Anonymous wrote:I love Frozen, and esp the song Let it Go. After Tangled the new Disney Pixar said they weren't doing the same old princess movies anymore and they have followed through on that promise.

Brave was about the love between a mother and a daughter.

Frozen is about the love between sisters. I have two little girls and I love talking to them about Elsa and Anna and how important sisters are in their lives (speaking as an only child).

Of course romantic love is also important, but we have an entire pantheon of princess-loves-prince movies for that. These new movies that show the other important relationships in girls' lives are absolutely the right thing for Disney to be doing right now. In fact, I bet the next movie is about a girl's love for her father.

As for Let it Go in the movie, I don't see it as the moment where Elsa becomes an antagonist. Her powers were finally revealed against her will and she ran away. While in hiding, she learned to accept her true self. She didn't know about the damage she had done to Erendale until Anna came to tell her about it, and even then she didn't know how to fix it. So it's not like she became the bad guy, or at least she was an unwitting bad guy.

I know some of you may think this thread is over-analyzing a silly children's movie, but as a parent I can tell you kids watch these movies over and over and over and over. They become ingrained in their subconscious and for that reason, they're probably shaping the future of our society. So yes, this discussion is important

The problem is that the movie is so proud of itself for undermining a sterotype (which it promptly turns around and reinforces by the way), that it doesn't bother to earn its ACTUAL plotline.

Elsa is alone and trapped and needs her sister but isn't allowed to get to know her, fine. But everything else in the movie is A) anti-feminist or B) makes zero sense

Anna is brainwashed by a (male) troll, who encourages Elsa's parents to confime their daughter and preempt her use of her power, even though we later learn that he knew all along that her power was manageable if she could channel it from a loving place.

Anna supposedly falls for a dreamy stranger because she is so naive and silly , then sees the error of her ways, but A) she sings an entire song about how lonely she is in the castle, where no one but herself, her sister and hundreds of servants ever live. So she chose utter isolation over class blindness apparently. Then she immediately gets involved with the next man she meets even after knowing him for less than 24 hours.

Elsa, whose love for her sister is supposedly strong enough to magically fix everything, TRIES TO KILL HER SISTER. She sends a monster with no other directions than to make everyone leave her alone and drives her sister off into a recently-created frozen arctic fearscape.

Anna, who again was already brainwashed by the troll king, is then newrly forced into marriage aginst her will, and it is PLAYED FOR LAUGHS.

The twist that Hans is actually a villain is completely unearned. There are zero things show. To the audience to even indicate that he is anything but an upstanding guy until the minute he transforms into a mustache-twirling villain. In a well-written film, a "twist " makes previously confusing or mysterious aspects of the show suddenly resolve themselves. In this movie, the twist makes previously clear aspects of the story suddenly feel confusing and disjointed.

And of course, because Anna rushed into a relationship with a suave, attractive prince, she deserves to be punished by having him really be the worst person imaginable. She clearly should have been rushing into a relationship with the socially awkward commoner. This is classic "nice guy" (MRA) reasoning--women chose the wrong men. Suave guys are all jerks , and women should be having sex with men who pretend to be their friends for their ( the males') own benefit.

If they wanted it to be a truly feminist, logical film with the same plot, they could have earned it by:

Showing why Anna was isolated (servants who interact with her in a reserved, perfunctory way because she's of a different class).

Have the troll be surprised that love is the key to Elsa's power.

Have Elsa regret sending a monster to, again, KILL HER SISTER, rush back to the castle looking for Anna and have the final showdown be Hans plus army of citizens destroy snow monster and Hans reluctantly imprisons Elsa. Have a weakened Anna return and have Hans valiantly attempt to "save her" via kiss but fail because it's not true love, then when Anna finds out about Elsa she goes to be with her sister once more before dying and in grief and regret Elsa embraces her and we discover that true love comes in many forms. It is actually more feminist for Anna to just not choose a prince than for him to be a secret villain.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't see the major appeal with "Let it go". I mean i get that in our world the words can mean to let your true self shine through and don't put on a facade for show BUT.... in the movie it was basically Elsa's "becoming an antagonist" song.

"Best since Lion King" really? It was a bit predictable.

WDYT?

You're out of your mind. Let it go is a fantastic song. The soundtrack is great. The songs fun.

PREDICTABLE? Sisterly love instead of "true love" saving the day is predictable? In a Disney Movie? Have you seen other Disney movies?

Seriously, I get it. It's not Shakespeare but it is a nice story, beautiful animation, great music, and a nice "life lesson." If you don't like Frozen then I don't know how you tolerate most of the Disney movies. I admit after seeing it 50 times at this point, it's old. But still a fabulous movie.

I don't have a problem with Frozen. It is cute. I think it is a nice movie that I will probably watch again. The problem is with everyone who is overhyping this movie. It isn't that groundbreaking. Sorry.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I still like Tangled better.

+1 Tangled was a thousand times better. Man-hating women love Frozen, but I actually enjoy the happily ever after aspect to these sort of movies. Made me kind of sad that the frozen sis stayed lonely.

What a weird statement. I don't hate men (am happily married to a wonderful one) but I loved the fact that the "true love" was sister love and there was no need for a man to save the day. Not every woman needs a man to be happy.

Still very corny. And unless you're asexual, finding a life mate is not a bad thing. I preferred Merida's use of love (mother/daughter) over Frozen.

It's not a bad thing, but it should not be the defining story of every woman's life. It is a good thing to see a movie that focuses on something else. I'm sure those two characters will get married before Frozen 2.

Anonymous wrote:I still like Tangled better.

+1

I love Frozen, and esp the song Let it Go. After Tangled the new Disney Pixar said they weren't doing the same old princess movies anymore and they have followed through on that promise.

Brave was about the love between a mother and a daughter.

Frozen is about the love between sisters. I have two little girls and I love talking to them about Elsa and Anna and how important sisters are in their lives (speaking as an only child).

Of course romantic love is also important, but we have an entire pantheon of princess-loves-prince movies for that. These new movies that show the other important relationships in girls' lives are absolutely the right thing for Disney to be doing right now. In fact, I bet the next movie is about a girl's love for her father.

As for Let it Go in the movie, I don't see it as the moment where Elsa becomes an antagonist. Her powers were finally revealed against her will and she ran away. While in hiding, she learned to accept her true self. She didn't know about the damage she had done to Erendale until Anna came to tell her about it, and even then she didn't know how to fix it. So it's not like she became the bad guy, or at least she was an unwitting bad guy.

I know some of you may think this thread is over-analyzing a silly children's movie, but as a parent I can tell you kids watch these movies over and over and over and over. They become ingrained in their subconscious and for that reason, they're probably shaping the future of our society. So yes, this discussion is important

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I still like Tangled better.

+1 Tangled was a thousand times better. Man-hating women love Frozen, but I actually enjoy the happily ever after aspect to these sort of movies. Made me kind of sad that the frozen sis stayed lonely.

What a weird statement. I don't hate men (am happily married to a wonderful one) but I loved the fact that the "true love" was sister love and there was no need for a man to save the day. Not every woman needs a man to be happy.

Still very corny. And unless you're asexual, finding a life mate is not a bad thing. I preferred Merida's use of love (mother/daughter) over Frozen.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I still like Tangled better.

+1 Tangled was a thousand times better. Man-hating women love Frozen, but I actually enjoy the happily ever after aspect to these sort of movies. Made me kind of sad that the frozen sis stayed lonely.

What a weird statement. I don't hate men (am happily married to a wonderful one) but I loved the fact that the "true love" was sister love and there was no need for a man to save the day. Not every woman needs a man to be happy.

Anonymous wrote:I don't see the major appeal with "Let it go". I mean i get that in our world the words can mean to let your true self shine through and don't put on a facade for show BUT.... in the movie it was basically Elsa's "becoming an antagonist" song.

"Best since Lion King" really? It was a bit predictable.

WDYT?

You're out of your mind. Let it go is a fantastic song. The soundtrack is great. The songs fun.

PREDICTABLE? Sisterly love instead of "true love" saving the day is predictable? In a Disney Movie? Have you seen other Disney movies?

Seriously, I get it. It's not Shakespeare but it is a nice story, beautiful animation, great music, and a nice "life lesson." If you don't like Frozen then I don't know how you tolerate most of the Disney movies. I admit after seeing it 50 times at this point, it's old. But still a fabulous movie.

Anonymous wrote:I still like Tangled better.

+1 Tangled was a thousand times better. Man-hating women love Frozen, but I actually enjoy the happily ever after aspect to these sort of movies. Made me kind of sad that the frozen sis stayed lonely.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's a children's movie. That said, conservatives strongly protest the feminist and supposed pro-gay messages in "Let It Go" and in Frozen itself. The movie celebrates rescue through the true love of a sister rather than a prince, and points out that some so-called princes are really asshats. Sounds like a good children's movie to me. The boys in our neighborhood love it, which I find awesome.

You're right!

There were some wacko conservatives and preachers on the internet protesting the movie and Disney. They think Disney is pushing a feminist and a gay agenda through their movies.

PP here. It's hilarious, really. These people are completely obsessed with gays.