Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 13:31     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
13:13 Are your children in private school? My child has been in both. You suck it up in public school. OP should let this one go. It's unfortunate but questioning zero tolerance and consequences on your own, that is, without community support, is not politic!
Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 13:13     Subject: Re:How to be the best mom in this situation
Anonymous wrote:
OP here. No "slut" was not the reason of the altercation, the contentious desk was (very immature of my DD to feel entitled to a desk just beacuse she has been using it). There was a back and forth verbal excahges between my DD and the girl for 1 or 2 minutes in between classes, before many students were seated. "slut" was the only curse word used during the altercation - so I would say as a result. I have asked my DD specifically why she used that word and have learned that she did not use the word to mean any thing specific. She admitted she used the wrong word at the time to display her frustration.

Do not want to give the wrong impression, neither my DD and nor this other girl are from minority community.

To respond to other posters, I know for sure that boys are not involved and there is no previous interactions (school has just started 4 weeks back). The other girl is from a different feeder school and their friend circles are different.

I believe the authority acted stricter since my DD was on the wrong side of rules, wrong side of the racial profile (hate to beleive this one, but since I was present in the PTA when displine statistics were discusse) and the parents of the other girl has raised a huge storm over this.



No it's not. It's age appropriate. You are referring to a middle school kid not an adult. For them, in their mind, it is a big deal.

There is probably a lot more to the story but it seems like the school wants to use the idea that it is early in the year and make an example of this kid. I would never allow it to happen. I would call them on the behavior from them and demand an apology to my child for using this her to further their own agenda.

The school needs to think long term and realize that just filling in a bullying form does not equal bullying and they should know they will have to actually investigate such incidents and make informed decisions based on facts.
Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 12:36     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
Anonymous wrote:10:56 I think you're minimizing the broaer context and the reasons for OP's concern. (I'm a PP.) I've seen this happen in schools. One group feels that punishments are meted out disproportionately, which puts pressure on the administration to get stricter with those groups that are not punished as often. The administration ratchets up the zero tolerance. There is no way in hell that his altercation could be called bullying. I also think the letter home for such a minor infraction was for show so parents who complained about their group's punishment numbers could see that the administration was punishing other groups, too. I am deeply familiar with the doings that played out in a DC middle school along these lines.


That's a pretty confident statement when all you have to go on is the account of someone who (i) wasn't there, (ii) is an interested party, and (iii) feels that the punishment was unfair.
Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 12:20     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
P.S. Yes I think an altercation over a seat and one curse word is a minor altercation. I'm not condoning it in the least.

To me, OP is trying to do the right thing. She's telling her daughter was she did was wrong. But she's at odds with the school.

OP, I think your best bet is to be politic and suck it up. Going up against the school will probably make things much worse. They'll think you're minimizing what your daughter did, etc. I see no upside to doing anything as far as the school's response goes.
Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 12:19     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
Perhaps this isn't a bullying incident in the truest sense of the word, but I would suspect that there is something to the word slut that his a raw nerve with the other girl or her family whether OP's daughter knew about that or not. I can't imagine what else would make the other girl's family want to request a week suspension. But once a girl gets labeled a slut - whether it is true or not- there are a lot of problems for that girl.
Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 12:07     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
10:56 I think you're minimizing the broaer context and the reasons for OP's concern. (I'm a PP.) I've seen this happen in schools. One group feels that punishments are meted out disproportionately, which puts pressure on the administration to get stricter with those groups that are not punished as often. The administration ratchets up the zero tolerance. There is no way in hell that his altercation could be called bullying. I also think the letter home for such a minor infraction was for show so parents who complained about their group's punishment numbers could see that the administration was punishing other groups, too. I am deeply familiar with the doings that played out in a DC middle school along these lines.
Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 10:56     Subject: Re:How to be the best mom in this situation
Anonymous wrote:
OP here. No "slut" was not the reason of the altercation, the contentious desk was (very immature of my DD to feel entitled to a desk just beacuse she has been using it). There was a back and forth verbal excahges between my DD and the girl for 1 or 2 minutes in between classes, before many students were seated. "slut" was the only curse word used during the altercation - so I would say as a result. I have asked my DD specifically why she used that word and have learned that she did not use the word to mean any thing specific. She admitted she used the wrong word at the time to display her frustration.

Do not want to give the wrong impression, neither my DD and nor this other girl are from minority community.

To respond to other posters, I know for sure that boys are not involved and there is no previous interactions (school has just started 4 weeks back). The other girl is from a different feeder school and their friend circles are different.

I believe the authority acted stricter since my DD was on the wrong side of rules, wrong side of the racial profile (hate to beleive this one, but since I was present in the PTA when displine statistics were discusse) and the parents of the other girl has raised a huge storm over this.



I understand how sad and upset you are by this situation, OP - you've posted a number of times over the last day or so, which means this situation clearly isn't comfortable for you. It's normal to try to re-frame an uncomfortable event in ways that make us feel less uncomfortable. You're doing that re-framing with your words - specifically, the ones you're using and the way you're putting them together - in making the case that, based on the "other girl's" parents' response - i.e., raising a huge storm - and the "authority's" racial profiling - that's what you're saying, right, when you say your DD is on the "wrong side of the racial profile"? - she's been a victim in this place. Oops, did I type "place"? - sorry, I meant to type "situation." "Place" was the "wrong word," unlike "slut" which, I think reasonable people will agree, doesn't appear in a verbal exchange as just a "wrong word."
Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 10:05     Subject: Re:How to be the best mom in this situation

OP here. No "slut" was not the reason of the altercation, the contentious desk was (very immature of my DD to feel entitled to a desk just beacuse she has been using it). There was a back and forth verbal excahges between my DD and the girl for 1 or 2 minutes in between classes, before many students were seated. "slut" was the only curse word used during the altercation - so I would say as a result. I have asked my DD specifically why she used that word and have learned that she did not use the word to mean any thing specific. She admitted she used the wrong word at the time to display her frustration.

Do not want to give the wrong impression, neither my DD and nor this other girl are from minority community.

To respond to other posters, I know for sure that boys are not involved and there is no previous interactions (school has just started 4 weeks back). The other girl is from a different feeder school and their friend circles are different.

I believe the authority acted stricter since my DD was on the wrong side of rules, wrong side of the racial profile (hate to beleive this one, but since I was present in the PTA when displine statistics were discusse) and the parents of the other girl has raised a huge storm over this.

Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 09:35     Subject: Re:How to be the best mom in this situation
Maybe it is my inability to put things in context, but I am not sure I fully grasp the facts.

OP: Did your DD notice the girl in "her seat" and say "Move, you slut?" Or was their a verbal back and forth that escalated? In other words, was "slut" the cause of the altercation or the result of it? Where was your daughter physically when the incident happened? Was she standing over a sitting girl? Was she slamming stuff? Did she loudly talk about the girl to her friends when she did not get the seat? Middle school is tough in that there is a lot of posturing and peer perception is huge. My gut is saying just the use of the word slut was not the reason for this whole bruhaha (sp?).

Although at first glance, it seems like the school is reacting both to the bullying of a minority and trying to rectify some inequlaity in enforecement. Your DD was just in the proverbial "wrong place at the wrong time."



Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 07:53     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
1:52 Did you read the same thread that I did? OP is not condoning any of her daughter's behavior here.

Since you're holding yourself out as an arbiter of cursing, what would most apt word have been here? Slut is actually one of the lightest on the menu.

There's nothing that suggests that OP's DD isn't telling her everything. The girl would have given more information if there'd been more to give.

Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 01:52     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
I have a few questions;

1. Are all of your DD's friends in this particular class of one race and the other girl of another race?

2. Why a slut? Is the term slut disproportionately used against minorities in the school?

3. Is the girl particularly well endowed or otherwise physically constituted so as to be proverbially "asking for it"?

4. Do other people call this girl a slut? Do your daughter's friends? If so, why?

Basically calling someone a slut because they wouldn't leave a seat makes no sense. There is probably a lot going on that your daughter is not telling you. Maybe this is part of ongoing low level sexual harassment against this so called 'slut'. Maybe she has a curvy (perceived to be ethnic?) body so your daughter somehow thinks she is an easy target. Maybe this girl is liked by a guy your dd likes. If she didn't know to move from your DD's chair, then maybe she is slow at picking up social cues? ESOL?

I do know for certain that your daughter is not telling you the whole truth though so I wouldn't get comfy on that high horse just yet.

I'd also worry about what kind of messages you are teaching your dd that her first recourse is to call someone a slut!
Anonymous
Post 09/28/2011 01:02     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
I agree this isn't bullying. Seeing as it all happened publically in class, then everyone who was there knows what happen - fight over the seat and the name calling. If kids ask your daughter why she has to sit in that designated seat she can tell them because I name called. i doubt the kids in the class will have any issue with your daughter - her friends will stick by her, others will be indifferent, the other girl will not like her.

I think in some ways the issue is bigger for you as this note has gone to parents, they have asked who bullied and your child's name has come up - giving your child a reputation among parents she doesn't deserve. it is hard for you to have parents thinking your daughter is the bully and no one knowing what action you have taken.

That said, once we act, we can't always control the consequence. Don't want the time, don't do the crime.
Anonymous
Post 09/27/2011 19:13     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If I were you I would suggest to your daughter that she say to the other kids, "You are right. I made a really bad choice and acted as a bully. But now you are bullying me and that is just as bad." I wouldn't intervene with the school at this point because dealing with this push back could be a good deterent for your DD in the future.


+1


+ + 1


+++1

Also, since this incident was witnessed by your DD's friends, I would think they would be quick to make sure your DD's side got plenty of air time.
Anonymous
Post 09/27/2011 16:00     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:OP, is it possible that there were some issues before this incident? A week of suspension is a pretty strong request. Now it's possible this family is just overprotective of their child and can't bear that anyone should say a mean word to her but it's also possible that there has been something going on with your dd and the other child previous to this incident. It's hard to comment without knowing more of the ongoing climate in that classroom.

So I'm not really sure what you should do vis-a-vis the school - whether you should complain to them or not. But if the incident is a simple as you say it is, you will have to explain to your dd that sometimes shit happens. You do something that you shouldn't have done and the punishment is way harsher than it should be but you gotta buck up and work your way through it. Your kid can survive this and it will be something she can look back on and use as a learning experience.


I asked the my DD and the school whether there was any problem brewing for sometime and I did not get anything to suggest that - except once in a while the other girl sits at the contentious desk which had my DD upset (2/3 times). Cannot speak for the other family - would have definitely appreacited if they would have contacted me - I would have taken steps to make my DD apologise to her and receive consequences without public shaming (using someone else' word).

I will definitely have a chat with my DD tonight about realities of life - scientific theory about every action has an equal and opposite reaction is not always true.


Why don't you wait for that talk with your DD? It sounds like you're still struggling to gain perspective on this situation yourself. You can just tell her that you're reflecting on what happened, you'd like to encourage her to reflect, too, and the two of you will talk, say, tomorrow?

Sounds like you're focusing on the "unfairness" of the school's response with the "every action" etc., line, and not so much on how to turn this situation into a learning one for your daughter. She needs to learn not to react to conflict the way she did.
Anonymous
Post 09/27/2011 15:16     Subject: How to be the best mom in this situation
Anonymous wrote:OP, is it possible that there were some issues before this incident? A week of suspension is a pretty strong request. Now it's possible this family is just overprotective of their child and can't bear that anyone should say a mean word to her but it's also possible that there has been something going on with your dd and the other child previous to this incident. It's hard to comment without knowing more of the ongoing climate in that classroom.

So I'm not really sure what you should do vis-a-vis the school - whether you should complain to them or not. But if the incident is a simple as you say it is, you will have to explain to your dd that sometimes shit happens. You do something that you shouldn't have done and the punishment is way harsher than it should be but you gotta buck up and work your way through it. Your kid can survive this and it will be something she can look back on and use as a learning experience.


I asked the my DD and the school whether there was any problem brewing for sometime and I did not get anything to suggest that - except once in a while the other girl sits at the contentious desk which had my DD upset (2/3 times). Cannot speak for the other family - would have definitely appreacited if they would have contacted me - I would have taken steps to make my DD apologise to her and receive consequences without public shaming (using someone else' word).

I will definitely have a chat with my DD tonight about realities of life - scientific theory about every action has an equal and opposite reaction is not always true.