Anonymous wrote:Here’s some advice for you as a new manager: there is no faster way to earn the resentment of your team than to deny or question leave requests without a good cause. Clarify the process with her but approve the leave.

If the expectation is that she cover US holidays, then you need to put that in writing (with a list of dates). And ask her for a list of her country’s holidays so that you can ensure that there’s coverage for her.

Sorry to hijack this thread for one second, but what is your opinion on a manager who didn't approve an employee's request for one day off, with 12 days notice? Their rationale is they need two weeks notice. This is a job that absolutely needs a sub, and it is the overnight shift.

Here’s some advice for you as a new manager: there is no faster way to earn the resentment of your team than to deny or question leave requests without a good cause. Clarify the process with her but approve the leave.

If the expectation is that she cover US holidays, then you need to put that in writing (with a list of dates). And ask her for a list of her country’s holidays so that you can ensure that there’s coverage for her.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You could email her and remove the admin and let her know that is the week of American Thanksgiving and does she have any flexibility to switch to her original requested date or the following week. If it’s something outside of her control, and you’re ok covering for her on a holiday, then sure. But she 100% knew what she was doing and did it exactly this way to manipulate you. If it was an honest mistake and she got the dates wrong, she would have reached out to you directly, apologized for the mistake and the bad timing, knowing it’s a holiday for those of us in the US. She’s being super shady and if it were me, I would deny.

Bad interpretation and bad advice. I hate the onus being put on her -- arguably any dates are flexible for vacation if you really think about it, but the dates I want for my vacation are for my vacation. Why not respect that and if you really have no choice, just deny it?

OP, please don't listen to some of the people here and think she didn't this manipulatively. I can easily just see her changing her mind about when she wanted to take a vacation, especially if she just wants some free days to relax. I think that is the more likely explanation compared to this weird, convoluted plot of trying to trick you.

lol let me rephrase this, i was typing super fast: OP, please don't listen to some of the people here and think she did this to be manipulative.

"am i going to be considered a pushover if I deny this"

you are going to drive yourself crazy with this neurotic thinking.

Anonymous wrote:You could email her and remove the admin and let her know that is the week of American Thanksgiving and does she have any flexibility to switch to her original requested date or the following week. If it’s something outside of her control, and you’re ok covering for her on a holiday, then sure. But she 100% knew what she was doing and did it exactly this way to manipulate you. If it was an honest mistake and she got the dates wrong, she would have reached out to you directly, apologized for the mistake and the bad timing, knowing it’s a holiday for those of us in the US. She’s being super shady and if it were me, I would deny.

Bad interpretation and bad advice. I hate the onus being put on her -- arguably any dates are flexible for vacation if you really think about it, but the dates I want for my vacation are for my vacation. Why not respect that and if you really have no choice, just deny it?

OP, please don't listen to some of the people here and think she didn't this manipulatively. I can easily just see her changing her mind about when she wanted to take a vacation, especially if she just wants some free days to relax. I think that is the more likely explanation compared to this weird, convoluted plot of trying to trick you.

Anonymous wrote:This so not a big deal

Agree.

OP, I do think she manipulated you, but it does not matter unless it actually causes a problem. Do you really need coverage the day of and after Thanksgiving?

I would just keep this info in the back of my mind to see if it’s a pattern. I would also remind her of the procedure for approving leave and that it caused some confusion this time (but again don’t make her feel like you are against the leave, it’s a bad tone to set in a new manager relationship). I might even do that in writing. She will need to follow procedures in the future or you can more openly call her on it.

Do you have a team calendar? That helps our office keep track of coverage etc. I don’t always need to contact my boss if I see that someone else is out that same day. Sometimes I can switch my day, sometimes I can’t and I can talk with my boss about why.

This so not a big deal

OP sounds like she's going to be a nightmare manager

Anonymous wrote:Is the date actually a problem? Or are you just unhappy that the employee changed it without asking you first?

If the new dates don't work, then deny the vacation time and explain why.

If the dates are not the problem, then, in your next meeting with said employee, explain that the change of dates caused confusion, and suggest following the agreed-upon process next time.

It’s two days? How big of a deal will this be? The fact that you are analyzing this so deeply on a message board screams micro managed and new people manager to me.

I would try to understand what the ask is about. If this person has a family issue or got the dates confused and has already booked travel then do your best to cover it yourself. You’ll build a lot of good will. And fwiw, most people don’t keep track of other country’s holidays. I work closely with someone in Australia and can’t recall one holiday that person has taken off in four years. It’s so US centric to expect someone in the UK to remember thanksgiving.

People in Europe aren't sitting around thinking about American Thanksgiving. It's not a thing for them. Tell her the dates she now wants don't work, if they really, truly don't. Otherwise, if coverage isn't needed, or other non-US staff can cover, approve her request.

It seems like this is a bigger thing in your mind than it needs to be. Either she mixed up the dates, or she asked you about them before she booked and then she got a better price the week later when she did book.

Either way, minor stuff that all managers deal with. Seeming unsupportive of taking time off, even if you don't think you are coming across that way, will not score you any points with your direct reports.

If there is a tool (Workday for example) why all the extra emails? Why can’t she use the tool, get approved and then block her calendar as OOF for the approved days? What a bunch of unnecessary hoops.

Wtf would you think europeans know or care when american thanksgiving is? And why would you punish someone on a different continent for your own holiday?

As pps said, it's the very beginning of september. You have months - months - to get this sorted. Dont be that jerky american manager.