Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 09:58     Subject: Re:Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Anonymous wrote:What's worse? Being "humiliated" by the wake-up call of possibly having to repeat a grade because a school like Basis holds you to an expectation of actually learning the material (and, that is after all why you are in school in the first place - to learn the material), or suffering the far greater, life-long humiliation that your school didn't care if you learned the material, and just socially promoted you from grade to grade, ultimately flinging you out into the adult world barely functional, barely able to read, add or subtract, and accordingly unprepared and unable to ever get a decent-paying job?

It's frankly mind-boggling that anyone with a bonafide interest in DC's educational would ever defend social promotion. Those who do have in effect already given up on the children's education and future.



The defense of social promotion is that research says that retention is worse. What students need is identification of the need for intervention and intensive remediation. Like every other public school, Basis will be required to provide that.

So, if students aren't able to keep up with the class, then Basis will need to provide a method - perhaps multiple methods - to continue to educate them according to the DC standards. If they aren't taking AP courses, so be it. If they have to hire extra staff and create extra classes, so be it. They cannot counsel those students out. They can't flunk a raft of them out either just because they're not passing advanced courses. If Basis wants a selective student body, it will have to go private.

IF DC wants a selective MS, it will have to create one using some mechanism other than weeding kids out of a charter school.
Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 09:28     Subject: Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Can a child enroll into Basis if they have failed grades at other schools?


Of course! The law does not allow for selective admissions!


However, if he wants a spot in the 7th grade or higher, he will have to pass a placement exam. There is no placement exam for 5th and 6th.

(I think the placement exam requirement is waived for the first year the school is in operation, so next year's 7th and 8th graders might not have to test in to those grades.)

How do you pass a PLACEMENT EXAM? It is a placement exam, not an admission exam! All students will take the placement exam.
Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 09:24     Subject: Re:Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?


I think it is insulting to the population to say that a school with high standards will not thrive. Students switch schools all the time. So long as a school has an interested student body and a majority of the students are succeeding and thriving (as evidenced on the DCCAS tests) why on earth would it be shut down? Not all kids are a good fit for all schools, sometimes because it is more work than the students and families realized when they registered. What is KIPP's attrition rate? Not every kid in the city applies to magnets, if it becomes clear what kind of program BASIS provides (and it lives up to the hype), why do you think kids that are not capable of handling it will apply?

I have heard through friends of a couple of kids that are registered and doing the prep courses now and are very happy with how things look. I realize there will be growing pains and bumps along the road, but my children are a few years out. My DD is at a JKLMM elementary that feeds into Deal, but I am not certain that my DD's needs are adequately met academically so we may well explore BASIS in a couple of years.


I'm the OP-- I am just reacting to those BASIS defenders stating that BASIS will hold back children. What I am concerned by is the fact that there may be many kids held back and that the classes will then squew older. My daughter is already on the young side for her class-- I fear that she would be overwhelmed starting 5th grade with several kids in the class old enough to be in 6th.

But maybe I misunderstand the seemingly blithe statements elsewhere about BASIS "just have those kids repeat a grade"-- maybe instead of having kids repeat a grade, those kids could get a seperate class with more intensive one-on-one teaching (with other peers that weren't promoted to 6th grade math), and then as soon as the child does seem to "get" 5th grade math and are caught up with your 6th grade peers in math, she can rejoin her 6th grade peers? Is this what BASIS is planning? I would feel so much better if this were the plan. That would be better not only for the student who didn't pass one particular test, but ALSO for the kids in 5th grade that won't be sitting next to an older child that is pissed off, embarrassed and bored because they are having to repeat a grade.

You ask why would a kid that is "not capable of handling" BASIS apply? First, how can a parent or child know whether or not they are capable of BASIS? Isn't BASIS saying that they are capable of taking in every child that gets in to the school? So if kids and parents actually believe THAT message and apply, can you really fault them? Second, BASIS has a very convenient location and seems to have a great track record-- why not give it a shot? Third, although a child may struggle to excel in one subject, they may excel in onthers. What if your math genius needs the accelerated learning, but can't unpack a metaphor to save their life?


Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 09:13     Subject: Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Can a child enroll into Basis if they have failed grades at other schools?


Of course! The law does not allow for selective admissions!


However, if he wants a spot in the 7th grade or higher, he will have to pass a placement exam. There is no placement exam for 5th and 6th.

(I think the placement exam requirement is waived for the first year the school is in operation, so next year's 7th and 8th graders might not have to test in to those grades.)


However, if that child does not pass a placement exam then the school will still have to figure out how to serve him/her. They cannot deny education to any student who has been admitted nor force/counsel them out. Going to be a real interesting challenge for them.
Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 09:06     Subject: Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Can a child enroll into Basis if they have failed grades at other schools?


Of course! The law does not allow for selective admissions!


However, if he wants a spot in the 7th grade or higher, he will have to pass a placement exam. There is no placement exam for 5th and 6th.

(I think the placement exam requirement is waived for the first year the school is in operation, so next year's 7th and 8th graders might not have to test in to those grades.)
Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 08:07     Subject: Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Anonymous wrote:Can a child enroll into Basis if they have failed grades at other schools?


Of course! The law does not allow for selective admissions!
Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 07:55     Subject: Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Can a child enroll into Basis if they have failed grades at other schools?
Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 07:49     Subject: Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
All of what BASIS is proposing is fine, but you will not be able to tout it as a successful PUBLIC school if its model is Darwinist.

I agree with others that what we need is a magnet MS. The only challenge I see though is the usual one in this city. I look at Banneker as an example. Here's a HS that is offering a lot of what people in certain parts of town claim they're seeking, and yet the demographics are shockingly skewed.

DCPS, please open a magnet MS in Ward 5. Then let's see what happens. Better yet, open near a metro EotR.
Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 07:26     Subject: Re:Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
What's worse? Being "humiliated" by the wake-up call of possibly having to repeat a grade because a school like Basis holds you to an expectation of actually learning the material (and, that is after all why you are in school in the first place - to learn the material), or suffering the far greater, life-long humiliation that your school didn't care if you learned the material, and just socially promoted you from grade to grade, ultimately flinging you out into the adult world barely functional, barely able to read, add or subtract, and accordingly unprepared and unable to ever get a decent-paying job?

It's frankly mind-boggling that anyone with a bonafide interest in DC's educational would ever defend social promotion. Those who do have in effect already given up on the children's education and future.

Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 06:31     Subject: Re:Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I haven't read all the post. My understanding is if a child fails a class, they will repeat that class over again. I feel there is nothing wrong with that. If you fail a college class, don't you have to take it again?


Exactly


In college there is no problem-- but what will happen iF lots of kids get held back? Will basis have a separate class for them? Or will the classes at basis sqEw older? So that average age kids are out numbered by older kids?


You understand that college is not compulsory education, right? And that the majority of Americans do not graduate from college? Middle Schools, unlike Universities, are supposed to educate everyone. If you want a selective MS, you need to go private or convince DCPS to create a magnet. Trying to create one via a charter isn't going to cut it. If too many students are struggling, it's going to look badly on the school and it will be considered the school's fault - not the students'.


I think it is insulting to the population to say that a school with high standards will not thrive. Students switch schools all the time. So long as a school has an interested student body and a majority of the students are succeeding and thriving (as evidenced on the DCCAS tests) why on earth would it be shut down? Not all kids are a good fit for all schools, sometimes because it is more work than the students and families realized when they registered. What is KIPP's attrition rate? Not every kid in the city applies to magnets, if it becomes clear what kind of program BASIS provides (and it lives up to the hype), why do you think kids that are not capable of handling it will apply?

I have heard through friends of a couple of kids that are registered and doing the prep courses now and are very happy with how things look. I realize there will be growing pains and bumps along the road, but my children are a few years out. My DD is at a JKLMM elementary that feeds into Deal, but I am not certain that my DD's needs are adequately met academically so we may well explore BASIS in a couple of years.
Anonymous
Post 05/22/2012 06:30     Subject: Re:Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Why do so many have no faith in the students of DC? I feel that if a child feels supported at school, they will do well. There are a lot of teachers that are in schools just for a pay check, and do not care if students learn or not. My friends sister is a Senior at an DC High school, and she still uses her fingers to do addition. She informed me that she ask for help, but the teacher don't help her. I went to the school with her, and it was a nigthmare! It looked more like a prison then a school. If you treat people like caged animals, that's what they will act like.
Anonymous
Post 05/21/2012 23:53     Subject: Re:Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I haven't read all the post. My understanding is if a child fails a class, they will repeat that class over again. I feel there is nothing wrong with that. If you fail a college class, don't you have to take it again?


Exactly


In college there is no problem-- but what will happen iF lots of kids get held back? Will basis have a separate class for them? Or will the classes at basis sqEw older? So that average age kids are out numbered by older kids?


You understand that college is not compulsory education, right? And that the majority of Americans do not graduate from college? Middle Schools, unlike Universities, are supposed to educate everyone. If you want a selective MS, you need to go private or convince DCPS to create a magnet. Trying to create one via a charter isn't going to cut it. If too many students are struggling, it's going to look badly on the school and it will be considered the school's fault - not the students'.
Anonymous
Post 05/21/2012 22:42     Subject: Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
22:16 here: That should have read "their comprehensive exams"
Anonymous
Post 05/21/2012 22:40     Subject: Re:Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I haven't read all the post. My understanding is if a child fails a class, they will repeat that class over again. I feel there is nothing wrong with that. If you fail a college class, don't you have to take it again?


Exactly


In college there is no problem-- but what will happen iF lots of kids get held back? Will basis have a separate class for them? Or will the classes at basis sqEw older? So that average age kids are out numbered by older kids?


Seems like an unlikely scenario, PP. I could see a family allowing a child to repeat one year at BASIS, if the child came from an underperforming school and it appeared that the additional year would enable the child to get back on track. However, allowing the child to repeat the same grade multiple times or repeat multiple grades once seems very unlikely.

Eventually, the family will come to the realization that failing repeatedly at BASIS is worse than attending their IB middle school -- even if the IB middle school is underperforming.

Anonymous
Post 05/21/2012 22:23     Subject: Re:Lack of Social Promotion at BASIS?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I haven't read all the post. My understanding is if a child fails a class, they will repeat that class over again. I feel there is nothing wrong with that. If you fail a college class, don't you have to take it again?


Exactly


In college there is no problem-- but what will happen iF lots of kids get held back? Will basis have a separate class for them? Or will the classes at basis sqEw older? So that average age kids are out numbered by older kids?