Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean, yes. I agree.

But those shows only pick people with the most egregious stories. A normal person with normal finances isn’t exciting enough for airtime.

Exactly. How do you think these shows work, OP? They're not selecting Average Joe. They're taking Dumb Joe.

I think OP's point is that these days, Average Joe IS Dumb Joe.

In the words of the late, great George Carlin, " "imagine how stupid the average person is then realize half of all people are stupider than that."

George confused mean with median, but he's spot on otherwise.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

A car loan for a 15k used car- yes that’s a need.

Where does one find a reliable $15,000 used car that doesn’t have high mileage and isn’t going to break down frequently or need expensive repairs? No, nobody needs a $50,000 car, but I love how people on this board make it seem like inexpensive, reliable used cars are so easy to find.

They are, if you know what you're looking for. Private sales + a trustworthy mechanic. That's how I've purchased all my cars.

You’re describing the ideal way to find a car but that is no longer the case. Folks who have a quality older used car are holding onto them. Those who are selling are likely those who either: think their cars are worth more than they are , don’t like the trade in quick sale value they’d get from Carmax or have a costly issue they aren’t disclosing. Also, the supply of quality used cars has gone down. So many sub par options…even if you’re the meticulous buyer I think you are.

I believe a brand new base model bare bonds small Hyundai is a much better choice than a used car if broke and paycheck to paycheck. The ten year 100K warranty means you have little costs to own.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellen_Zentner

If you want to follow someone interesting listen to Ellen Zentner. A really amaxing economist. I saw her speak in 2009 and she told us something that sum up the American Consumer.

Back in the Financial Crisis GM started Employee Pricing on cars. And they started zero percent down and zero percent financing at same time. Some cars were $7,500 off MSRP with zero percent financing.

Ellen said on paper it should have been an amazing win for consumers on lower income.

She said a cheap Chevy Cruze model in 2009 had a MSRP of around $17,500 and with $3,500 off could be had for $14,000 and with a five year zero percent loan and zero down the car was an amazing opportunity for people to get into a base model brand new car at a crazy low payment. She expected tons to sell.

Instead consumers jumped on Escalades, Yukon Denalis, etc which was like up to $68,000 with up to $13,000 off so cost $55,000.

Their minds were like I am getting more off the Escalade and with zero percent interest and zero down the bigger the loan the more savings.

She was shocked these people did not seem to understand if they lost their job the day after buying the Escalade they still would owe $55,000 which was $41,000 more than the Chevy Cruze.

In the end people had much larger loans then in 2007 when they had to pay interest, and make a downpayment.

Anonymous wrote:Do tell us your secret PP.

There is no secret. I went to school. I went to the cheapest college imaginable. I got a job. I stayed at the job. That’s it.

Do tell us your secret PP.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The gap between rich and poor persists because poor people keep doing the things that made them poor in the first place. And rich people keep doing the things that made them rich in the first place.

Oh please. They were born into poverty. They didn’t create it for themselves. Even if you do everything “right” it takes a long time to get out of poverty.

It takes one person. It doesn’t take a long time. I was outright born into poverty. Food stamps, bugs, my parents went hungry, they were single.

I’m not special or brilliant or unique in any way.

I’m in a FB group called something like Females and Finances. Ninety-nine percent of the posts are from women in stupid amounts (and types) of debt. Klarna and that kind of crap. And half of them are on there asking about whether they should declare bankruptcy and have no knowledge about how to budget, invest, pay down debt, etc. It stuns me sometimes to see how widespread the absolute lack of literacy is and I’m grateful that I had parents and grandparents who hammered home financial education, coupled with importance of higher education.

Some people here genuinely have no idea how fortunate they are to have grown up with family that taught them about finances.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

A car loan for a 15k used car- yes that’s a need.

Where does one find a reliable $15,000 used car that doesn’t have high mileage and isn’t going to break down frequently or need expensive repairs? No, nobody needs a $50,000 car, but I love how people on this board make it seem like inexpensive, reliable used cars are so easy to find.

They are, if you know what you're looking for. Private sales + a trustworthy mechanic. That's how I've purchased all my cars.

You’re describing the ideal way to find a car but that is no longer the case. Folks who have a quality older used car are holding onto them. Those who are selling are likely those who either: think their cars are worth more than they are , don’t like the trade in quick sale value they’d get from Carmax or have a costly issue they aren’t disclosing. Also, the supply of quality used cars has gone down. So many sub par options…even if you’re the meticulous buyer I think you are.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are a consumer society. We consume a lot in this country.

Many of us on this forum who have a lot savings and investments are benefiting from other people doing the spending. Just increase the savings rate by 10% nationally and you will massive changes in the economy

The American economy is built on debt and predation. Once you are stuck in that cycle of debt, it's very hard to get out because structurally you are meant to be kept in that cycle because a lot profit from that.

The US is over retailed.
Retail real estate here is over 24 sf per capita.
Compare that to Europe's 4.5 after per capita.
Yes, the US economy is based on consumption.

The saving rate skyrocketed during Covid. People still paid rent and bought food and other necessities. It’s the discretionary spending that froze… which means that many people, including middle class, have fat to trim in their budgets.

Anonymous wrote:We are a consumer society. We consume a lot in this country.

Many of us on this forum who have a lot savings and investments are benefiting from other people doing the spending. Just increase the savings rate by 10% nationally and you will massive changes in the economy

The American economy is built on debt and predation. Once you are stuck in that cycle of debt, it's very hard to get out because structurally you are meant to be kept in that cycle because a lot profit from that.

My econ 101 teacher claimed that if everyone saved and invested as recommended then everyone's income would decrease. He also told us that people in debt are very profitable for capital owners because debtors spend the next dollar they get since they don't know if they will have another dollar the following day.

I don't know I feel like he was talking sh***t lol

Anonymous wrote:

A car loan for a 15k used car- yes that’s a need.

Where does one find a reliable $15,000 used car that doesn’t have high mileage and isn’t going to break down frequently or need expensive repairs? No, nobody needs a $50,000 car, but I love how people on this board make it seem like inexpensive, reliable used cars are so easy to find.

Thank you exactly. If I am not mistaken you can no longer find a new car under $20k. If anyone knows of a new car under $20k please let us know.

Anonymous wrote:The gap between rich and poor persists because poor people keep doing the things that made them poor in the first place. And rich people keep doing the things that made them rich in the first place.

Wrong. Wrong wrong and wrong. And stupid.

Anonymous wrote:We are a consumer society. We consume a lot in this country.

Many of us on this forum who have a lot savings and investments are benefiting from other people doing the spending. Just increase the savings rate by 10% nationally and you will massive changes in the economy

The American economy is built on debt and predation. Once you are stuck in that cycle of debt, it's very hard to get out because structurally you are meant to be kept in that cycle because a lot profit from that.

The US is over retailed.
Retail real estate here is over 24 sf per capita.
Compare that to Europe's 4.5 after per capita.
Yes, the US economy is based on consumption.

Anonymous wrote:

A car loan for a 15k used car- yes that’s a need.

Where does one find a reliable $15,000 used car that doesn’t have high mileage and isn’t going to break down frequently or need expensive repairs? No, nobody needs a $50,000 car, but I love how people on this board make it seem like inexpensive, reliable used cars are so easy to find.

They are, if you know what you're looking for. Private sales + a trustworthy mechanic. That's how I've purchased all my cars.