Why don't you think having plenty of money helps a marriage?

C9BL, back from a field trip to the fire station, and I am feeling the LOVE! What a high! I will bask in it while I can--most of my comments produce very different reactions

And it's a little scary to see how much you have figured me out--passionate is the #1 word that comes to mind when people get to know me, yikes. My mom calls me a "walking hyperbole," and says she should have named me "Anne," after Anne of Green Gables, because I am her clone.

BIGLAW mom, bless your heart, my husband is an attorney, but a gov't one, and I tell you, the challenges you face in your world are mind-boggling to me. Good for you, as you fulfill all your roles as best you can. No doubt, I could learn much from your dedication and energy.

Atheist mom, I respect your obvious devotion to your husband and your family, and I assure you, I was not trying to accuse you of coming up short. Let me explain it this way: if my faith is true, then God is LOVE, so in your love for your husband and your children, you are "knowing" Him. Of course, if my faith is false, then I really am crazy...but your love is still love, and love is wonderful.

And I also respect your need to review the data out there. There is one study that springs to mind (though there have been many), and it is the one my NFP-only OBs keep in their office:

http://www.lifeissues.net/writers/wils/wils_01naturalfamilyplanning1.html

The obvious must be stated: NFP as a method of family planning is not a happy pill you swallow. Rather, it is part of a coherent way of life, a certain kind of marriage that must include excellent communication, mutual respect, a willingness to sacrifice, patience, etc. So causation and correlation are both definitely at play.

And I believe you that NFP does not always "work." Due to some health conditions, I would almost certainly not be able to utilize NFP effectively to prevent pregnancy, and I know of other couples in a similar way. Or at least, it would require extraordinary sacrifice. But for couples who see NFP as their only morally licit option, they embrace the sacrifices, because suffering is redemptive.

And for my DCUM friends of all faiths (or lack thereof): if there is such a thing as Truth, we are all bumping into it inevitably all the time, whether we know it or not. Truth just is what is real. It can't be hoarded by a select few.

I think just about everything that has been mentioned on this thread is true...perhaps with the exception of lots of money, which I think can go both ways in terms of happiness. But otherwise...absence makes the heart grow fonder...a sense of humor really helps...forgiveness and not holding grudges, very important...long-term perspective...all very wise words.

I wish everyone happiness in their marriages!

To: C9BL. Crazy Law Mom here. Not to worry - we would definitely chat on the playground - with or without the kids (if I ever got to the playground, that is!). My SIL homeschools all 4 of her kids plus two of her husband's brother's kids. Having her in my life has made me realize how much we really do have in common as mothers, as women, and as people. I don't take you as judgmental at all. I was trying to make the point to others that we could learn from each other no matter how different we seem to be - but after a day spent in meetings and on planes (with a ten minute break for a phone consult on math homework!), I may not be at my most eloquent. Peace to you and your ever-growing and beautiful family.

I love you C9BL. Your posts made my night.

I read this thread because my husband and I are struggling through those baby/toddler years right now, and sometimes it is hard to have perspective. Thanks to those who have provided some.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Above all else: a shared faith in God

Access to the sacrament of reconciliation--to all the graces from all the sacraments

Openness to children

Humility, a willingness to ask for forgiveness and to forgive

A wild, passionate, crazy obsession with each other's bodies that gets more intense every day

Appreciation that each of us lays down our life for one other every day

The most intimate, intellectual, joyful, trusting, loyal friendship of all our friendships is with each other

After all else: a shared faith in God

I could have written this for you. You say the same thing over. and over. and over. and over. and over. and over.

Hey, crazy mom of almost 9 here. I do not mean to offend in any way. I know I've said bits and pieces about my views on marriage here and there, but I don't recall putting it all together before.

What I do see over and over here are heartbreaking stories of failed and struggling marriages. What keeps drawing me back here are these endless descriptions of marriages I don't recognize. Not that I don't know about the hard work it takes to sustain a marriage--I see that in my family and friends. What I don't see is so much bitterness and betrayal and lack of sex (at least, with your actual spouse) and frustration and selfishness and poor communication etc. Most of the spouses I know truly desire "the good" for one another.

So when I share my beliefs about a happy marriage, on this thread and others, it is in the hopes that my alternative perspective might resonate with someone who is feeling a sense of hopelessness. Research has consistently shown that faithful couples most likely have faith, pray together, forgive each other, have sex often, and use NFP rather than artificial contraception. Maybe none of that is for you, personally, but it is good to at least ask yourself, why? Why do these things help?

Its ok if you think I'm crazy. I just wish I could substitute joy for the crushing sadness I see here all the time. The way to a happy marriage is no secret. But it is countercultural.

Hey crazy mom of almost 9. I'm very sorry for my rude post. I had a pretty bad day, came home, went to yoga, and thought about this nasty post and felt bad. I'm truly sorry that I made you feel like you had to explain your nice post.

PP, my goodness, you didn't need to say all that! I am truly touched by your kindness, thank you. You must be an excellent spouse!

Look, I need to make one thing very clear: I am a complete and total screw-up. I have been a horrible daughter, a terrible wife, and an awful mother. I spent years away from my faith. (PP, we were once an atheist-atheist couple, too). I have committed most every sin there is and still have lots of bad habits from my past. Thank God none of us get what we truly deserve.

It is precisely BECAUSE of all the terrible mistakes I've made that I am drawn here. If I wanted to stay in my little Catholic bubble, I could--NOVA is good for that. Though, of course, no sin known to humanity is unknown to our community, too--goes without saying. But feeling high and mighty? The exact opposite.

As for not having anything in common...no! Are we not wives and mothers and women, trying to fulfill all our responsibilities and be happy? I might have talked to you on the playground. If I didn't have all my kids with me, would you ever have known?

And if you did see me with all of my kids, what would you think? Crazy lady? Religious nutcase? Oppressed by her husband and her faith? Or would you see highly educated, fiercely independent, deep thinking, messy but trying woman with a self-deprecating sense of humor?

I have treasured all the responses I have seen here. Thank you for sharing your wisdom.

I love crazy nine baby lady (or C9BL, brilliant, PP!). She is sweet and obviously very happy with her life and her husband. She's pretty opposite of me (she has nine kids, I don't have any of the little stinkers yet; she loves God, I'm not religious at all) but her posts always put a smile on my face because it's always so obvious that it's her and she is very... passionate about, well, everything.

To answer the OP, for me it's letting the stupid arguments go. Realizing that they add no value to the relationship and just stopping them.

She doesn't need to show you her data. I have nothing in common with the crazy nine baby lady. NOTHING. FT working mom - in BigLaw, God or whatever diety save us all - with two kids, only because I got too tipsy one night and told DH there was no way I could get pregnant at that time of the month. Oops. We planned to stop at one. We've got the nanny and the dogwalker and the yard guys and the kids in 400 afterschool activities. I mean I am the crazy working mom stereotype. C9BL is shaking her head as she reads this. I mean, how much more different could I be (and suck)? We try to talk about bringing spirituality into our lives occasionally, but we are just too damn tired. C9BL would probably run the other way if she met me in real life. But even I see a lot of valid points she makes. Plus, it obviously works for them, so accept that and be happy they found their path, ok?

Back to the OP's question:

Realizing that "happy" comes and goes. To C9BL's point, I used to be a poster on here who talked about "crushing sadness." I hated my husband. HATED. Wished his plane would go down when he went away on business trips. I wish I were making this up. But, as it turns out, people grow and change, even to the point where the person you loved and married, then hated more than you ever thought it was possible to hate someone, the person you decided actually had no good qualities, the person you thought so little of during that awful multi-year stretch, has within them the possibility to become the person who is suddenly hot, your soulmate, and the one to whom you tell everything and with whom you discuss everything. I don't know what I would do without him, even though five years ago I would have given anything to be rid of him. If I knew that then, maybe the low would not have had to be so low and painful. Maybe I could have seen a better path through that, and maybe he would not have become my enemy. Perspective and maturity - huge helps in a happy marriage.

Oh, and laughter and sex. Of course.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Above all else: a shared faith in God

Access to the sacrament of reconciliation--to all the graces from all the sacraments

Openness to children

Humility, a willingness to ask for forgiveness and to forgive

A wild, passionate, crazy obsession with each other's bodies that gets more intense every day

Appreciation that each of us lays down our life for one other every day

The most intimate, intellectual, joyful, trusting, loyal friendship of all our friendships is with each other

After all else: a shared faith in God

I could have written this for you. You say the same thing over. and over. and over. and over. and over. and over.

Hey, crazy mom of almost 9 here. I do not mean to offend in any way. I know I've said bits and pieces about my views on marriage here and there, but I don't recall putting it all together before.

What I do see over and over here are heartbreaking stories of failed and struggling marriages. What keeps drawing me back here are these endless descriptions of marriages I don't recognize. Not that I don't know about the hard work it takes to sustain a marriage--I see that in my family and friends. What I don't see is so much bitterness and betrayal and lack of sex (at least, with your actual spouse) and frustration and selfishness and poor communication etc. Most of the spouses I know truly desire "the good" for one another.

So when I share my beliefs about a happy marriage, on this thread and others, it is in the hopes that my alternative perspective might resonate with someone who is feeling a sense of hopelessness. Research has consistently shown that faithful couples most likely have faith, pray together, forgive each other, have sex often, and use NFP rather than artificial contraception. Maybe none of that is for you, personally, but it is good to at least ask yourself, why? Why do these things help?

Its ok if you think I'm crazy. I just wish I could substitute joy for the crushing sadness I see here all the time. The way to a happy marriage is no secret. But it is countercultural.

I'm happy for you, PP, that you have found happiness and what it means to you.

As an atheist married to another atheist (both from Christian upbringings), it kind of makes it sound like if we don't believe in a higher faith, we are missing something in our lives and relationship. However, you can have similar conversations/thoughts/beliefs about science, too. It is more about meshing philosophically and ethically; if for you, that means religion, that's your common ground; for us, we have found our common ground in the absence of religion. We also find it fascinating to learn more about other religions and we discuss those beliefs often too.

On another note, we practiced NFP twice - and we have two kids. Clearly I don't just ovulate once a month.

And I actually disagree about your research on faithful vs. nonfaithful. The divorce rate in the red states is just as high as in the blue states (not that they aren't all turning purple now!). I know more people of faith who have divorced than not. I'd be interested in seeing your data.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Above all else: a shared faith in God

Access to the sacrament of reconciliation--to all the graces from all the sacraments

Openness to children

Humility, a willingness to ask for forgiveness and to forgive

A wild, passionate, crazy obsession with each other's bodies that gets more intense every day

Appreciation that each of us lays down our life for one other every day

The most intimate, intellectual, joyful, trusting, loyal friendship of all our friendships is with each other

After all else: a shared faith in God

I could have written this for you. You say the same thing over. and over. and over. and over. and over. and over.

Totally out of line response. WTF is up your butt?

OP's question verbatim is: "what do you think are the biggest contributing factors toward happiness in your marriage?"

Her answer is as valid as anyone's. It works for her and her husband. She didn't tell you how to live your life. Your eagerness to piss on her reflection stands out for its pettiness in an otherwise pretty positive thread. And I say this as someone who has probably sparred with this woman on other posts as much as you have.

Yep, you're right. I'm sorry. For what it's worth, I've certainly never "sparred" with her, whatever you mean by that, but admit it was out of line.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Above all else: a shared faith in God

Access to the sacrament of reconciliation--to all the graces from all the sacraments

Openness to children

Humility, a willingness to ask for forgiveness and to forgive

A wild, passionate, crazy obsession with each other's bodies that gets more intense every day

Appreciation that each of us lays down our life for one other every day

The most intimate, intellectual, joyful, trusting, loyal friendship of all our friendships is with each other

After all else: a shared faith in God

I could have written this for you. You say the same thing over. and over. and over. and over. and over. and over.

Hey, crazy mom of almost 9 here. I do not mean to offend in any way. I know I've said bits and pieces about my views on marriage here and there, but I don't recall putting it all together before.

What I do see over and over here are heartbreaking stories of failed and struggling marriages. What keeps drawing me back here are these endless descriptions of marriages I don't recognize. Not that I don't know about the hard work it takes to sustain a marriage--I see that in my family and friends. What I don't see is so much bitterness and betrayal and lack of sex (at least, with your actual spouse) and frustration and selfishness and poor communication etc. Most of the spouses I know truly desire "the good" for one another.

So when I share my beliefs about a happy marriage, on this thread and others, it is in the hopes that my alternative perspective might resonate with someone who is feeling a sense of hopelessness. Research has consistently shown that faithful couples most likely have faith, pray together, forgive each other, have sex often, and use NFP rather than artificial contraception. Maybe none of that is for you, personally, but it is good to at least ask yourself, why? Why do these things help?

Its ok if you think I'm crazy. I just wish I could substitute joy for the crushing sadness I see here all the time. The way to a happy marriage is no secret. But it is countercultural.

Hey crazy mom of almost 9. I'm very sorry for my rude post. I had a pretty bad day, came home, went to yoga, and thought about this nasty post and felt bad. I'm truly sorry that I made you feel like you had to explain your nice post.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Above all else: a shared faith in God

Access to the sacrament of reconciliation--to all the graces from all the sacraments

Openness to children

Humility, a willingness to ask for forgiveness and to forgive

A wild, passionate, crazy obsession with each other's bodies that gets more intense every day

Appreciation that each of us lays down our life for one other every day

The most intimate, intellectual, joyful, trusting, loyal friendship of all our friendships is with each other

After all else: a shared faith in God

I could have written this for you. You say the same thing over. and over. and over. and over. and over. and over.

Totally out of line response. WTF is up your butt?

OP's question verbatim is: "what do you think are the biggest contributing factors toward happiness in your marriage?"

Her answer is as valid as anyone's. It works for her and her husband. She didn't tell you how to live your life. Your eagerness to piss on her reflection stands out for its pettiness in an otherwise pretty positive thread. And I say this as someone who has probably sparred with this woman on other posts as much as you have.

We're goofy and laugh a lot.
We truly want what's best for each other--always encouraging each other to go on guys/girls nights out.
Good sex life with deep understanding (on his part) when during periods of my life (first tri, new baby) and I don't want it---no pressure.
Communication communication communication.

We set aside time every week to discuss the things that we appreciated about each other for that week. You would be surprised how far that can get you.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Above all else: a shared faith in God

Access to the sacrament of reconciliation--to all the graces from all the sacraments

Openness to children

Humility, a willingness to ask for forgiveness and to forgive

A wild, passionate, crazy obsession with each other's bodies that gets more intense every day

Appreciation that each of us lays down our life for one other every day

The most intimate, intellectual, joyful, trusting, loyal friendship of all our friendships is with each other

After all else: a shared faith in God

I could have written this for you. You say the same thing over. and over. and over. and over. and over. and over.

Hey, crazy mom of almost 9 here. I do not mean to offend in any way. I know I've said bits and pieces about my views on marriage here and there, but I don't recall putting it all together before.

What I do see over and over here are heartbreaking stories of failed and struggling marriages. What keeps drawing me back here are these endless descriptions of marriages I don't recognize. Not that I don't know about the hard work it takes to sustain a marriage--I see that in my family and friends. What I don't see is so much bitterness and betrayal and lack of sex (at least, with your actual spouse) and frustration and selfishness and poor communication etc. Most of the spouses I know truly desire "the good" for one another.

So when I share my beliefs about a happy marriage, on this thread and others, it is in the hopes that my alternative perspective might resonate with someone who is feeling a sense of hopelessness. Research has consistently shown that faithful couples most likely have faith, pray together, forgive each other, have sex often, and use NFP rather than artificial contraception. Maybe none of that is for you, personally, but it is good to at least ask yourself, why? Why do these things help?

Its ok if you think I'm crazy. I just wish I could substitute joy for the crushing sadness I see here all the time. The way to a happy marriage is no secret. But it is countercultural.

Anonymous wrote:The biggest contributer to a 'happy marriage' ?

Not marrying a twat of a husband in the first place.

As someone married happily for 18 years, this is the best piece of advice I've seen on the thread.