Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH and I both telework full time. His company does not have a physical office and mine is 1.5 hours away. (It used to be 45 mins, but moved.)

Well before Covid I was required to go in once a week. But then I had an injury (while pregnant) and had that requirement waived for two months, took 4 months after my baby was born, and then our new space wasn’t available for us and I was given another year fully remote. I only had a few months commuting 3 hours (round trip) once a week before Covid struck. We were closed with no option to report in person for 2020 and, since we reopened (some time in 2021) I’ve had no reporting requirement but choose to go in roughly once a month.

Our lives are now so built around telework (helps us juggle one daughter’s medical needs and the other’s frequent sports practices) that we would really have to revisit things. Prior to Covid / full telework I worked an 80% schedule (at 80% pay and reduced benefits) to help manage life. Since full telework (during covid) I returned to full time. So I guess at the time that extra day off / extra time was worth about $25k to me. If I returned to having that commute weekly or more, I’d consider going part time again. Given raises, 20% reduction in my income and benefits would be about $30-35k these days.

Yet somehow my Dads mom had 8 kids while working full time. You sound lazy.

As I tell my children “different families, different needs.” Your mother sounds impressive - most women I know who value advancement in their careers, a close relationship with their kids, and a happy marriage (over 20 years) would struggle with 8 kids. I’m impressed with the women I know who do a great job with 3 or more. I don’t know your grandmother’s circumstance, what help she had, if any, how she managed, or how satisfied she was with her work-life balance.

By the standards of some I probably am lazy. i prioritize watching soccer practices and tea with my friends and taking walks. I like to sit around in my pjs on weekends and do jigsaw puzzles if my kids don’t have sports. But my sister likes to spend that time training for marathons and organizing her garage.

I achieve the highest ratings (plus awards etc) I can at work while doing it remotely. This past week I was one of a handful of colleagues working (fed) because I was asked to handle a sensitive, urgent project. (So eventually I’ll be paid the same as my colleagues who are doing non-work things, but not being paid yet.)

I see no value in adding 3 or more hours commuting a week when it won’t improve my performance. My colleagues are generally in other locations all over the country. I wouldn’t be able to maintain my lifestyle. Also, for years my younger daughter had 2-3 hours a week of medical appointments (speech and occupational therapy).

When I didn’t have kids, or had only my first, we were in a different state. My commute was 30 mins and her daycare was at my office. I went everyday. I sometimes miss having a convenient office . But our lives now are too shaped around telework. (At the very least, we’d need more than one car if one person went to work, so that’s a big financial hit right there.)

There was Internet and remote work tech back in those days either. The mentality against remote work is based more on past cultural norms than objective concerns about efficiency. To be honest, the people unnerved by remote work are like the pre PC era in white collar businesses. They couldn't adopt and were slowly replaced and retired from the work place. The move to remote work, at least the type that is balanced with some in office time and some work from home time isn't going away. Those that resist that will eventually exit the workforce and a new norm welill be established again.

The next major issue will be those who resist AI and those that embrace it. Sadly I fall in the former, I refuse to embrace it and accept that I'll be left behind in the future workforce come 10 years are so - I plan to retire then.

Unfortunately there are few remote jobs I t he current climate. I’m fully remote but I need to make more money and have been applying to hybrid jobs.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH and I both telework full time. His company does not have a physical office and mine is 1.5 hours away. (It used to be 45 mins, but moved.)

Well before Covid I was required to go in once a week. But then I had an injury (while pregnant) and had that requirement waived for two months, took 4 months after my baby was born, and then our new space wasn’t available for us and I was given another year fully remote. I only had a few months commuting 3 hours (round trip) once a week before Covid struck. We were closed with no option to report in person for 2020 and, since we reopened (some time in 2021) I’ve had no reporting requirement but choose to go in roughly once a month.

Our lives are now so built around telework (helps us juggle one daughter’s medical needs and the other’s frequent sports practices) that we would really have to revisit things. Prior to Covid / full telework I worked an 80% schedule (at 80% pay and reduced benefits) to help manage life. Since full telework (during covid) I returned to full time. So I guess at the time that extra day off / extra time was worth about $25k to me. If I returned to having that commute weekly or more, I’d consider going part time again. Given raises, 20% reduction in my income and benefits would be about $30-35k these days.

Yet somehow my Dads mom had 8 kids while working full time. You sound lazy.

DP. And my grandparents raised 13 on a my grandpa’s construction workers salary. It was basically poverty, but they did own a very small home, there were a lot of hot dog dinners and no one went to college. They made it work. Conservatives love to put this type of woman on a pedestal, but do not acknowledge the mental and physical toll it takes on women. I don’t call someone lazy just because of not wanting to put themselves through that.

They are we just can’t say it. I have a lady who works for me her husnand is a big big executive. Makes a ton of money. She lives in a luxury high rise apt with underground parking, pool, gym only has two kids and full time childcare. She is remote 3x a week and when comes in leaves at 4pm. She has a 6 minute commute to work in morning. She drives and lives 3 miles from office.

She talks about how hard it is to balance! Her husband wfh on her two days in office so he does bus stop those days.

I laugh quietly. My mom our dad died young and my mom as a widow raised four kids on her own and worked full time. And dad had zero insurance or savings when died as his cancer battle ate it all up.

And my mom had it easy next to her mom raising 5 kids as a widow in Great Depression.

And my great grandma had it worse 12 kids on a single room house not heat or running water.

People today including myself are laughable. My big boss is a woman with one kid and a stay at home husband who manages house and she is always relating to the other working moms.

I have done some math recently as I moved and have a much longer commute now. Hellish actually. I take what I get paid per day, hourly, then add in the commute time, and re-do the hourly calculation.

Then, more unique to each of us, will be how much do you hate the commute, what kind of lifestyle issues does it present (needing to get home to kids, or whatever), etc. Consider that.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DH and I both telework full time. His company does not have a physical office and mine is 1.5 hours away. (It used to be 45 mins, but moved.)

Well before Covid I was required to go in once a week. But then I had an injury (while pregnant) and had that requirement waived for two months, took 4 months after my baby was born, and then our new space wasn’t available for us and I was given another year fully remote. I only had a few months commuting 3 hours (round trip) once a week before Covid struck. We were closed with no option to report in person for 2020 and, since we reopened (some time in 2021) I’ve had no reporting requirement but choose to go in roughly once a month.

Our lives are now so built around telework (helps us juggle one daughter’s medical needs and the other’s frequent sports practices) that we would really have to revisit things. Prior to Covid / full telework I worked an 80% schedule (at 80% pay and reduced benefits) to help manage life. Since full telework (during covid) I returned to full time. So I guess at the time that extra day off / extra time was worth about $25k to me. If I returned to having that commute weekly or more, I’d consider going part time again. Given raises, 20% reduction in my income and benefits would be about $30-35k these days.

Yet somehow my Dads mom had 8 kids while working full time. You sound lazy.

DP. And my grandparents raised 13 on a my grandpa’s construction workers salary. It was basically poverty, but they did own a very small home, there were a lot of hot dog dinners and no one went to college. They made it work. Conservatives love to put this type of woman on a pedestal, but do not acknowledge the mental and physical toll it takes on women. I don’t call someone lazy just because of not wanting to put themselves through that.

Not everyone can get telework guaranteed in writing with a job offer. Lots of public sector won’t do it because they are beholden to the political winds…

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish employers would stop painting telework/remote work as some super valuable luxury they “provide” to employees. Unless you work for a firm that provides a stipend or reimbursement, you are on the hook for developing your own office space and maintaining office supplies yourself, including maintaining an internet connection.

Anyway, given the flexibility it provides for pickups/dropoffs/sickdays, I would take maybe a 10-15% pay cut. That said, it’s no skin off their back to “let” you work from home and in fact requires a much lower investment. I went from making 80k for a 4-day in office job to 115k fully remote.

- Already have a home office space that i made my own happily and use outside of work
- Office supplies? I need a pen and a pad of paper which work will give me. What do I have to maintain? Massive printing? Nope
- Laptop? Work provided
- Internet? Already have it

A/C and heating, toilet paper, water

I was a SAHM with a husband who travels all the time. Once the kids got to elementary, remote work with part time hours has made having a job possible for me while still being able to handle before and after school. I can do the work entirely while they are at school. I make 50k so it is worth 50k to me.

Anonymous wrote:My DH and I both telework full time. His company does not have a physical office and mine is 1.5 hours away. (It used to be 45 mins, but moved.)

Well before Covid I was required to go in once a week. But then I had an injury (while pregnant) and had that requirement waived for two months, took 4 months after my baby was born, and then our new space wasn’t available for us and I was given another year fully remote. I only had a few months commuting 3 hours (round trip) once a week before Covid struck. We were closed with no option to report in person for 2020 and, since we reopened (some time in 2021) I’ve had no reporting requirement but choose to go in roughly once a month.

Our lives are now so built around telework (helps us juggle one daughter’s medical needs and the other’s frequent sports practices) that we would really have to revisit things. Prior to Covid / full telework I worked an 80% schedule (at 80% pay and reduced benefits) to help manage life. Since full telework (during covid) I returned to full time. So I guess at the time that extra day off / extra time was worth about $25k to me. If I returned to having that commute weekly or more, I’d consider going part time again. Given raises, 20% reduction in my income and benefits would be about $30-35k these days.

Yet somehow my Dads mom had 8 kids while working full time. You sound lazy.

My DH and I both telework full time. His company does not have a physical office and mine is 1.5 hours away. (It used to be 45 mins, but moved.)

Well before Covid I was required to go in once a week. But then I had an injury (while pregnant) and had that requirement waived for two months, took 4 months after my baby was born, and then our new space wasn’t available for us and I was given another year fully remote. I only had a few months commuting 3 hours (round trip) once a week before Covid struck. We were closed with no option to report in person for 2020 and, since we reopened (some time in 2021) I’ve had no reporting requirement but choose to go in roughly once a month.

Our lives are now so built around telework (helps us juggle one daughter’s medical needs and the other’s frequent sports practices) that we would really have to revisit things. Prior to Covid / full telework I worked an 80% schedule (at 80% pay and reduced benefits) to help manage life. Since full telework (during covid) I returned to full time. So I guess at the time that extra day off / extra time was worth about $25k to me. If I returned to having that commute weekly or more, I’d consider going part time again. Given raises, 20% reduction in my income and benefits would be about $30-35k these days.

Anonymous wrote:My commute is 70 miles per day (round trip). If you use 70 cents per mile, that's $12K per year just in commuting costs.

If you include the value of your time, I'd add 1.5 hours per day or 375 hours/year at a normal hourly rate. Or you could use the hourly rate for childcare or whatever other costs you incur while away from the house.

Childcare, dog walker, cleaning service, more take out, cost of burn out and stress on marriage and family life, costs from impact of stress andess time to exercise on mental and physical health, meals and drinks bought at work, dry cleaning, etc.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish employers would stop painting telework/remote work as some super valuable luxury they “provide” to employees. Unless you work for a firm that provides a stipend or reimbursement, you are on the hook for developing your own office space and maintaining office supplies yourself, including maintaining an internet connection.

Anyway, given the flexibility it provides for pickups/dropoffs/sickdays, I would take maybe a 10-15% pay cut. That said, it’s no skin off their back to “let” you work from home and in fact requires a much lower investment. I went from making 80k for a 4-day in office job to 115k fully remote.

Most of us already pay for home internet and have a desk or a dining room table we can work from. The added costs are...pens? Refilling the printer ink 2x per year? It's pretty minimal.

100% agree. There is more value to the employeee than the employee with telework. It’s entirely correct for it to be marketed as a benefit. Women with children especially benefited from remote and telework options during the pandemic and we’ve seen how rolling back that benefit has caused workforce participation among that demographic to drop.

My views on the value of telework to the OP align with the posters saying it depends on her overall financial picture and costs savings she will accrue from teleworking three days. If the OP will struggle financially if she makes the move then she should only make the move if dropping out of the workforce entirely is likely if she stays at five days a week. If the cut won’t significantly impact her financial picture and everything else is equal then based on the fact that she is a mother of preschool aged children who may value the better work life balance provided by fewer days in office I would say she should take the job, especially if being in office might cause her to consider dropping to part time or taking a break for a few years. There are lots of financial benefits to having good physical and mental health and keeping your foot in the door when it comes to the work.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I say zero in real world. In real world remote workers get canned first and dont get promoted

Then why a lot of people desperately want remote work or telework? You may not want it, but a lot people want it.

Your comment does not make any sense.

SAHMs, Goof offs, near retirement people want it. Terrible for young ambitious people. My last job was 100 percent remote. Not only that we did not have real work hours, just had to get stuff done. Most of my deliverables were quarterly. I had one monthly which was an update meeting that I just gave a two minute update at verbally. Even that I could skip no problem.

Trouble was they gave near zero raises and below market pay in exchange for this and very hard to get promoted. Perfect job if mommy tracking, a young kid partying or a 63-67 years old milking it. Most people who worked there quit after a year or two. It was a dead end. And you were the sacrificial lamb. It could end any moment. So unless you really did not need the money not a great job.

My one good friend there. Her husband a teacher, she had had two kids while working there and spend summers at her beach house and had no child care. If she lost her job not end of world as not even on our benefits. Even she quit after 4.5 years. It was a dead end and eventually she wake up and be 50 and useless. She did enjoy her five summers at the the beach. Her work schedule. Get up with coffee before kids and husband up, watch sun rising check slack or Jira, make breakfast kids and husband, hit the beach, come back make lunch, she check work, then either chill on deck or back to beach, check email and husband would bbq and make dinner while she had drinks on the deck. She was funny. She told me all of July and August one year she did on average 2-3 hours work a week each year.

I mean it is nice but it is to point they were going eventually can her and her skills were becoming useless and had not got a raise or bonus in her four years other than uselss RSUs and stock grants you wait years to get.

Me and her keep in touch.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's so valuable to me that while I'm not a super high earner, I wouldn't trade my lifestyle for anything - at least until my high school aged kids are out of the house.

+1 it's huge to me, my kids are in preschool and ES. I'm a lawyer and honestly the value is like $200k+ to me (as in, I wouldn't leave my WFH got a higher salary job unless it was paying that much more).

It’s definitely a deal breaker for us. One parent really needs part time or wfh flexibility (ideally both) unless you have a nanny or au pair (which would be 40-90k to get someone reliable, and part time is very hard to find). I would drastically reduce my cost of living (ie move to a townhouse and give up eating out) before I’d give up wfh. My kids are 2, 7, 9.