Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, most of the decline is gang-on-gang violence.

So basically my odds of getting killed by a criminal with a gun are still about the same.

Exactly. This is empirically proven to be true. It's great that gang violence is down. However, my kid's chance of being killed in what we used to think of as a "safe" public space is much higher than it was when we were kids. Unacceptable.

Link?

Not that poster, but if you read this report: http://gspp.berkeley.edu/assets/uploads/research/pdf/0526_metropolitan_crime_kneebone_raphael.pdf

You can see the government data shows major drops in violent crime in cities between 1990 and 2008, and increases in violent crime in emerging suburbs and exurbs.

Did you actually read the article you just posted to support your statement? Although the greatest decrease in violent crime is in the cities, violent crime in the suburbs decreased by 7% over the same period. Try harder to find a study to support your predetermined position.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Most European countries have managed to maintain democracy. I don't think we are more free than they are.

Really? You'd be mistaken.

What's this based on, other than just your gut feeling? I'd lay odds I'd be far more free in the Netherlands, England, Denmark, Finland, Sweden, Switzerland, possibly even Germany. What freedoms would you lose there? Just the gun thing, right? Lord knows my reproductive freedom would increase. And a lower chance of being killed and a better education for my kids.

Then why do you choose to live here? My guess is because you have more freedom here thanks to our Constitution than any of these other democracies.

Uh, most people don't go shopping for a home country. My guess is that most people love their family and their country. But that does not mean they think it is superior in every single way.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Most European countries have managed to maintain democracy. I don't think we are more free than they are.

Really? You'd be mistaken.

What's this based on, other than just your gut feeling? I'd lay odds I'd be far more free in the Netherlands, England, Denmark, Finland, Sweden, Switzerland, possibly even Germany. What freedoms would you lose there? Just the gun thing, right? Lord knows my reproductive freedom would increase. And a lower chance of being killed and a better education for my kids.

Then why do you choose to live here? My guess is because you have more freedom here thanks to our Constitution than any of these other democracies.

Not the PP, but the decision not to emigrate wouldn't have anything to do with the economic and logistical issues associated with emigrating, the cultural issues associated with emigrating, the distance from friends and family, the need to find a new job, the need to learn a new language, etc., etc.

There are a lot of wonderful things about living in the US, but it's ok to say that there are aspects of living in other places that would be better.

Overall, the US is a great country and a great place to live, but we do have issues in some areas when compared to other developed nations. Health care outcomes, for example, are a place where we pay a lot more and get a lot less than other countries. Education is another place where what we have is good, but not as good as it could be. Social safety net and benefits - better elsewhere.

That doesn't mean that I want to emigrate, but I am capable of looking at our own society and culture without the rose colored glasses of American Exceptionalism.

America's freedoms have zilch to do with gun ownership of the general populace. It has everything to do with our Constitution and system of laws.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Most European countries have managed to maintain democracy. I don't think we are more free than they are.

Really? You'd be mistaken.

What's this based on, other than just your gut feeling? I'd lay odds I'd be far more free in the Netherlands, England, Denmark, Finland, Sweden, Switzerland, possibly even Germany. What freedoms would you lose there? Just the gun thing, right? Lord knows my reproductive freedom would increase. And a lower chance of being killed and a better education for my kids.

Then why do you choose to live here? My guess is because you have more freedom here thanks to our Constitution than any of these other democracies.

I own guns. I shoot a lot. My kids shoot a lot. I LOVE GUNS. The most effective way to save 10,000 American lives a year would be to ban handgun sales and force anyone who owns a handgun to justify the need.

The gun suicide rate is still high. per capita rate is more than twice as high as the homicide rate.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, most of the decline is gang-on-gang violence.

So basically my odds of getting killed by a criminal with a gun are still about the same.

Exactly. This is empirically proven to be true. It's great that gang violence is down. However, my kid's chance of being killed in what we used to think of as a "safe" public space is much higher than it was when we were kids. Unacceptable.

Link?

Not that poster, but if you read this report: http://gspp.berkeley.edu/assets/uploads/research/pdf/0526_metropolitan_crime_kneebone_raphael.pdf

You can see the government data shows major drops in violent crime in cities between 1990 and 2008, and increases in violent crime in emerging suburbs and exurbs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, most of the decline is gang-on-gang violence.

So basically my odds of getting killed by a criminal with a gun are still about the same.

Exactly. This is empirically proven to be true. It's great that gang violence is down. However, my kid's chance of being killed in what we used to think of as a "safe" public space is much higher than it was when we were kids. Unacceptable.

Link?

Anonymous wrote:Greater reproductive freedom in Germany? You apparently do not know that abortion is banned after 20 weeks in Germany.

And the educational system? Some schools - especially in poorer areas - are awful.

By the way, if your little snowflake screws up in 4th grade, they will be tracked to Hauptschule, where there is no free university education, and they will be expected to take a job like retail clerk or hairdresser upon completion.

I do not think you know what you are talking about.

Oh please. First of all, unlike in some states abortion is readily available. And really, you have ground this German school system axe on so many threads. It hardly represents all of Europe, or even everything about Germany.

Greater reproductive freedom in Germany? You apparently do not know that abortion is banned after 20 weeks in Germany.

And the educational system? Some schools - especially in poorer areas - are awful.

By the way, if your little snowflake screws up in 4th grade, they will be tracked to Hauptschule, where there is no free university education, and they will be expected to take a job like retail clerk or hairdresser upon completion.

I do not think you know what you are talking about.

Anonymous wrote:

Most European countries have managed to maintain democracy. I don't think we are more free than they are.

Really? You'd be mistaken.

What's this based on, other than just your gut feeling? I'd lay odds I'd be far more free in the Netherlands, England, Denmark, Finland, Sweden, Switzerland, possibly even Germany. What freedoms would you lose there? Just the gun thing, right? Lord knows my reproductive freedom would increase. And a lower chance of being killed and a better education for my kids.

What I find ironic is that it's usually the SAME people who proclaim that guns and the 2nd Amendment are what keep us free - who also constantly go around talking about the "tyranny" of the Obama administration.

Cognitive dissonance there. Either we are free, with freedom secured via private gun ownership OR we are in an oppressive tyranny. Can't have it both ways. If it were truly "tyranny" you wouldn't have any guns and would probably be locked up in a gulag as a dissident for being so whiny.

Or, the third case - REALITY which is really neither of the above.

Anonymous wrote:Also, most of the decline is gang-on-gang violence.

So basically my odds of getting killed by a criminal with a gun are still about the same.

Exactly. This is empirically proven to be true. It's great that gang violence is down. However, my kid's chance of being killed in what we used to think of as a "safe" public space is much higher than it was when we were kids. Unacceptable.

Anonymous wrote:

Most European countries have managed to maintain democracy. I don't think we are more free than they are.

Really? You'd be mistaken.

Freedom House says I'm right: http://www.freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/freedom-world-2013#.U4qN9Ra-xNx