Anonymous
Post 03/16/2012 11:23     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Not the same thing, but I've seen East Coast Armenians complain about West Coast Armenians for being like the Shahs of Sunset. Is there a similar divide among the Persian/Iranian diaspora?

I still think the Armenians need to trade Kim Kardashian to another diaspora for an annoying celebrity to be named later.
Anonymous
Post 03/16/2012 09:46     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Anonymous wrote:The real problem is that these folks will be held up as examples of and representives for their ethnic community in a way that the RH women are not. People watch RH and think, "Those women are crazy". People will likely watch this show and think, "Persians/Iranians/Arabs/Muslims are crazy". Just look at the branding... It's not Real White Housewives of OC. Why do you think that is? We don'thold negative portrayals of majority cultures to be representative of those cultures the same way we do for minority or oppressed cultures.



Well..I agree with you to an extent. But right now, the stereotype that most Americans have of people from the Middle East is - terrorist, misogynistic, etc. I would say that being materialistic and out to have a good time are better stereotypes, even if they're not the best.
Anonymous
Post 03/16/2012 09:14     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
The real problem is that these folks will be held up as examples of and representives for their ethnic community in a way that the RH women are not. People watch RH and think, "Those women are crazy". People will likely watch this show and think, "Persians/Iranians/Arabs/Muslims are crazy". Just look at the branding... It's not Real White Housewives of OC. Why do you think that is? We don'thold negative portrayals of majority cultures to be representative of those cultures the same way we do for minority or oppressed cultures.
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 21:35     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Here's a writeup from an Iranian blogspot:

What is the difference Between Persian and Iranian?

Iranians claim Persian and Iranian are the same people. That is entirely wrong. Persians and Iranians are entirely different people. I will explain the difference between the two.

Persians are not a homogenous group and Persian is not a race. Natives of Iran have different origin. Persians are related in terms of culture, language, Zoarastrian religion, and history of ancient Persia. In anthropology Persians are defined as either Cromagnid with native origin or Nordic with Aryan origin (Iran: %35 Persian).

Iranians are Azeri Turks who are a major ethnic group in Iran. Iranian is a name adopted in 18 century by Azeri Turks from European books. Iran was called Khorasan for 1000 years. Iranians originate from Oghuz Turks. Iranians are defined as dinaric alpine (Iran: 40% Azeri). Currently Iranians control the regime in Tehran. Iranians/Azeri are recent migrants to Iran since 14 century.

What is stated in books about Iranians and their history and anthropology is not relevant to this discussion as we are discussing how the "Iranian" is used in Iran today. There is no Iranian ethnicity in Iran. Iranian refers to Azeri Turks in Iran. Other ethnic groups and natives of Iran have their own name such as Persian, Kurd, Lurs, Balooch, Arab , Gilani, Mazandarani, Talysh etc.

Iranians and Persians are entirely different people and belong to different subracial types. Persians are either Cromagnid with native origin or Nordic with Aryan origin. It generally means that Persians and natives have long narrow faces. Iranians are Dinaric Alpine. I Iranians originate from 30 different Azeri Turk tribes and there are also variations within them. Iranians can range from Dinaric Alpine phenotype to related dinaric types. Typical examples are President Ahmadinejad and the former President Khatami who are both Azeri Turks. (Khatami claims he is from Yazd, but that is a lie based on his phenotype analysis)

Due to propoganda by the regime all Iranians imagine they are Persians. Iranians/Azeris always present themselves as Persians and assume Persian identity.That is not the real and true. "Iranian" identity is not Persian identity.

Persians and Iranians have entirely different cultures. Persian culture is related to ancient Persia, Central Asia and Afghanistan. Iranian Culture is related to Turks in Anatolia and Caucasus.
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 21:31     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:And I should add that there is no such thing as being "Persian." The Persian empire hasn't existed for eons. Would it be appropriate for anyone to go around saying they were "Roman" or "Mesopotamian"? These civilizations haven't existed for centuries. These people are Iranians. Persia was once Iraq and Iran combined. Iraq and Iran, however, are now distinct cultures with separate ethnicities and language. One group is arab, the other is not. I think they like to call themselves Persian because the U.S. has not had good relations with Iran in many, many years and they fear discrimination.


You're an ignorant baboon, no offense. First off, Persia is a Greek word, in 1935 Persia changed its name to Iran formally under the Persian nationalist Reza Shah who had a deep hatred for Arabs, Greeks, and Turks. The man removed dozens of Arabic and Turkish words from the Persian language, and forced extreme secularization on the nation, in one case he massacred an entire city of Mullahs and to-be-Mullahs (yes, it was a different time).

Persians are an ethnic group:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_people

Iranian is a nationality:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_naming_convention

One can be a British Scot, one can be an Iranian Persian, one can be an Iranian Kurd. Take your nonsense elsewhere.

Anonymous wrote:My spouse is iranian and I can tell you that LA iranians have a lot of wealth and the show does depict the reality of iranian life and culture there. They are generally materialistic. Lots of iranian women admire blond hair so they color their hair blonde (at least the affluent ones do). Many are uncomfortable if they have the typical iranian nose and get nose jobs. They are not religious per se but more attached to their culture.


You shouldn't be married to an Iranian, but that's how America is. Everyone race-mixes and it's disgusting. I'm a Persian Jew and my family has maintained our Jewish identity for millenniums, I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race. Persian Jews who marry non-Jews are ostracized in our community.


Angry much? First of all, the ancient empire of Persia was so large and extended over a vast territory. So does this mean everyone living under that territory can now rightfully call themselves Persian? I have read that less than half of Iranians are true descendants of Persia and Persians were Indo-European. I find it hard to buy that Reza, GG, Asa, and the characters on Shahs of Sunset are Indo-European.
Second, who the hell are you to tell me I shouldn't be married to an Iranian? My father in law married was Iranian and married a Welsh woman. My cousin married a British woman also. And my husband married me. These men married non-Iranians because they said they wanted to escape the baggage that came with Iranian women..and I suspect you know what that baggage is. Race-mixing creates a stronger gene pool also. I think your country is calling, maybe you should answer that phone.
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 21:30     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:And I should add that there is no such thing as being "Persian." The Persian empire hasn't existed for eons. Would it be appropriate for anyone to go around saying they were "Roman" or "Mesopotamian"? These civilizations haven't existed for centuries. These people are Iranians. Persia was once Iraq and Iran combined. Iraq and Iran, however, are now distinct cultures with separate ethnicities and language. One group is arab, the other is not. I think they like to call themselves Persian because the U.S. has not had good relations with Iran in many, many years and they fear discrimination.


You're an ignorant baboon, no offense. First off, Persia is a Greek word, in 1935 Persia changed its name to Iran formally under the Persian nationalist Reza Shah who had a deep hatred for Arabs, Greeks, and Turks. The man removed dozens of Arabic and Turkish words from the Persian language, and forced extreme secularization on the nation, in one case he massacred an entire city of Mullahs and to-be-Mullahs (yes, it was a different time).

Persians are an ethnic group:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_people

Iranian is a nationality:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_naming_convention

One can be a British Scot, one can be an Iranian Persian, one can be an Iranian Kurd. Take your nonsense elsewhere.

Anonymous wrote:My spouse is iranian and I can tell you that LA iranians have a lot of wealth and the show does depict the reality of iranian life and culture there. They are generally materialistic. Lots of iranian women admire blond hair so they color their hair blonde (at least the affluent ones do). Many are uncomfortable if they have the typical iranian nose and get nose jobs. They are not religious per se but more attached to their culture.


You shouldn't be married to an Iranian, but that's how America is. Everyone race-mixes and it's disgusting. I'm a Persian Jew and my family has maintained our Jewish identity for millenniums, I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race. Persian Jews who marry non-Jews are ostracized in our community.


Angry much? First of all, the ancient empire of Persia was so large and extended over a vast territory. So does this mean everyone living under that territory can now rightfully call themselves Persian? I have read that less than half of Iranians are true descendants of Persia and Persians were Indo-European. I find it hard to buy that Reza, GG, Asa, and the characters on Shahs of Sunset are Indo-European.
Second, who the hell are you to tell me I shouldn't be married to an Iranian? My father in law married was Iranian and married a Welsh woman. My cousin married an Iranian man also. And my husband married me. These men married non-Iranians because they said they wanted to escape the baggage that came with Iranian women..and I suspect you know what that baggage is. Race-mixing creates a stronger gene pool also. I think your country is calling, maybe you should answer that phone.
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 15:55     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Anonymous wrote:
You're an ignorant baboon, no offense. First off, Persia is a Greek word, in 1935 Persia changed its name to Iran formally under the Persian nationalist Reza Shah who had a deep hatred for Arabs, Greeks, and Turks. The man removed dozens of Arabic and Turkish words from the Persian language, and forced extreme secularization on the nation, in one case he massacred an entire city of Mullahs and to-be-Mullahs (yes, it was a different time).


You shouldn't be married to an Iranian, but that's how America is. Everyone race-mixes and it's disgusting. I'm a Persian Jew and my family has maintained our Jewish identity for millenniums, I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race. Persian Jews who marry non-Jews are ostracized in our community.


Ah, the irony in this post. LOL
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 15:31     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
One of the guys on the show is a Persian Jew, but he doesnt represent Persian Jews much better than the bigoted PP, although for very different people.

I have many Iranian/Persian Jewish friends and they are almost all very affluent, though some are materialistic and some are not - much like in any wealthy community.
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 14:11     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Anonymous wrote:
You shouldn't be married to an Iranian, but that's how America is. Everyone race-mixes and it's disgusting. I'm a Persian Jew and my family has maintained our Jewish identity for millenniums, I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race. Persian Jews who marry non-Jews are ostracized in our community.


Wow, you're a racist, bigoted jerk, and you're proud of yourself for it? I'm in a mixed-race marriage, so I find your post particularly disgusting.

Haven't you ever heard of the dangers of inbreeding? Keep 'maintaining your Persian Jewish identity' by intermarrying, and you'll soon all be extinct anyway. Good luck with that!
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 14:06     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Anonymous wrote:"I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race."

Tee hee.




Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 14:05     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
"You shouldn't be married to an Iranian, but that's how America is. Everyone race-mixes and it's disgusting. I'm a Persian Jew and my family has maintained our Jewish identity for millenniums, I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race. Persian Jews who marry non-Jews are ostracized in our community. "

Law and Order episode.
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 14:04     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
"I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race."

Tee hee.
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 13:53     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:And I should add that there is no such thing as being "Persian." The Persian empire hasn't existed for eons. Would it be appropriate for anyone to go around saying they were "Roman" or "Mesopotamian"? These civilizations haven't existed for centuries. These people are Iranians. Persia was once Iraq and Iran combined. Iraq and Iran, however, are now distinct cultures with separate ethnicities and language. One group is arab, the other is not. I think they like to call themselves Persian because the U.S. has not had good relations with Iran in many, many years and they fear discrimination.


You're an ignorant baboon, no offense. First off, Persia is a Greek word, in 1935 Persia changed its name to Iran formally under the Persian nationalist Reza Shah who had a deep hatred for Arabs, Greeks, and Turks. The man removed dozens of Arabic and Turkish words from the Persian language, and forced extreme secularization on the nation, in one case he massacred an entire city of Mullahs and to-be-Mullahs (yes, it was a different time).

Persians are an ethnic group:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_people

Iranian is a nationality:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_naming_convention

One can be a British Scot, one can be an Iranian Persian, one can be an Iranian Kurd. Take your nonsense elsewhere.

Anonymous wrote:My spouse is iranian and I can tell you that LA iranians have a lot of wealth and the show does depict the reality of iranian life and culture there. They are generally materialistic. Lots of iranian women admire blond hair so they color their hair blonde (at least the affluent ones do). Many are uncomfortable if they have the typical iranian nose and get nose jobs. They are not religious per se but more attached to their culture.


You shouldn't be married to an Iranian, but that's how America is. Everyone race-mixes and it's disgusting. I'm a Persian Jew and my family has maintained our Jewish identity for millenniums, I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race. Persian Jews who marry non-Jews are ostracized in our community.


I'm another American happily married to an Iranian man. If you have such a low opinion and hatred of the "race mixing" in America, why don't you leave and go elsewhere? You're the disgusting one, and you give Persians and Jews alike a bad name. Shame on you.
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 13:46     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?

You shouldn't be married to an Iranian, but that's how America is. Everyone race-mixes and it's disgusting. I'm a Persian Jew and my family has maintained our Jewish identity for millenniums, I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race. Persian Jews who marry non-Jews are ostracized in our community.


Wow! You are a bigot and you sound proud of it. Oy.
Anonymous
Post 03/15/2012 13:40     Subject: Shah's of Sunset-thoughts?
Anonymous wrote:And I should add that there is no such thing as being "Persian." The Persian empire hasn't existed for eons. Would it be appropriate for anyone to go around saying they were "Roman" or "Mesopotamian"? These civilizations haven't existed for centuries. These people are Iranians. Persia was once Iraq and Iran combined. Iraq and Iran, however, are now distinct cultures with separate ethnicities and language. One group is arab, the other is not. I think they like to call themselves Persian because the U.S. has not had good relations with Iran in many, many years and they fear discrimination.


You're an ignorant baboon, no offense. First off, Persia is a Greek word, in 1935 Persia changed its name to Iran formally under the Persian nationalist Reza Shah who had a deep hatred for Arabs, Greeks, and Turks. The man removed dozens of Arabic and Turkish words from the Persian language, and forced extreme secularization on the nation, in one case he massacred an entire city of Mullahs and to-be-Mullahs (yes, it was a different time).

Persians are an ethnic group:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_people

Iranian is a nationality:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_naming_convention

One can be a British Scot, one can be an Iranian Persian, one can be an Iranian Kurd. Take your nonsense elsewhere.

Anonymous wrote:My spouse is iranian and I can tell you that LA iranians have a lot of wealth and the show does depict the reality of iranian life and culture there. They are generally materialistic. Lots of iranian women admire blond hair so they color their hair blonde (at least the affluent ones do). Many are uncomfortable if they have the typical iranian nose and get nose jobs. They are not religious per se but more attached to their culture.


You shouldn't be married to an Iranian, but that's how America is. Everyone race-mixes and it's disgusting. I'm a Persian Jew and my family has maintained our Jewish identity for millenniums, I am not going to throw away my cultural and religious identity by marrying outside of my religion or race. Persian Jews who marry non-Jews are ostracized in our community.