Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

They are test blind. But many high scorers attend these schools happily.

The point is, the number of 1570+ at T20 (other than UCs) can be estimated because the 75 percentile line is typically 1570.

But (at least in recent years) they’re mostly test optional, so the number of kids scoring 1570+ is only 25% of kids submitting scores, or less than 25% of the student body. Eg at Vanderbilt (#18), half of all students were TO, so even though the 75th percentile score is 1560, that only represents 1/8th of the student body. The cutoff for the top 25% of the class would be the median reported score, which was 1540. If you assume that 25% of students at Vandy scored 1570+, you’d be dramatically overstating the number of seats at Vandy available for high-scoring students.

UCs are test blind, not TO. They won't even look at your SAT even if you submit, and I think there's no place to submit it -- someone correct me if I'm wrong about this part.

You’re correct that UCs are test blind. But even a test-blind school can enroll a lot of high-scoring students if it has a strong reputation, selects based on factors correlated with SAT score (all UCs use GPA; UCLA and UCB use AP scores), and offers most of them (ie, in-state students) a good price.

lol UC is all about geography and social mobility for in state. Out of state is about money.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

They are test blind. But many high scorers attend these schools happily.

The point is, the number of 1570+ at T20 (other than UCs) can be estimated because the 75 percentile line is typically 1570.

But (at least in recent years) they’re mostly test optional, so the number of kids scoring 1570+ is only 25% of kids submitting scores, or less than 25% of the student body. Eg at Vanderbilt (#18), half of all students were TO, so even though the 75th percentile score is 1560, that only represents 1/8th of the student body. The cutoff for the top 25% of the class would be the median reported score, which was 1540. If you assume that 25% of students at Vandy scored 1570+, you’d be dramatically overstating the number of seats at Vandy available for high-scoring students.

The number comes out correct, albeit it's just an estimate. Also, we are talking about this year, not in the past years.

6 ivies are test required. 25% of all admits: ~3500
12 other T20 are test optional, ~1/8 of all admits: ~3500

6000-8000 1570+ go to T20. It's an estimate, I can assure you the number would not be 700. It's in that range.

Ok, I follow you that far. But 6,000-8,000 is less than half of your ~17,000 students scoring 1570+. (And where is that number from? Percentiles?) Almost all these schools super score, too, so if your 17,000 is not super-scored, then the real pool is quite a bit larger. And even assuming the pool is only 17,000, the conclusion would still be that the majority of 1570+ students DO NOT attend T20 private schools.

And I’d want to see some numbers on how many high-scoring kids are at small LACs or merit-granting privates as opposed to large state schools. Schools like Williams and Grinnell are small, and so far as I know all are test optional. Yet you have them enrolling more than twice as many high-scoring kids as large, test-required state schools like Purdue and Georgia. Why?

That's good enough. I am always amazed by people debating minor details on this site.
7000/17000 (or "a bit larger") is good enough for me.
Maybe a DP will pick up this and continue the exchange.

Well I’m asking for those of us with 1570+ kids who don’t have a shot at T20s. They have to go somewhere, and it would be nice if they could go somewhere where there is a healthy peer group of similarly smart kids. Sue me for trying to figure out where that might be.

I certainly understand not counting on a T20 for your kid, good to be aware of the reality of 95%+ rejection rates that are the norm for private schools in that tier and not much higher for the publics. However, there still is probably a shot with your kid's stats for a T20 so keep an open mind. My unhooked DC with 1550 SAT, 5's on all AP's, top 5% of graduating class with strong EC's (but not curing cancer, Olympics etc), STEM major did well in RD- got into 4 T20's, including an Ivy. Just don't fall in love with any school unless/until it loves your kid back. It is a numbers game, group them by characteristics (size, type of location, public/private) . High Stats kids should apply to more schools, they can face yield protection from the T50-30 target schools.

Low to mid 1500s + public high schools (unless it’s TJ, Stuy, Bx Science) + engineering/CS major = state schools

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

They are test blind. But many high scorers attend these schools happily.

The point is, the number of 1570+ at T20 (other than UCs) can be estimated because the 75 percentile line is typically 1570.

But (at least in recent years) they’re mostly test optional, so the number of kids scoring 1570+ is only 25% of kids submitting scores, or less than 25% of the student body. Eg at Vanderbilt (#18), half of all students were TO, so even though the 75th percentile score is 1560, that only represents 1/8th of the student body. The cutoff for the top 25% of the class would be the median reported score, which was 1540. If you assume that 25% of students at Vandy scored 1570+, you’d be dramatically overstating the number of seats at Vandy available for high-scoring students.

UCs are test blind, not TO. They won't even look at your SAT even if you submit, and I think there's no place to submit it -- someone correct me if I'm wrong about this part.

You’re correct that UCs are test blind. But even a test-blind school can enroll a lot of high-scoring students if it has a strong reputation, selects based on factors correlated with SAT score (all UCs use GPA; UCLA and UCB use AP scores), and offers most of them (ie, in-state students) a good price.

My 1570 NMF kid is at Berkeley.and most of his friends had high SAT scores.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

They are test blind. But many high scorers attend these schools happily.

The point is, the number of 1570+ at T20 (other than UCs) can be estimated because the 75 percentile line is typically 1570.

But (at least in recent years) they’re mostly test optional, so the number of kids scoring 1570+ is only 25% of kids submitting scores, or less than 25% of the student body. Eg at Vanderbilt (#18), half of all students were TO, so even though the 75th percentile score is 1560, that only represents 1/8th of the student body. The cutoff for the top 25% of the class would be the median reported score, which was 1540. If you assume that 25% of students at Vandy scored 1570+, you’d be dramatically overstating the number of seats at Vandy available for high-scoring students.

The number comes out correct, albeit it's just an estimate. Also, we are talking about this year, not in the past years.

6 ivies are test required. 25% of all admits: ~3500
12 other T20 are test optional, ~1/8 of all admits: ~3500

6000-8000 1570+ go to T20. It's an estimate, I can assure you the number would not be 700. It's in that range.

Ok, I follow you that far. But 6,000-8,000 is less than half of your ~17,000 students scoring 1570+. (And where is that number from? Percentiles?) Almost all these schools super score, too, so if your 17,000 is not super-scored, then the real pool is quite a bit larger. And even assuming the pool is only 17,000, the conclusion would still be that the majority of 1570+ students DO NOT attend T20 private schools.

And I’d want to see some numbers on how many high-scoring kids are at small LACs or merit-granting privates as opposed to large state schools. Schools like Williams and Grinnell are small, and so far as I know all are test optional. Yet you have them enrolling more than twice as many high-scoring kids as large, test-required state schools like Purdue and Georgia. Why?

That's good enough. I am always amazed by people debating minor details on this site.
7000/17000 (or "a bit larger") is good enough for me.
Maybe a DP will pick up this and continue the exchange.

Well I’m asking for those of us with 1570+ kids who don’t have a shot at T20s. They have to go somewhere, and it would be nice if they could go somewhere where there is a healthy peer group of similarly smart kids. Sue me for trying to figure out where that might be.

1540, Purdue engineering

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

They are test blind. But many high scorers attend these schools happily.

The point is, the number of 1570+ at T20 (other than UCs) can be estimated because the 75 percentile line is typically 1570.

But (at least in recent years) they’re mostly test optional, so the number of kids scoring 1570+ is only 25% of kids submitting scores, or less than 25% of the student body. Eg at Vanderbilt (#18), half of all students were TO, so even though the 75th percentile score is 1560, that only represents 1/8th of the student body. The cutoff for the top 25% of the class would be the median reported score, which was 1540. If you assume that 25% of students at Vandy scored 1570+, you’d be dramatically overstating the number of seats at Vandy available for high-scoring students.

UCs are test blind, not TO. They won't even look at your SAT even if you submit, and I think there's no place to submit it -- someone correct me if I'm wrong about this part.

You’re correct that UCs are test blind. But even a test-blind school can enroll a lot of high-scoring students if it has a strong reputation, selects based on factors correlated with SAT score (all UCs use GPA; UCLA and UCB use AP scores), and offers most of them (ie, in-state students) a good price.

Waiting for USNWR to create a couple of new categories: Top Test Optional Schools and Top Test Blind Schools, for the 2% of families who care about them.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

They are test blind. But many high scorers attend these schools happily.

The point is, the number of 1570+ at T20 (other than UCs) can be estimated because the 75 percentile line is typically 1570.

But (at least in recent years) they’re mostly test optional, so the number of kids scoring 1570+ is only 25% of kids submitting scores, or less than 25% of the student body. Eg at Vanderbilt (#18), half of all students were TO, so even though the 75th percentile score is 1560, that only represents 1/8th of the student body. The cutoff for the top 25% of the class would be the median reported score, which was 1540. If you assume that 25% of students at Vandy scored 1570+, you’d be dramatically overstating the number of seats at Vandy available for high-scoring students.

The number comes out correct, albeit it's just an estimate. Also, we are talking about this year, not in the past years.

6 ivies are test required. 25% of all admits: ~3500
12 other T20 are test optional, ~1/8 of all admits: ~3500

6000-8000 1570+ go to T20. It's an estimate, I can assure you the number would not be 700. It's in that range.

Ok, I follow you that far. But 6,000-8,000 is less than half of your ~17,000 students scoring 1570+. (And where is that number from? Percentiles?) Almost all these schools super score, too, so if your 17,000 is not super-scored, then the real pool is quite a bit larger. And even assuming the pool is only 17,000, the conclusion would still be that the majority of 1570+ students DO NOT attend T20 private schools.

And I’d want to see some numbers on how many high-scoring kids are at small LACs or merit-granting privates as opposed to large state schools. Schools like Williams and Grinnell are small, and so far as I know all are test optional. Yet you have them enrolling more than twice as many high-scoring kids as large, test-required state schools like Purdue and Georgia. Why?

That's good enough. I am always amazed by people debating minor details on this site.
7000/17000 (or "a bit larger") is good enough for me.
Maybe a DP will pick up this and continue the exchange.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are ppl willing to share generic profiles over last 2 years for high test score kids results (year, stats, major, public/private HS, general ECs, spike/hook)?

Curious where the high-test-score kids end up, and for which major.

What do you consider high?

35/1550

lol you're an idiot.

I think that is generally what is considered “high” test scores by most top 20s, college counselors, reddit forums, etc.

Actually, 34/1500 is the entry point. Rest is based on ECs, rigor, LORs, etc etc.

Anonymous wrote:Are ppl willing to share generic profiles over last 2 years for high test score kids results (year, stats, major, public/private HS, general ECs, spike/hook)?

Curious where the high-test-score kids end up, and for which major.

35 ACT, 4.8 GPA, NMF, and all the right things (EC, leadership, full pay), did not get into MI

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

No public school is top 20 for undergraduate education.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

They are test blind. But many high scorers attend these schools happily.

The point is, the number of 1570+ at T20 (other than UCs) can be estimated because the 75 percentile line is typically 1570.

But (at least in recent years) they’re mostly test optional, so the number of kids scoring 1570+ is only 25% of kids submitting scores, or less than 25% of the student body. Eg at Vanderbilt (#18), half of all students were TO, so even though the 75th percentile score is 1560, that only represents 1/8th of the student body. The cutoff for the top 25% of the class would be the median reported score, which was 1540. If you assume that 25% of students at Vandy scored 1570+, you’d be dramatically overstating the number of seats at Vandy available for high-scoring students.

The number comes out correct, albeit it's just an estimate. Also, we are talking about this year, not in the past years.

6 ivies are test required. 25% of all admits: ~3500
12 other T20 are test optional, ~1/8 of all admits: ~3500

6000-8000 1570+ go to T20. It's an estimate, I can assure you the number would not be 700. It's in that range.

Ok, I follow you that far. But 6,000-8,000 is less than half of your ~17,000 students scoring 1570+. (And where is that number from? Percentiles?) Almost all these schools super score, too, so if your 17,000 is not super-scored, then the real pool is quite a bit larger. And even assuming the pool is only 17,000, the conclusion would still be that the majority of 1570+ students DO NOT attend T20 private schools.

And I’d want to see some numbers on how many high-scoring kids are at small LACs or merit-granting privates as opposed to large state schools. Schools like Williams and Grinnell are small, and so far as I know all are test optional. Yet you have them enrolling more than twice as many high-scoring kids as large, test-required state schools like Purdue and Georgia. Why?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

They are test blind. But many high scorers attend these schools happily.

The point is, the number of 1570+ at T20 (other than UCs) can be estimated because the 75 percentile line is typically 1570.

But (at least in recent years) they’re mostly test optional, so the number of kids scoring 1570+ is only 25% of kids submitting scores, or less than 25% of the student body. Eg at Vanderbilt (#18), half of all students were TO, so even though the 75th percentile score is 1560, that only represents 1/8th of the student body. The cutoff for the top 25% of the class would be the median reported score, which was 1540. If you assume that 25% of students at Vandy scored 1570+, you’d be dramatically overstating the number of seats at Vandy available for high-scoring students.

UCs are test blind, not TO. They won't even look at your SAT even if you submit, and I think there's no place to submit it -- someone correct me if I'm wrong about this part.

You’re correct that UCs are test blind. But even a test-blind school can enroll a lot of high-scoring students if it has a strong reputation, selects based on factors correlated with SAT score (all UCs use GPA; UCLA and UCB use AP scores), and offers most of them (ie, in-state students) a good price.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Most high-scoring kids wind up at the major flagships (Michigan, Georgia, Purdue, Rutgers, etc.). There just aren’t that many seats at the elite privates, and many of them are reserved for wealthy/connected/athletic students.

There are only ~17,000 1570+ students per year.

T20 75 percentile cutoff line typically at 1570. 25% of T20 admits have 1570+.

~7000 1570+ go to T20.
~4000 1570+ other top private, SLACs, Stern, Ross, Georgetown, USC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to flagships, Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan, Georgia Tech, UNC, etc.
~3000 1570+ to merit (full or half tuition), Case Western, Grinell, Rochester, etc.

You know that UCLA and Berkeley are actually top 20s, right?

They are test blind. But many high scorers attend these schools happily.

The point is, the number of 1570+ at T20 (other than UCs) can be estimated because the 75 percentile line is typically 1570.

But (at least in recent years) they’re mostly test optional, so the number of kids scoring 1570+ is only 25% of kids submitting scores, or less than 25% of the student body. Eg at Vanderbilt (#18), half of all students were TO, so even though the 75th percentile score is 1560, that only represents 1/8th of the student body. The cutoff for the top 25% of the class would be the median reported score, which was 1540. If you assume that 25% of students at Vandy scored 1570+, you’d be dramatically overstating the number of seats at Vandy available for high-scoring students.

UCs are test blind, not TO. They won't even look at your SAT even if you submit, and I think there's no place to submit it -- someone correct me if I'm wrong about this part.

Rice and Princeton, 70, 80% + submit scores.