I just could not ignore that gut feeling. I expect you'll get a lot more abuse on this thread, so I thank you for providing your perspective.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 10:42
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
OP, my family makes $75K so a little over what you define as middle. We are also at a HRCS. I don't feel pressure to donate money, however, I do volunteer a lot. Fortunately, I have a very flexible job. I did notice that after my child started 1st grade, other parents did start using tutors, which are expensive, and seem to participate in a lot of activities outside of school that costs real money. I can't do that. We do aftercare PT to participate in a few activities and I told my child to pick 1 outside school activity and I save the money each semester to participate. Also, as other PPs have mentioned, I find other ways to help my child, such as online help or looking for city programs or non-profit programs to participate in.
I also noticed that many High SES families talk about going on vacation a lot. My child has started to question why we don't go away for the whole month of August or every holiday weekend. I explain to my child that some people don't have money to go anywhere and others all the time. We go on one family vacation per year, that is what we can afford. That's life.
I also agree that the many days off for professional development and holidays (beyond federal days) is also stressful on many middle class and working families. But many families at my charter have worked together to address these issues by finding more affordable care in the city and telling everyone about or informal childcare cooperatives between families.
Because I volunteer a lot I have become friends with many families, especially stay at home moms at our school and those with more money to invest in the school. I appreciate what they do for the school in addition to what they are doing for their own kids. I don't see favoritism in terms of student treatment by staff or teachers. Again, I volunteer a lot, which means my child's teacher sees me a lot at school, or field trips and sometimes in the classroom. The teacher is not giving my child all 4s or extra attention. My child gets in trouble for behavior like everyone else in the class and the teacher tells me about it.
Bottom line, I don't believe that what you describe in a pervasive problem. Or maybe my personal experience, I grew up around wealthy people (church, private school, etc.) and have always been on the margin, so I guess I learned how to deal, navigate or advocate for myself.
I also noticed that many High SES families talk about going on vacation a lot. My child has started to question why we don't go away for the whole month of August or every holiday weekend. I explain to my child that some people don't have money to go anywhere and others all the time. We go on one family vacation per year, that is what we can afford. That's life.
I also agree that the many days off for professional development and holidays (beyond federal days) is also stressful on many middle class and working families. But many families at my charter have worked together to address these issues by finding more affordable care in the city and telling everyone about or informal childcare cooperatives between families.
Because I volunteer a lot I have become friends with many families, especially stay at home moms at our school and those with more money to invest in the school. I appreciate what they do for the school in addition to what they are doing for their own kids. I don't see favoritism in terms of student treatment by staff or teachers. Again, I volunteer a lot, which means my child's teacher sees me a lot at school, or field trips and sometimes in the classroom. The teacher is not giving my child all 4s or extra attention. My child gets in trouble for behavior like everyone else in the class and the teacher tells me about it.
Bottom line, I don't believe that what you describe in a pervasive problem. Or maybe my personal experience, I grew up around wealthy people (church, private school, etc.) and have always been on the margin, so I guess I learned how to deal, navigate or advocate for myself.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 10:40
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
Anonymous wrote:You are wonderful. Sincerely, a working class DCPS teacher.
+ 1
Anonymous
05/31/2014 10:20
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
OP here. Would hope that everyone could step away from the race issue. Not mentioned once in the original post or responses to it.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 09:54
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
NP here and sorry to hear of OP's issues, whether real or otherwise - whatever the case, absolutely none of what OP describes applies to our own "in-demand, high-performance, long-waitlist, frequently-talked-about charter."
We certainly can't afford to donate thousands of dollars nor can we afford private tutoring or camps, but that never stopped us from stepping up to the plate and getting involved both in the school and in our kids education. For us that means finding free videos like Khan academy, it means the library, it means a walk to the Smithsonians on the weekend, and the only extra expense in terms of supplementing that we ever had was finding a couple of used books cheaply online. Just about all of that is accessible to anyone. Yet there are a lot of people who don't even bother. Families who've never even been to the Museum and families who don't use the library and read at home. People aren't even taking advantage of all of the free stuff that's available.
We have seen no preferential treatment or "choosing" of one kid over another. We also don't see the scales or grading as "subjective" - being involved in the school and talking to other parents at pickup - you get a sense for what goes on in the classroom and in activities.
Also, regarding Title I and FARMS - a lot of charters including "high-performing, in-demand, long-waitlist" do indeed have a lot of FARMS kids and do receive Title I funds and in fact have a lot more socioeconomic diversity than most of the DCPS schools. So please do not go around mischaracterizing all charters based on whatever skewed perception you might have there.
And also - the whole thing about a "high performing" school is that they have high expectations, high bars, and will challenge students to perform. They provide the opportunity, and they provide the instruction, but the child still has to do their part as well. They are teachers, they aren't wizards waving wands and magically swirling education into their students heads. It takes work and commitment on the part of the student and their family, and if you aren't making that commitment then you are the biggest part of your problem. Again, many DC families aren't even taking advantage of freebies like libraries and museums, families aren't encouraging their kids to read, families aren't supportive of their kids at home. That's a much bigger issue outside of the schools that needs to be dealt with, rather than going around blaming charters - dealing with that outside, broader societal issue would solve many of the achievement gap issues in the schools, whether DCPS or otherwise. But instead, people like OP want to go around scapegoating charters.
We certainly can't afford to donate thousands of dollars nor can we afford private tutoring or camps, but that never stopped us from stepping up to the plate and getting involved both in the school and in our kids education. For us that means finding free videos like Khan academy, it means the library, it means a walk to the Smithsonians on the weekend, and the only extra expense in terms of supplementing that we ever had was finding a couple of used books cheaply online. Just about all of that is accessible to anyone. Yet there are a lot of people who don't even bother. Families who've never even been to the Museum and families who don't use the library and read at home. People aren't even taking advantage of all of the free stuff that's available.
We have seen no preferential treatment or "choosing" of one kid over another. We also don't see the scales or grading as "subjective" - being involved in the school and talking to other parents at pickup - you get a sense for what goes on in the classroom and in activities.
Also, regarding Title I and FARMS - a lot of charters including "high-performing, in-demand, long-waitlist" do indeed have a lot of FARMS kids and do receive Title I funds and in fact have a lot more socioeconomic diversity than most of the DCPS schools. So please do not go around mischaracterizing all charters based on whatever skewed perception you might have there.
And also - the whole thing about a "high performing" school is that they have high expectations, high bars, and will challenge students to perform. They provide the opportunity, and they provide the instruction, but the child still has to do their part as well. They are teachers, they aren't wizards waving wands and magically swirling education into their students heads. It takes work and commitment on the part of the student and their family, and if you aren't making that commitment then you are the biggest part of your problem. Again, many DC families aren't even taking advantage of freebies like libraries and museums, families aren't encouraging their kids to read, families aren't supportive of their kids at home. That's a much bigger issue outside of the schools that needs to be dealt with, rather than going around blaming charters - dealing with that outside, broader societal issue would solve many of the achievement gap issues in the schools, whether DCPS or otherwise. But instead, people like OP want to go around scapegoating charters.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 09:12
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:
Wealthy parents are recognized as "pioneers", "friends of public education","school reformers", and "parent organization leaders". But many are really attention seekers using public education to save money and to generate their own personal relevance. Listservs are abundant at these schools coupled with a clear understanding that a large portion of the school's parents may not have regular internet or technology
A lot of what you said was interesting but for me it was almost negated by the above. Suggesting that people USE public education to SAVE money is very ugly to read. Do you think well off people should just always pay for private? Can you imagine the state of public schools if everyone who could afford private went private? This is a major problem of charter schools because more educated parents often invest more efforts in selecting a charter leaving the public schools struggling with lack of parental involvement, poverty, behavior issues, etc. it sounds like you charter school is not treating the entire student body equally. That is a big problem and I would be upset too. But you have to understand that charter schools are a breeding ground for a variety of corruption and dishonesty. Recall the recent Washington post story exposing the fact that the DC charters expel a tremendous amount of students forcing those kids back to the public schools. As soon as charters get their money they can start weeding out the undesirables.
The fact that OP actually called out the other parents as attention seekers is ridiculous. She herself has confused a lack of support for her personal endeavors with a lack of support for her children. She's doing a disservice to other middle-class, and lower SES families with her diatribe here. She's setting them up to walk into schools in the fall with a false sense of discrimination from the outset. Worse, she's doing her children a disservice by walking around with this imagined discrimination floating over her head. She needs to get over it or as pp said, move to the burbs already.
Anonymous
05/31/2014 08:37
Subject: Truth about being three coughs above FARMS at a high performing Charter School
Anonymous wrote:Look at the PTA representation of the sought after charters. I know one that was almost entirely white parents this past year. How does that fly?
At our great charter, it is like pulling teeth to get anyone to volunteer for representing parent group or to even attend meetings. Any parent can run for a position and any parent can vote for said representatives. Therefore, I suspect that the PTA at your school may be almost entirely white simply by chance due to those who chose to step up and volunteer and not due to anything nefarious.