Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 23:25     Subject: Ratios ratios
My child's KG classroom has 17 children with two teachers and the percent of FARMS is very low. I really feel bad for the classrooms with 37 children. I know it could be my child in that situation in a few years. We really need to have lower caps on classroom sizes.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 22:32     Subject: Re:Ratios ratios
Sounds like this is a school board/ superintendent issue to me. That is just wrong if other classes have 37.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 21:04     Subject: Ratios ratios
Anonymous wrote:Mount Eagle: 16 kids per 6th grade classroom and 15 in each 4th grade

Sleepy Hollow: 15 per third grade class and 17 per 5th grade class





confirmed on Dashbaord:

http://www.fcps.edu/fts/dashboard/enrollment/esenroll13-14.html

Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 20:54     Subject: Ratios ratios
Mount Eagle: 16 kids per 6th grade classroom and 15 in each 4th grade

Sleepy Hollow: 15 per third grade class and 17 per 5th grade class



Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 19:55     Subject: Re:Ratios ratios
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
As I read the original post, there is an assistant in the room, so the staff to student ratio is 19:1.




37 is still not acceptable. Especially not when there are schools with less than 15.


I keep seeing this number thrown around - schools with fewer than 15 kids in a classroom. I know of no general education classrooms that have fewer than 15 kids, and we are at a school with a high percentage of FRM eligible students. I'm beginning to think that the 15 student classroom is like the Lock Ness Monster or Bigfoot - people catch glimpses but no one has actually had a child in one. If you are, I'd love to hear it. Even at our school, while the published class size average is 19 for our school, that does not take into account the many SPED eligible children that are mainstreamed, and are in the classrooms for the full day, as the FCPS way of counting kids for SPED vs. Gen Ed does not include the SPED kids in the ratio, at least on the Dashboard. So at our school, where our count is listed at 19 average, my oldest child's classroom has 27 and the other class has 28 in there, and this is with ALL of the children accounted for. If they did a true class size average, including the kids that are in the classroom all day, our school average is closer to 25 due to a very high number of SPED eligible kids that are not in a contained classroom. So while I'd love to see the classroom with 14-15 kids in it. I'm not sure that this really exists. Does anyone in FCPS actually have a Gen Ed classroom with 15 kids in it?


Sleepy Hollow Elementary in Falls Church has several Gen Ed classes that are around that size.


Your fuzzy "facts" don't really lend much to the conversation. Report clearly or sit quietly.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 19:19     Subject: Re:Ratios ratios
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
As I read the original post, there is an assistant in the room, so the staff to student ratio is 19:1.




37 is still not acceptable. Especially not when there are schools with less than 15.


I keep seeing this number thrown around - schools with fewer than 15 kids in a classroom. I know of no general education classrooms that have fewer than 15 kids, and we are at a school with a high percentage of FRM eligible students. I'm beginning to think that the 15 student classroom is like the Lock Ness Monster or Bigfoot - people catch glimpses but no one has actually had a child in one. If you are, I'd love to hear it. Even at our school, while the published class size average is 19 for our school, that does not take into account the many SPED eligible children that are mainstreamed, and are in the classrooms for the full day, as the FCPS way of counting kids for SPED vs. Gen Ed does not include the SPED kids in the ratio, at least on the Dashboard. So at our school, where our count is listed at 19 average, my oldest child's classroom has 27 and the other class has 28 in there, and this is with ALL of the children accounted for. If they did a true class size average, including the kids that are in the classroom all day, our school average is closer to 25 due to a very high number of SPED eligible kids that are not in a contained classroom. So while I'd love to see the classroom with 14-15 kids in it. I'm not sure that this really exists. Does anyone in FCPS actually have a Gen Ed classroom with 15 kids in it?


Sleepy Hollow Elementary in Falls Church has several Gen Ed classes that are around that size.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 15:22     Subject: Re:Ratios ratios
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
As I read the original post, there is an assistant in the room, so the staff to student ratio is 19:1.




37 is still not acceptable. Especially not when there are schools with less than 15.


I keep seeing this number thrown around - schools with fewer than 15 kids in a classroom. I know of no general education classrooms that have fewer than 15 kids, and we are at a school with a high percentage of FRM eligible students. I'm beginning to think that the 15 student classroom is like the Lock Ness Monster or Bigfoot - people catch glimpses but no one has actually had a child in one. If you are, I'd love to hear it. Even at our school, while the published class size average is 19 for our school, that does not take into account the many SPED eligible children that are mainstreamed, and are in the classrooms for the full day, as the FCPS way of counting kids for SPED vs. Gen Ed does not include the SPED kids in the ratio, at least on the Dashboard. So at our school, where our count is listed at 19 average, my oldest child's classroom has 27 and the other class has 28 in there, and this is with ALL of the children accounted for. If they did a true class size average, including the kids that are in the classroom all day, our school average is closer to 25 due to a very high number of SPED eligible kids that are not in a contained classroom. So while I'd love to see the classroom with 14-15 kids in it. I'm not sure that this really exists. Does anyone in FCPS actually have a Gen Ed classroom with 15 kids in it?


My guess is that you can only find a ratio of 1 to 15 in private. 1 to 15 is definitely not the standard...haha.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 08:02     Subject: Ratios ratios
PP here. Oh, and 37 kids in a classroom is ridiculous. Aside from space consideration - how on earth can the teacher manage the educational plans of each of those kids? Even at 27 kids, our teacher struggles to differentiate in the classroom, and we don't have a very wide variety of levels.
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 08:01     Subject: Re:Ratios ratios
Anonymous wrote:
As I read the original post, there is an assistant in the room, so the staff to student ratio is 19:1.




37 is still not acceptable. Especially not when there are schools with less than 15.


I keep seeing this number thrown around - schools with fewer than 15 kids in a classroom. I know of no general education classrooms that have fewer than 15 kids, and we are at a school with a high percentage of FRM eligible students. I'm beginning to think that the 15 student classroom is like the Lock Ness Monster or Bigfoot - people catch glimpses but no one has actually had a child in one. If you are, I'd love to hear it. Even at our school, while the published class size average is 19 for our school, that does not take into account the many SPED eligible children that are mainstreamed, and are in the classrooms for the full day, as the FCPS way of counting kids for SPED vs. Gen Ed does not include the SPED kids in the ratio, at least on the Dashboard. So at our school, where our count is listed at 19 average, my oldest child's classroom has 27 and the other class has 28 in there, and this is with ALL of the children accounted for. If they did a true class size average, including the kids that are in the classroom all day, our school average is closer to 25 due to a very high number of SPED eligible kids that are not in a contained classroom. So while I'd love to see the classroom with 14-15 kids in it. I'm not sure that this really exists. Does anyone in FCPS actually have a Gen Ed classroom with 15 kids in it?
Anonymous
Post 03/27/2014 03:41     Subject: Re:Ratios ratios
22:31 Wouldn't it be nice if these ratios were for each school within FCPS? Unfortunately their own base class size ratio now going up to I think 26.75 children per teacher in elementary and greater in middle and high doesn't even meet those standards. Their state reporting happens at the beginning of the year as well, and doesn't take into account new students over the course of the year. The only way an individual school meets them under FCPS's current ratios is with a high number of FARM and ESL students who get counted as more than 1 student. FCPS's own budget aims to cut over 700 teachers next year even if they get all the funding from the BOS.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2014 22:37     Subject: Ratios ratios
Anonymous wrote:This is from the Lic Code of VA

C. Each school board shall assign licensed instructional personnel in a manner that produces divisionwide ratios of students in average daily membership to full-time equivalent teaching positions, excluding special education teachers, principals, assistant principals, counselors, and librarians, that are not greater than the following ratios: (i) 24 to one in kindergarten with no class being larger than 29 students; if the average daily membership in any kindergarten class exceeds 24 pupils, a full-time teacher's aide shall be assigned to the class; (ii) 24 to one in grades one, two, and three with no class being larger than 30 students; (iii) 25 to one in grades four through six with no class being larger than 35 students; and (iv) 24 to one in English classes in grades six through 12.


That's division wide. Plus, it doesnt take into account things that come into play such as students who receive 15 or more service hours by IEP a week don't count towards the class total. That counts for push in services.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2014 22:32     Subject: Re:Ratios ratios
Anonymous wrote:Sorry. I cannot believe that any school should have 37 to 1. There is something missing in this story. Is this a regular classroom?


We have a 6th grade science class with that many in a classroom. It happens. It's a regular classroom.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2014 22:31     Subject: Ratios ratios
This is from the Lic Code of VA

C. Each school board shall assign licensed instructional personnel in a manner that produces divisionwide ratios of students in average daily membership to full-time equivalent teaching positions, excluding special education teachers, principals, assistant principals, counselors, and librarians, that are not greater than the following ratios: (i) 24 to one in kindergarten with no class being larger than 29 students; if the average daily membership in any kindergarten class exceeds 24 pupils, a full-time teacher's aide shall be assigned to the class; (ii) 24 to one in grades one, two, and three with no class being larger than 30 students; (iii) 25 to one in grades four through six with no class being larger than 35 students; and (iv) 24 to one in English classes in grades six through 12.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2014 22:26     Subject: Re:Ratios ratios
As I read the original post, there is an assistant in the room, so the staff to student ratio is 19:1.




37 is still not acceptable. Especially not when there are schools with less than 15.
Anonymous
Post 03/26/2014 22:24     Subject: Re:Ratios ratios
Often the classrooms can't easily fit more than 30 desks in the rooms. Some of the rooms in older buildings aren't built for more than 25 desks in a standard layout. Even with all the desks up against each other, I've seen teachers have to squeeze between desks just to get by. Also, a teacher's aide may come for one or two subjects, but not the entire day.