Hmm...interesting. I would say to specialize in something like pediatric dentistry or even more so be an orthodontist...

The pediatric dentist my kids went to made a career change in his late 20s as a mechanical engineer into pediatric dentistry and was doing really well.

My daughter's soccer teammate's mom is an orthodontist, owned her own practice and is winding things down (practice sold, working only part-time) and will retired in her mid-50s.

IDK, there are pros and cons with just about every career. One thing that does seem consistent though is how PE is ruining many different areas - like the trades, veterinarians, etc,

My longtime friend and dentist who also owns a practice reveals to me that it’s an ongoing struggle. There is also a glut of dentist in the area. Ever wonder why you keep receiving calls from your dentist for appt reminders? My dentist also pays existing patients for new patient referrals. Not for me.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Get her into oral surgery. EASILY $500k/year out of residency and many making millions.

This is a highly competitive residency, though. Not realistic for most dental school grads.

Don’t you need to go to med school to be an oral surgeon?

We only know one oral surgeon personally and he went to dental school and then med school and oral surgery residency. An oral surgeon is a surgeon.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD is interested in dentistry. Is dentist a good profession in terms of income, work/life balance, job security? How much do dentists earn in the DMV area earn? Thanks.

You know damn well how much dentists earn. About job satisfaction, do you really think dentists enjoy bad breath in their face 20x daily? Would they do this if not for the $$? C’mon

Why do you think OP knows how much dentists earn? People may guess dentists earn a relatively high salary, but they don’t the actual number/range.

There is a difference between 200k vs 400k. I wouldn’t go through dental school if I can earn only $200k considering the cost of 4 year dental school and the delay in income. But I would go if I can earn $400k.

No, not unless you are handed an established practice and then you still have to do the work - neither fun nor easy. From your post, it appears that comp is the primary motivation but the $$ is just there anymore unless you get into oral surgery (med school)

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD is interested in dentistry. Is dentist a good profession in terms of income, work/life balance, job security? How much do dentists earn in the DMV area earn? Thanks.

You know damn well how much dentists earn. About job satisfaction, do you really think dentists enjoy bad breath in their face 20x daily? Would they do this if not for the $$? C’mon

Op would your daughter pursue dentistry if they earned teachers wages? I can’t think of anyone who would stick their hands and face into dirty mouth unless they were handsomely compensated.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a dentist and I would NEVER encourage anyone to go into it. And this comes from someone who sincerely loves the science and artistry of dentistry. It’s the people aspect that is soul-crushing. I am lucky to have wonderful employees but if any of them leave my business would be on life support as it is now EXTREMELY difficult to find employees. There is a nationwide hygienist shortage with them demanding more in pay than dentists do working in corporate dental office or even as associates. Patients have gotten more entitled and mean, particularly after Covid. Kids are graduating with $500,000-700,000 of student loan debt. There is no way they can make that worthwhile. PE is the worst thing to happen and it’s getting worse—they have now started their own dental schools that require no admissions tests and they have no clinical areas for them to learn but instead put them in “outreach clinics” which I can only assume are their corporate office where they work on paying patients. It’s completely messed up. And don’t even get me started on dental insurance. It was started in the 50s and the maximum amount has hardly changed at all yet the cost of employees, lab bills, supplies, utilities etc has gone up exponentially. You should google the salaries of insurance CEOs and then for fun compare it what it was pre-Covid.

Can you explain the deal with the dental hygienists? My dentist basically fired all his hygienists and told me they are spoilt brats and he can do their work himself lol.

OP, I still think it’s a good career compared to other jobs. All jobs suck now but at least dentists can work less than 5 days a week if they so choose or at least set their hours. Also you interact with patients on a daily basis so it’s nice that not to sit in front of a laptop all day. My friend who is an orthodontist tells us lovely stories about her patients Most of her patients are teens and tell her the most interesting stuff!

Not PP.

But this caught my eye because my dentist did my last cleaning, and that had never happened before in my entire life. I didn't ask her why, and didn't ask her where the hygeinists were.

Anonymous wrote:DD is interested in dentistry. Is dentist a good profession in terms of income, work/life balance, job security? How much do dentists earn in the DMV area earn? Thanks.

You know damn well how much dentists earn. About job satisfaction, do you really think dentists enjoy bad breath in their face 20x daily? Would they do this if not for the $$? C’mon

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seems like a lot of dental practices are being bought up by private equity. And they’re constantly pitching stuff like used car salespeople. The days of the trustworthy neighborhood dentist seem to be over.

Does that mean it’s a good time to be a dentist because you make more money with private equity backing?

What happens to these practices that have PE or VC funding? Do the owners cash out and go buy boats and private jets?

No the exact opposite.

If you are asking this question, the answer is most definitely no.

My dad was a practicing general dentist all the way up until the day he died. He loved what he did for a living, but worked extremely hard to establish his own practice starting in the 1970s. That is impossible now. And it wasn't easy then. He took on work from other dentists in our state and hacked and scraped for a long time crashing at friends' houses to get the money together to start his own shop. And took a lot of chances with a ton of loan leverage, numerous times.

My brother started working with him and has since taken over the practice. We are lucky in that its all paid for, including the real estate. All of his friends work for somebody else, except for a small handful of rural practitioners.

Its physical work. My dad was not trained to work standing up for a lot of procedures. That took its toll. People in here talking about how few days dentists work have no real understanding of the physical nature of the job.

Then imagine what it was like during COVID.

As for specialized practice - good luck landing that residency. And the GP education is already extremely expensive.

And, even when you are honest and trying to help people, they act like you are trying to upsell them. Even though poor dental health has been repeatedly proven to have significant downstream consequences. by the same token, with PE now involved, its virtually impossible to find a family run dental business anymore that doesn't upsell.

Enshitification indeed

Anonymous wrote:I’m a dentist and I would NEVER encourage anyone to go into it. And this comes from someone who sincerely loves the science and artistry of dentistry. It’s the people aspect that is soul-crushing. I am lucky to have wonderful employees but if any of them leave my business would be on life support as it is now EXTREMELY difficult to find employees. There is a nationwide hygienist shortage with them demanding more in pay than dentists do working in corporate dental office or even as associates. Patients have gotten more entitled and mean, particularly after Covid. Kids are graduating with $500,000-700,000 of student loan debt. There is no way they can make that worthwhile. PE is the worst thing to happen and it’s getting worse—they have now started their own dental schools that require no admissions tests and they have no clinical areas for them to learn but instead put them in “outreach clinics” which I can only assume are their corporate office where they work on paying patients. It’s completely messed up. And don’t even get me started on dental insurance. It was started in the 50s and the maximum amount has hardly changed at all yet the cost of employees, lab bills, supplies, utilities etc has gone up exponentially. You should google the salaries of insurance CEOs and then for fun compare it what it was pre-Covid.

Can you explain the deal with the dental hygienists? My dentist basically fired all his hygienists and told me they are spoilt brats and he can do their work himself lol.

OP, I still think it’s a good career compared to other jobs. All jobs suck now but at least dentists can work less than 5 days a week if they so choose or at least set their hours. Also you interact with patients on a daily basis so it’s nice that not to sit in front of a laptop all day. My friend who is an orthodontist tells us lovely stories about her patients Most of her patients are teens and tell her the most interesting stuff!

Anonymous wrote:I’m a dentist and I would NEVER encourage anyone to go into it. And this comes from someone who sincerely loves the science and artistry of dentistry. It’s the people aspect that is soul-crushing. I am lucky to have wonderful employees but if any of them leave my business would be on life support as it is now EXTREMELY difficult to find employees. There is a nationwide hygienist shortage with them demanding more in pay than dentists do working in corporate dental office or even as associates. Patients have gotten more entitled and mean, particularly after Covid. Kids are graduating with $500,000-700,000 of student loan debt. There is no way they can make that worthwhile. PE is the worst thing to happen and it’s getting worse—they have now started their own dental schools that require no admissions tests and they have no clinical areas for them to learn but instead put them in “outreach clinics” which I can only assume are their corporate office where they work on paying patients. It’s completely messed up. And don’t even get me started on dental insurance. It was started in the 50s and the maximum amount has hardly changed at all yet the cost of employees, lab bills, supplies, utilities etc has gone up exponentially. You should google the salaries of insurance CEOs and then for fun compare it what it was pre-Covid.

Thank you for your insight. Can you let us know your income?

I think my dentist does pretty well. He owns the business and I just paid close to $600 for a treatment that took 45 minutes. He doesn’t accept insurance so he gets his full rates. I believe my last cleaning was over $200. He does have to pay the hygienist out of that but he is only spending about 5 minutes on my exam so it’s like passive income for him since he has multiple hygienists working at a time. I think the reason the average salary is lower is because many are employees of a large practice or accept insurance. My dentist is really good and personable so even though he doesn’t accept insurance he is 100% booked.

Anonymous wrote:I’m a dentist and I would NEVER encourage anyone to go into it. And this comes from someone who sincerely loves the science and artistry of dentistry. It’s the people aspect that is soul-crushing. I am lucky to have wonderful employees but if any of them leave my business would be on life support as it is now EXTREMELY difficult to find employees. There is a nationwide hygienist shortage with them demanding more in pay than dentists do working in corporate dental office or even as associates. Patients have gotten more entitled and mean, particularly after Covid. Kids are graduating with $500,000-700,000 of student loan debt. There is no way they can make that worthwhile. PE is the worst thing to happen and it’s getting worse—they have now started their own dental schools that require no admissions tests and they have no clinical areas for them to learn but instead put them in “outreach clinics” which I can only assume are their corporate office where they work on paying patients. It’s completely messed up. And don’t even get me started on dental insurance. It was started in the 50s and the maximum amount has hardly changed at all yet the cost of employees, lab bills, supplies, utilities etc has gone up exponentially. You should google the salaries of insurance CEOs and then for fun compare it what it was pre-Covid.

OMG. What the hell? Private equity is going to destroy all of medicine. Every last bit of it. None of us will ever get good care again.

Plus the rates of dentists with debilitating neck/shoulder/back/wrist pain is extremely high.