Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The poorest US state (Mississippi) will soon surpass the richest EU country (Germany) in GDP per capita. All other US states are ahead:

https://www.euronews.com/business/2025/01/03/the-poorest-us-state-rivals-germany-gdp-per-capita-in-the-us-and-europe

I've lived in Europe before. There's an old saying: The US is a great place to be rich, and an awful place to be poor. Europe is a great place to be poor, and an awful place to be rich.

But that statistic doesn’t address inequality. What is the median wealth/income in both places? America has some extremely wealthy people that mask the huge number of people in poverty doing averages.

Having more than someone is not inequality. People who are lazy and less intelligent than I am do not get the economic benefits of being equal to me.

If you want equality where incompetent people are given the same wages as competent, then you should emigrate to a communist country.

You will also get a government that murders and imprisons people you do not approve of.

There is no pesky constitution to give people rights that might cause inequality.

DP. That's the very definition of inequality. However, it's best to keep in mind, "Each according to their need. Each according to their ability." If you are able to work, that's great, but that doesn't entitle you to anything. The needs of those unable to work are often greater!

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, the more we travel the more we can see how crappy the US has become. Huge and noticeable decline, and the US is far behind so many nations in so many ways. Roads/bridges and other infrastructure are falling part. Trash is often everywhere that the US looks more like a 3rd world country. So many junkies, strungout addicts and homeless everywhere that you simply don't see in countries like Australia, Japan, or South Korea. The worst public transportation. Horrifically exensive rail transit. Terrible performing schools. Terrible public safety and high crime due to all of the guns. Very bad and very expensive food. High rents and mssively overpriced housing. INSANELY overpriced internet and cellular services.

And the grand daddy of them all - Healthcare. What a freak show and a joke in the US.

Yes OP, the more we see of the world, the more we realize the American dream is a sham. The US is dystopian hellhole nightmare in so many ways and so far behind so many other first world countries in many ways. The US is increasingly a really crappy place to live.

1000% Well said. I couldn't agree with you more. We could be friends in real life too.

My friend moved to Ecuador because “cheap.”

She flies to the US every three months and brings three large empty suitcases with her to buy things in the US and bring back that are either not available in Ecuador or are too expensive in Ecuador.

There is no such thing as Amazon deliveries in Ecuador.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you live in the DC area. There are plenty of parts of the US that have a much lower cost of living. Albuquerque for example. Or Indianapolis.

but then you're living in Indianapolis.

Is it that bad? I have never been there so I don't know.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Before you get all excited about national healthcare check on waiting times for things.

Sorry, you're not scaring anyone, Fox News. US Healthcare is gutter trash bottom of the barrel trash that makes the entire country unliveable. Number of countries that wish they had a HC system like the US: 0.

+1 We see the horror stories and outliers but ignore the vast majority of times that it works smoothly and as it should in other countries, for much less $$ and insurance company middleman profit. I don't want to emigrate to have that. I want to have that here. We deserve that here for all our tax money. Also no guns.

+1 My ILs complain about the NHS, but then when you say, "Would it be better to have US healthcare system?", they all balk.

Tangent, but I have been watching some Korean crime drama movies, and in most cases, the fight scenes only involve knives, almost no guns. Such a difference.

Anonymous wrote:Before you get all excited about national healthcare check on waiting times for things.

I would pay for private care, which is still so much cheaper than here in the US, with insurance. The wait time for private care is not bad at all.

My SIL lives in the UK and had breast cancer, and some other health issues. She used NHS for most, but private for some things that she didn't want to wait for. Her COL is like $30K USD, no mortgage, and she lives in a city, though not London.

In the US, the cost of healthcare for my spouse and I will be about $30K per year because we are going to retire before 65. Medical costs for my SIL is almost 0. She retired before 65. She travels a lot with her friends and has a great life.

I'm trying to get my kids to think about moving to the UK at some point in their lives. But, if they don't, we might still move there because of medical costs here, at least until I'm 65.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Before you get all excited about national healthcare check on waiting times for things.

Sorry, you're not scaring anyone, Fox News. US Healthcare is gutter trash bottom of the barrel trash that makes the entire country unliveable. Number of countries that wish they had a HC system like the US: 0.

+1 We see the horror stories and outliers but ignore the vast majority of times that it works smoothly and as it should in other countries, for much less $$ and insurance company middleman profit. I don't want to emigrate to have that. I want to have that here. We deserve that here for all our tax money. Also no guns.

I know most people posting in favor of living outside the US are more upset at a certain administration than the actual realities of life in America. I have lived both in the US and in several countries overseas for many (many!) years so I have no rosy lens about life outside the US. I lived in the UK, Germany, Dubai and Singapore for a collective 15 years and another 10 years of adulthood in the US so I'm not ignorant to the pros and cons. Just don't fall into the trap of thinking the grass is greener on the other side of the fence. The UK, for example, has substantial problems with their overburdened national health system to the point that many regular people are paying cash for quick visits to doctors instead of having to wait months and even over a year for an appointment. Even countries with excellent healthcare like Switzerland still have waiting lists and believe it or not - I know people who moved back to the US after working in Switzerland for 10+ years because in retirement it was easier and quicker to rely on US healthcare than the rationed Swiss healthcare. The US healthcare system is a mess but on the flip side it is also extremely generous and proactive in ways most countries' systems are not. And people still often have private healthcare in many developed countries.

Culturally, mass migration has become a major tension point across all of Europe, in part of the burdens on the welfare state. Housing costs are very expensive in most of the major cities across Europe, the US is much more affordable. US also has a much better racial integration compared to the rest of the developed countries. There are some things European countries can do better, food is a bit cheaper, yes, transportation/housing tends to be more expensive and salaries are also lower, often substantially lower... so....

Good luck. The US is no longer subsidizing europes defense. They are about to get a taste of what we have been dealing with for the last 20 years with regards to defense spending.

Anonymous wrote:It seems like many Europeans cities have housing crises at the moment, with foreigners buying up lots of apartments in the cities. I guess small towns are easier, but it's not like most of Europe is making it super easy to move there.

I would also think seriously about the healthcare. I know it's cheaper, more accessible, but it's really not as good. My kid just had a simple MRSA infection and I was googling to get more info, and found tons of reddit threads from people in the UK asking for quick remedies because they couldn't get into see anyone for weeks. Healthcare isn't great here, but I think it's worse there. And query how the EU increased defense costs are going to impact that. I just would be reluctant to uproot my life here, where at least I'm a citizen, and move to a country where I'm always going to have some uncertainty about my status AND be far from family. (Clearly I don't have my immigrant grandparents' spirit!)

If I was going to do it, I think I'd pick Ireland, maybe something like Waterford County. It's not far from Dublin, shorter flight to US, fewer cultural barriers, and lots of cheap under utilized land.

I speak Spanish pretty well so could manage a spanish speaking country, but I think that Spain is pretty well sick of Brits and Americans moving there, and I feel like I'd either be in one of those tacky expat communities, or I'd always be "other." 30 years ago when I was backpacking through Mexico I met an American couple that ran a smoothie and breakfast place in Isla Mujeres -- that seemed like a totally great life, but that was before the island got built up by the big hotel chains. I don't know where I'd be willing to go now, between the cartel issues and all the development.

I've been to Isla twice in the last year. What "big hotel chains?"

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Before you get all excited about national healthcare check on waiting times for things.

Sorry, you're not scaring anyone, Fox News. US Healthcare is gutter trash bottom of the barrel trash that makes the entire country unliveable. Number of countries that wish they had a HC system like the US: 0.

+1 We see the horror stories and outliers but ignore the vast majority of times that it works smoothly and as it should in other countries, for much less $$ and insurance company middleman profit. I don't want to emigrate to have that. I want to have that here. We deserve that here for all our tax money. Also no guns.

Anonymous wrote:Before you get all excited about national healthcare check on waiting times for things.

Sorry, you're not scaring anyone, Fox News. US Healthcare is gutter trash bottom of the barrel trash that makes the entire country unliveable. Number of countries that wish they had a HC system like the US: 0.

Before you get all excited about national healthcare check on waiting times for things.

It seems like many Europeans cities have housing crises at the moment, with foreigners buying up lots of apartments in the cities. I guess small towns are easier, but it's not like most of Europe is making it super easy to move there.

I would also think seriously about the healthcare. I know it's cheaper, more accessible, but it's really not as good. My kid just had a simple MRSA infection and I was googling to get more info, and found tons of reddit threads from people in the UK asking for quick remedies because they couldn't get into see anyone for weeks. Healthcare isn't great here, but I think it's worse there. And query how the EU increased defense costs are going to impact that. I just would be reluctant to uproot my life here, where at least I'm a citizen, and move to a country where I'm always going to have some uncertainty about my status AND be far from family. (Clearly I don't have my immigrant grandparents' spirit!)

If I was going to do it, I think I'd pick Ireland, maybe something like Waterford County. It's not far from Dublin, shorter flight to US, fewer cultural barriers, and lots of cheap under utilized land.

I speak Spanish pretty well so could manage a spanish speaking country, but I think that Spain is pretty well sick of Brits and Americans moving there, and I feel like I'd either be in one of those tacky expat communities, or I'd always be "other." 30 years ago when I was backpacking through Mexico I met an American couple that ran a smoothie and breakfast place in Isla Mujeres -- that seemed like a totally great life, but that was before the island got built up by the big hotel chains. I don't know where I'd be willing to go now, between the cartel issues and all the development.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The poorest US state (Mississippi) will soon surpass the richest EU country (Germany) in GDP per capita. All other US states are ahead:

https://www.euronews.com/business/2025/01/03/the-poorest-us-state-rivals-germany-gdp-per-capita-in-the-us-and-europe

I've lived in Europe before. There's an old saying: The US is a great place to be rich, and an awful place to be poor. Europe is a great place to be poor, and an awful place to be rich.

But that statistic doesn’t address inequality. What is the median wealth/income in both places? America has some extremely wealthy people that mask the huge number of people in poverty doing averages.

Having more than someone is not inequality. People who are lazy and less intelligent than I am do not get the economic benefits of being equal to me.

If you want equality where incompetent people are given the same wages as competent, then you should emigrate to a communist country.

You will also get a government that murders and imprisons people you do not approve of.

There is no pesky constitution to give people rights that might cause inequality.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am hearing of people moving to Portugal. I can't manage to learn any other languages but English, and I'm jewish (and poor), but otherwise I'd leave the US too.

You need $500k invested for five yeras and competency in Portuguese.

If you're Jewish Israel will probably take you and give you a pension.

You do not need to be competent in Portuguese to move there, but you do need to take language classes when you are there.

My friend up and moved her entire family to Portugal a few years ago - two little kids and her aging parents. She did not speak a lick of Portuguese when they moved, but she is taking classes. Her kids go to a private school that teaches in English but they are bilingual.

I envy her. My kids are college/HS so we can't move now.