Anonymous wrote:It is a generational thing, but my issue us that the teaching profession deserves more respect and more money so more bright, well educated college students will enter the field and stay in the field. If teachers want the same respect as lawyers and top business people then they need to dress professionally.

Teachers shouldn't throw their money away on fancy clothes when they have to work with messy little kids all day but I have been very surprised by how many of the young teachers at our elementary school dress. They wear very tight skinny jeans and heals or high boots every day. They look like they're going out downtown on a Saturday night. I hate to sound like a fuddy-duddy but these outfits are not helping their cause.

If teachers want the same respect as lawyers and top business people, then they need to get paid as much as lawyers and top business people.

Also, they need to have people judge them for what they do, instead of for what they wear.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here - I don't see her everyday so I don't know if she shows off her tatoos at school. I do know one of them might be kind of hard to hide. I also know that she wears that nose piercing everyday.

I think that talking to my kid about my views on the inappropriateness of his teacher is not a good idea. I think that it is important to his success that I appear to be supportive of her. Regardless of my views, DC needs to respect her.

I don't insist that people conform to my values. I'm not going to insist anything in this case. I just think it is poor judgment on her part and on the school.

She is not some random person that DC sees out and about. She is his teacher. Someone there to teach him academics and how to behave in the world. She is one of his primary role models. I just wonder if we should expect more since she has been given this role.

Exactly. She is there to teach him academics and how to behave in the world. What do her tattoos and piercing have to do with either?

Well, tattoos and piercings are anti-social and professional, so setting aside the distraction part of it, it also conveys a message that they're somewhat acceptable in polite society when, in fact, they will directly interfere with career advancement later in life if the child emulates the teacher. So, I do understand OP's issues.

You simply don't see tatoos in the board room.

My tattoos and my position would disagree with you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is a generational thing, but my issue us that the teaching profession deserves more respect and more money so more bright, well educated college students will enter the field and stay in the field. If teachers want the same respect as lawyers and top business people then they need to dress professionally.

Teachers shouldn't throw their money away on fancy clothes when they have to work with messy little kids all day but I have been very surprised by how many of the young teachers at our elementary school dress. They wear very tight skinny jeans and heals or high boots every day. They look like they're going out downtown on a Saturday night. I hate to sound like a fuddy-duddy but these outfits are not helping their cause.

Why are you so judgy about how people look? How about how they act? How they treat others? How they do their jobs?

Sorry, but that is just stupid. Why would a teacher dress like an attorney or wear a business suit? Should a nurse or a doctor also wear a business suit to work in order to be respected by you?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here - I don't see her everyday so I don't know if she shows off her tatoos at school. I do know one of them might be kind of hard to hide. I also know that she wears that nose piercing everyday.

I think that talking to my kid about my views on the inappropriateness of his teacher is not a good idea. I think that it is important to his success that I appear to be supportive of her. Regardless of my views, DC needs to respect her.

I don't insist that people conform to my values. I'm not going to insist anything in this case. I just think it is poor judgment on her part and on the school.

She is not some random person that DC sees out and about. She is his teacher. Someone there to teach him academics and how to behave in the world. She is one of his primary role models. I just wonder if we should expect more since she has been given this role.

Exactly. She is there to teach him academics and how to behave in the world. What do her tattoos and piercing have to do with either?

Well, tattoos and piercings are anti-social and professional, so setting aside the distraction part of it, it also conveys a message that they're somewhat acceptable in polite society when, in fact, they will directly interfere with career advancement later in life if the child emulates the teacher. So, I do understand OP's issues.

You simply don't see tatoos in the board room.

You will in 20 years. In 30 years, everyone's Grandma will have a tattoo. Focus on something important. Is she a good teacher?

Anonymous wrote:It is a generational thing, but my issue us that the teaching profession deserves more respect and more money so more bright, well educated college students will enter the field and stay in the field. If teachers want the same respect as lawyers and top business people then they need to dress professionally.

Teachers shouldn't throw their money away on fancy clothes when they have to work with messy little kids all day but I have been very surprised by how many of the young teachers at our elementary school dress. They wear very tight skinny jeans and heals or high boots every day. They look like they're going out downtown on a Saturday night. I hate to sound like a fuddy-duddy but these outfits are not helping their cause.

Why are you so judgy about how people look? How about how they act? How they treat others? How they do their jobs?

I volunteered teach at an inner city school one time to a group of 2d graders and one of them had her tongue pierced. I would pass out cold in horror if my DC at any age got DC's tongue pierced. Does that really make me some sort of a racist?

Yeah seriously. While I would be surprised by a seven year old having a pierced tongue (I just don't know if a 7 year old could properly clean and take care of a piercing like that), I know several adults with pierced tongues who are gainfully employed. Including one who graduating with a degree in computer science and math from MIT who has a successful career as a programmer. The nice thing about pierced tongues is that you can take the stud out and it can heal. My SIL had one during a rebellious teenage phase, much to my very conservative FIL's dismay, and now I would never know if DH hadn't told me.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

So this is exactly what I'm talking about. Tatoos and piercings are becoming accepted as mainstream. I don't know about you, but I worked pretty hard as a kid to do things to separate myself from the uncool adults with those being my parents and teachers in particular. Thankfully none of them had tatoos or piercings. If they had, I would have done that and more. Maybe I was a bad egg or maybe kids have changed and those "teachable" moments you all keep talking about has the desired impact and doesn't make kids go out and do exactly what their parents warned them not to do (which is what I did). Have you seen how kids are defacing themselves these days? If the bar keeps getting moved all the time, what are the kids' options for taking it to the next level? Knowing this tendency in kids to take things to the extreme, shouldn't we expect our teachers to be models of conservatism in dress and appearance at least on the job?

I have no idea what you are talking about with kids defacing themselves or whatever, but really I honestly think you have a serious case of "kids these days" syndrome; kind of like what people said women women started wearing bloomers "OMG women wearing PANTS???? What is society coming to!!!" Are you talking about those creepy people who slit their tongues and decide to look like lizards? Because that's pretty out there compared to tattoos or a piercing on the nose, and I'm confident it won't be the next huge social trend. If anything, your kid's rebellion might be to be hyper straight edge. My parents are liberal, tolerant democrats, and as part of my brother's teen rebellion he tried out being a republican.

I hope you're right.

I'm not providing any definitions about socially acceptable appearance. I just don't think that it makes sense for my kid's teacher to wear her nose piercing and show her tatoos at her teaching job. That's a choice she makes. I don't think the examples of the head scarf for religious reasons or the morbidly obese person are apples to oranges comparison here. And I hope people on this board don't really equate social acceptance of tatoos and body piercings with the social acceptability of women wearing pants.

I volunteered teach at an inner city school one time to a group of 2d graders and one of them had her tongue pierced. I would pass out cold in horror if my DC at any age got DC's tongue pierced. Does that really make me some sort of a racist?

I know people with these things can be and are successful. The impression I have is that kids have it much harder these days and that people do form impressions about people based on their appearance. We just interviewed people to fill a position here and none of them showed up with any piercings or visible tatoos.

No, but it makes you unrealistic. And kind of uptight. And, frankly, in for a bumpy ride.

have is that kids have it much harder these days and that people do form impressions about people based on their appearance. We just interviewed people to fill a position here and none of them showed up with any piercings or visible tatoos.

Perhaps at a stuffy east coast firm, but I have a couple friends from college who work out in silicon valley, first at Apple and then at startups. They just bought an over 800K house when one is 27 and the other is in their early 30s, so they can't be doing too shabbily. They go to work looking like ratty hipsters, and the wife has pink hair.

It is a generational thing, but my issue us that the teaching profession deserves more respect and more money so more bright, well educated college students will enter the field and stay in the field. If teachers want the same respect as lawyers and top business people then they need to dress professionally.

Yeah, but I am seeing more and more tech firms, journalism offices, etc. basically anything outside of old school cooperate firms and law firms are more casual and I am pretty confident that as younger people move into these areas, trends will start to change there as well. Teachers should be respected, sure, but appearances is not what is keeping bright people young people from considering it as a career, it's the pay.

Anonymous wrote:How do you know that she was "showing off" and "flaunting" her tattoos and piercings? As opposed to going about her daily business, fully-clothed, with tattoos and piercings?

If you disapprove of tattoos and piercings, and you don't want your kid to get them, then here is a strategy that might be successful: talking to your kid about your opinions about tattoos and piercings.

And here is a strategy that won't be successful: insisting that other people must conform to your opinions because your kid might see them.

+1,000

If you can't handle your child encountering all different kinds of people, then find a homogeneous private school for her.

*is. Duh!

It is a generational thing, but my issue us that the teaching profession deserves more respect and more money so more bright, well educated college students will enter the field and stay in the field. If teachers want the same respect as lawyers and top business people then they need to dress professionally.

Teachers shouldn't throw their money away on fancy clothes when they have to work with messy little kids all day but I have been very surprised by how many of the young teachers at our elementary school dress. They wear very tight skinny jeans and heals or high boots every day. They look like they're going out downtown on a Saturday night. I hate to sound like a fuddy-duddy but these outfits are not helping their cause.

Anonymous wrote:OP here - I don't see her everyday so I don't know if she shows off her tatoos at school. I do know one of them might be kind of hard to hide. I also know that she wears that nose piercing everyday.

I think that talking to my kid about my views on the inappropriateness of his teacher is not a good idea. I think that it is important to his success that I appear to be supportive of her. Regardless of my views, DC needs to respect her.

I don't insist that people conform to my values. I'm not going to insist anything in this case. I just think it is poor judgment on her part and on the school.

She is not some random person that DC sees out and about. She is his teacher. Someone there to teach him academics and how to behave in the world. She is one of his primary role models. I just wonder if we should expect more since she has been given this role.

Um, how exactly does having tattoos/piercings interfere with teaching academics or being a role model?

Anonymous wrote:

So this is exactly what I'm talking about. Tatoos and piercings are becoming accepted as mainstream. I don't know about you, but I worked pretty hard as a kid to do things to separate myself from the uncool adults with those being my parents and teachers in particular. Thankfully none of them had tatoos or piercings. If they had, I would have done that and more. Maybe I was a bad egg or maybe kids have changed and those "teachable" moments you all keep talking about has the desired impact and doesn't make kids go out and do exactly what their parents warned them not to do (which is what I did). Have you seen how kids are defacing themselves these days? If the bar keeps getting moved all the time, what are the kids' options for taking it to the next level? Knowing this tendency in kids to take things to the extreme, shouldn't we expect our teachers to be models of conservatism in dress and appearance at least on the job?

I have no idea what you are talking about with kids defacing themselves or whatever, but really I honestly think you have a serious case of "kids these days" syndrome; kind of like what people said women women started wearing bloomers "OMG women wearing PANTS???? What is society coming to!!!" Are you talking about those creepy people who slit their tongues and decide to look like lizards? Because that's pretty out there compared to tattoos or a piercing on the nose, and I'm confident it won't be the next huge social trend. If anything, your kid's rebellion might be to be hyper straight edge. My parents are liberal, tolerant democrats, and as part of my brother's teen rebellion he tried out being a republican.

I hope you're right.

I'm not providing any definitions about socially acceptable appearance. I just don't think that it makes sense for my kid's teacher to wear her nose piercing and show her tatoos at her teaching job. That's a choice she makes. I don't think the examples of the head scarf for religious reasons or the morbidly obese person are apples to oranges comparison here. And I hope people on this board don't really equate social acceptance of tatoos and body piercings with the social acceptability of women wearing pants.

I volunteered teach at an inner city school one time to a group of 2d graders and one of them had her tongue pierced. I would pass out cold in horror if my DC at any age got DC's tongue pierced. Does that really make me some sort of a racist?

I know people with these things can be and are successful. The impression I have is that kids have it much harder these days and that people do form impressions about people based on their appearance. We just interviewed people to fill a position here and none of them showed up with any piercings or visible tatoos.

Anonymous wrote:

So this is exactly what I'm talking about. Tatoos and piercings are becoming accepted as mainstream. I don't know about you, but I worked pretty hard as a kid to do things to separate myself from the uncool adults with those being my parents and teachers in particular. Thankfully none of them had tatoos or piercings. If they had, I would have done that and more. Maybe I was a bad egg or maybe kids have changed and those "teachable" moments you all keep talking about has the desired impact and doesn't make kids go out and do exactly what their parents warned them not to do (which is what I did). Have you seen how kids are defacing themselves these days? If the bar keeps getting moved all the time, what are the kids' options for taking it to the next level? Knowing this tendency in kids to take things to the extreme, shouldn't we expect our teachers to be models of conservatism in dress and appearance at least on the job?

Actually, following your argument, you should be thankful that your child's teacher does have tattoos and piercings. What child will want to have tattoos and piercings, when all of the teachers (<---uncool adults) around them have tattoos and piercings? The kids' option for taking it to the next level of rebellion will be: no tattoos, no piercings.

So this is exactly what I'm talking about. Tatoos and piercings are becoming accepted as mainstream. I don't know about you, but I worked pretty hard as a kid to do things to separate myself from the uncool adults with those being my parents and teachers in particular. Thankfully none of them had tatoos or piercings. If they had, I would have done that and more. Maybe I was a bad egg or maybe kids have changed and those "teachable" moments you all keep talking about has the desired impact and doesn't make kids go out and do exactly what their parents warned them not to do (which is what I did). Have you seen how kids are defacing themselves these days? If the bar keeps getting moved all the time, what are the kids' options for taking it to the next level? Knowing this tendency in kids to take things to the extreme, shouldn't we expect our teachers to be models of conservatism in dress and appearance at least on the job?

I have no idea what you are talking about with kids defacing themselves or whatever, but really I honestly think you have a serious case of "kids these days" syndrome; kind of like what people said women women started wearing bloomers "OMG women wearing PANTS???? What is society coming to!!!" Are you talking about those creepy people who slit their tongues and decide to look like lizards? Because that's pretty out there compared to tattoos or a piercing on the nose, and I'm confident it won't be the next huge social trend. If anything, your kid's rebellion might be to be hyper straight edge. My parents are liberal, tolerant democrats, and as part of my brother's teen rebellion he tried out being a republican.